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sleepyWed 20-Sep-17 08:28 PM
Member since 24th Jul 2007
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#68951, "RE: Exactly"
Edited on Wed 20-Sep-17 08:33 PM

          

First a sidenote, and not to nitpick but I'm not a fan of hyperboles. You never died to a 4 man gank, and you didn't seem to die to 3 man ones in or near a city ever, at least from your PK Deaths. So saying "many many occasions" is incorrect, unless 8. is to be changed to "Tribunal eventually chases outside town and faces a 4 man gank down."

But back to the main point, I'd want to know what standard of evidence you are using when deciding if someone should be given a warrant. Given the typical talk for Tribunals has been don't warrant unless you are absolutely certain (and correct me if I'm wrong here!), then your standard is at the very least "beyond a reasonable doubt."

To use your example, gank group had already set up post on the outskirts in order to try and kill you, and the criminal came along and saw that they were there. The criminal then proceeds to take advantage of that situation. There was no "aiding" there. Unless you are going to warrant based on the fact that the group should have left at that moment and dispersed because to even be there was to "aid." At that point you're basically warranting people for having to take an action to leave an area that theyd have every legal right to be in, just because someone else enters. Which makes absolutely 0 sense to me.

I'll use an own personal example to show a different concept. Person P sees magistrate M fighting criminal C in Hamsah. M words to Galadon. M is now en route back Hamsah on eastern when P sees him. M then detours to go a diff route back to Hamsah. That's at least what P thinks. So P goes and stands right outside the southern gate of Hamsah to hope and catch him walking. Meanwhile, C walks up to the area after P does and stands next to him, thinking the same thing. M then gets attacked, and warrants P. Did P aid? Even though P has his own agenda, M is outside of town, and P got there first? It's quite possible they colluded. It's also just as likely they didn't. Would you warrant P? Let's say they are in the same cabal. Would you warrant P then, even if they never tacitly or explicitly agreed to anything?

My point being, you speak of intent, proximity, and frequency. those are all indeed important factors. But even with all three there, that does not necessarily mean you have met your burden. Even assuming a high success rate, that method will create cases of false flagging. But if you're fine with an X% of people becoming falsely flagged, eh, what can ya do.

  

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HOT TopicTrib Law for Murphy [View all] , Lhydia, Tue 12-Sep-17 05:22 AM
Reply Law vs. Man, Saagkri, 21-Sep-17 05:49 PM, #62
Reply RE: Law vs. Man, Jarmel, 25-Sep-17 10:48 PM, #70
Reply Trib Law and Consequences, Tac, 21-Sep-17 04:00 PM, #60
Reply That's my main issue with creative flagging, Kstatida, 21-Sep-17 04:08 PM, #61
Reply I think that's universally true. No one argues their m..., Tac, 22-Sep-17 11:32 AM, #65
Reply RE: Trib Law and Consequences, Jarmel, 25-Sep-17 10:55 PM, #71
     Reply Yeah that's what I do, Murphy, 26-Sep-17 01:09 AM, #72
     Reply RE: Yeah that's what I do, Kstatida, 26-Sep-17 02:26 AM, #73
     Reply RE: Trib Law and Consequences, Tac, 26-Sep-17 10:49 AM, #74
Reply Epic fail Murphy, Lhydia, 21-Sep-17 08:26 AM, #57
Reply RE: Epic fail Murphy, Kstatida, 21-Sep-17 08:59 AM, #58
Reply Good for you. Move along., Murphy, 21-Sep-17 09:51 AM, #59
Reply Not everything is free to be reinterpreted, Murphy, 18-Sep-17 08:18 AM, #1
     Reply RE: Not everything is free to be reinterpreted, Jarmel, 18-Sep-17 08:59 AM, #2
     Reply You're making no sense, please stay on topic., Murphy, 18-Sep-17 09:18 AM, #4
     Reply Was that before or after he left the game forever? n/t, Lhydia, 18-Sep-17 09:05 AM, #3
     Reply i feel like you know this, laxman, 18-Sep-17 11:16 PM, #5
          Reply Exactly, Murphy, 19-Sep-17 12:52 AM, #6
               Reply Any IMM care to weigh in here? (n/t), Current challenge (Anonymous), 19-Sep-17 02:22 PM, #7
               Reply Sure., Ishuli, 20-Sep-17 12:16 PM, #8
                    Reply Do you take into account, Kstatida, 20-Sep-17 12:58 PM, #9
                    Reply You're assuming, sleepy, 20-Sep-17 03:50 PM, #10
                    Reply As someone who was around at the time..., Lhydia, 20-Sep-17 03:52 PM, #12
                         Reply RE: As someone who was around at the time..., sleepy, 20-Sep-17 04:11 PM, #13
                              Reply I don't think CF's trib laws were written by lawyers, lasentia, 22-Sep-17 09:22 AM, #64
                    Reply RE: Do you take into account, Ishuli, 20-Sep-17 03:49 PM, #11
                         Reply Flagging someone who defends their cabal, Murphy, 20-Sep-17 04:33 PM, #14
                              Reply RE: Flagging someone who defends their cabal, Ishuli, 20-Sep-17 04:43 PM, #15
                                   Reply So being off-duty matters after all?, Murphy, 20-Sep-17 04:59 PM, #16
                                        Reply RE: So being off-duty matters after all?, Ishuli, 20-Sep-17 05:38 PM, #17
                                             Reply RE: So being off-duty matters after all?, Murphy, 20-Sep-17 08:02 PM, #21
                                                  Reply RE: So being off-duty matters after all?, Ishuli, 20-Sep-17 08:13 PM, #22
                                                       Reply What do you mean it doesn't specify jurisdiction?, Murphy, 20-Sep-17 08:52 PM, #26
                                                       Reply RE: What do you mean it doesn't specify jurisdiction?, Ishuli, 20-Sep-17 09:20 PM, #39
                                                            Reply Holy Molly!, Kstatida, 21-Sep-17 04:56 AM, #54
                                                       Reply RE: So being off-duty matters after all?, sleepy, 20-Sep-17 09:00 PM, #28
                                                       Reply RE: So being off-duty matters after all?, Ishuli, 20-Sep-17 09:17 PM, #35
                                                            Reply RE: So being off-duty matters after all?, sleepy, 20-Sep-17 09:34 PM, #42
                                                            Reply RE: So being off-duty matters after all?, Ishuli, 20-Sep-17 09:53 PM, #45
                                                            Reply Fellow 2L checking in!, Andrlos, 21-Sep-17 05:51 AM, #56
                                                                 Reply Three law students? You poor bastards :), lasentia, 22-Sep-17 08:56 AM, #63
                                                                 Reply RE: Fellow 2L checking in!, sleepy, 22-Sep-17 02:34 PM, #66
                                                                      Reply RE: Fellow 2L checking in!, Andrlos, 22-Sep-17 05:29 PM, #67
                                                                      Reply RE: Fellow 2L checking in!, sleepy, 22-Sep-17 10:38 PM, #68
                                                            Reply RE: So being off-duty matters after all?, Kstatida, 21-Sep-17 05:15 AM, #55
                                                       Reply RE: So being off-duty matters after all?, Jarmel, 20-Sep-17 09:04 PM, #30
                                                            Reply I mean..., sleepy, 20-Sep-17 09:15 PM, #33
                                                                 Reply RE: I mean..., Jarmel, 20-Sep-17 09:33 PM, #41
                                                                      Reply RE: I mean..., sleepy, 20-Sep-17 09:38 PM, #43
                                                                      Reply RE: I mean..., Jarmel, 21-Sep-17 12:38 AM, #50
                                                                      Reply My example was terrible Criminal A Criminal B, Jarmel, 21-Sep-17 12:43 AM, #51
                    Reply Tribunal library. Look for Precedents :-D, Quixotic, 20-Sep-17 07:00 PM, #19
               Reply RE: Exactly, Jarmel, 20-Sep-17 06:22 PM, #18
                    Reply 4b with some investigation can allow a flag. 8 doesn't, Murphy, 20-Sep-17 07:54 PM, #20
                    Reply RE: 4b with some investigation can allow a flag. 8 does..., Jarmel, 20-Sep-17 08:45 PM, #24
                         Reply Are you just deliberately misinterpreting my words?, Murphy, 20-Sep-17 09:05 PM, #31
                              Reply I simply quoted you first and questioned what was said, Jarmel, 20-Sep-17 09:18 PM, #36
                                   Reply See post #37., Murphy, 20-Sep-17 09:27 PM, #38
                                        Reply RE: See post #48., Jarmel, 21-Sep-17 12:54 AM, #52
                    Reply RE: Exactly, sleepy, 20-Sep-17 08:33 PM #23
                         Reply He argues that your intent doesn't matter, Murphy, 20-Sep-17 08:49 PM, #25
                         Reply Focus on my example first ..., Jarmel, 20-Sep-17 09:00 PM, #29
                         Reply RE: Exactly, Jarmel, 20-Sep-17 08:58 PM, #27
                         Reply RE: Exactly, sleepy, 20-Sep-17 09:16 PM, #32
                         Reply RE: Exactly, Jarmel, 20-Sep-17 09:16 PM, #34
                              Reply That doesn't really answer the Q, sleepy, 20-Sep-17 09:24 PM, #40
                                   Reply RE: That doesn't really answer the Q, Jarmel, 20-Sep-17 10:06 PM, #46
                         Reply That line in the sand cannot be drawn the way you draw ..., Murphy, 20-Sep-17 09:19 PM, #37
                              Reply RE: That line in the sand cannot be drawn the way you d..., Jarmel, 20-Sep-17 09:48 PM, #44
                                   Reply Here's what I imagined that can justify a flag:, Murphy, 20-Sep-17 10:31 PM, #47
                                        Reply I can see your point, Jarmel, 20-Sep-17 11:57 PM, #48
                                             Reply What if..., sleepy, 21-Sep-17 01:42 AM, #53
                                                  Reply RE: What if..., Jarmel, 25-Sep-17 10:36 PM, #69
                         Reply Ok I have got this now, Jarmel, 21-Sep-17 12:18 AM, #49
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