sleepy | Wed 20-Sep-17 03:44 PM |
Member since 24th Jul 2007
223 posts
| |
|
#68937, "You're assuming"
Edited on Wed 20-Sep-17 03:50 PM
|
that jurisdiction is set in stone as only protecting the cities. that's not technically what the helpfile states. The helpfile first states the "laws of the land" (hint, not laws of the cities). Second it says the cities are "protected by the jurisdiction" of the Spire. If you take the plain meaning of the language, that means that cities are protected, but that doesn't mean that the Spire's jurisdiction doesn't exceed that.
This argument is further supported by the fact that the laws themselves (except the important one that is in contention, rule #3) explicitly state the area in which these crimes must be committed (i.e. in a protected area, or in the Spire). The laws leave out, interestingly, any sort of explicit bounded area for rule #3. So one can argue that it was the intention of the initial framers of the laws that rule #3 is not bound to only protected areas. A pretty compelling argument, on the condition that you assume that the writers were smart.
An opposing argument is that you just assume the writers were careless, or you take a position of history. the first is that the writers had intended to mean everything, including the "protected by the jurisdiction" phrase to intend that the jurisdiction of the Spire was solely supposed to be the cities (which I guess I have to disagree with since you see rule #4 suddenly extend the jurisdiction of the Spire to the Spire itself. So that means that jurisdiction does, to whatever extent, go beyond just the cities.)
The second part is that in the past it has been the precedent that Rule #3 was interpreted as only being in cities, and that there should be no change.
The final position you can take is a policy argument. That it's just a dumb idea to suddenly implement a change when it could undermine the authority of the Spire and that it in fact will increase the number of attacks within cities, and cause discontent, especially when it's such a hard law to implement. This angering of the masses is clearly seen by posts where people vocally dislike this change of interpretation, and is only enjoyed by tribunals who enjoy mincing over what a word means while smoking a cigar and drinking a scotch rather than actual consequences of their decisions.
Personally, unless you decide that the writers had no idea of the consequences of the wording of the laws (which I think is true to some degree), there's compelling reasons to believe that rule #3 extends beyond city walls. I also think that the policy argument is just as compelling of an argument to not take up this interpretation.
|
|
|
Trib Law for Murphy
[View all] , Lhydia, Tue 12-Sep-17 05:22 AM
Law vs. Man,
Saagkri,
21-Sep-17 05:49 PM, #62
RE: Law vs. Man,
Jarmel,
25-Sep-17 10:48 PM, #70
Trib Law and Consequences,
Tac,
21-Sep-17 04:00 PM, #60
That's my main issue with creative flagging,
Kstatida,
21-Sep-17 04:08 PM, #61
I think that's universally true. No one argues their m...,
Tac,
22-Sep-17 11:32 AM, #65
RE: Trib Law and Consequences,
Jarmel,
25-Sep-17 10:55 PM, #71
Yeah that's what I do,
Murphy,
26-Sep-17 01:09 AM, #72
RE: Yeah that's what I do,
Kstatida,
26-Sep-17 02:26 AM, #73
RE: Trib Law and Consequences,
Tac,
26-Sep-17 10:49 AM, #74
Epic fail Murphy,
Lhydia,
21-Sep-17 08:26 AM, #57
RE: Epic fail Murphy,
Kstatida,
21-Sep-17 08:59 AM, #58
Good for you. Move along.,
Murphy,
21-Sep-17 09:51 AM, #59
Not everything is free to be reinterpreted,
Murphy,
18-Sep-17 08:18 AM, #1
RE: Not everything is free to be reinterpreted,
Jarmel,
18-Sep-17 08:59 AM, #2
You're making no sense, please stay on topic.,
Murphy,
18-Sep-17 09:18 AM, #4
Was that before or after he left the game forever? n/t,
Lhydia,
18-Sep-17 09:05 AM, #3
i feel like you know this,
laxman,
18-Sep-17 11:16 PM, #5
Exactly,
Murphy,
19-Sep-17 12:52 AM, #6
Any IMM care to weigh in here? (n/t),
Current challenge (Anonymous),
19-Sep-17 02:22 PM, #7
Sure.,
Ishuli,
20-Sep-17 12:16 PM, #8
Do you take into account,
Kstatida,
20-Sep-17 12:58 PM, #9
You're assuming,
sleepy,
20-Sep-17 03:50 PM #10
As someone who was around at the time...,
Lhydia,
20-Sep-17 03:52 PM, #12
RE: As someone who was around at the time...,
sleepy,
20-Sep-17 04:11 PM, #13
I don't think CF's trib laws were written by lawyers,
lasentia,
22-Sep-17 09:22 AM, #64
RE: Do you take into account,
Ishuli,
20-Sep-17 03:49 PM, #11
Flagging someone who defends their cabal,
Murphy,
20-Sep-17 04:33 PM, #14
RE: Flagging someone who defends their cabal,
Ishuli,
20-Sep-17 04:43 PM, #15
So being off-duty matters after all?,
Murphy,
20-Sep-17 04:59 PM, #16
RE: So being off-duty matters after all?,
Ishuli,
20-Sep-17 05:38 PM, #17
RE: So being off-duty matters after all?,
Murphy,
20-Sep-17 08:02 PM, #21
RE: So being off-duty matters after all?,
Ishuli,
20-Sep-17 08:13 PM, #22
What do you mean it doesn't specify jurisdiction?,
Murphy,
20-Sep-17 08:52 PM, #26
RE: What do you mean it doesn't specify jurisdiction?,
Ishuli,
20-Sep-17 09:20 PM, #39
Holy Molly!,
Kstatida,
21-Sep-17 04:56 AM, #54
RE: So being off-duty matters after all?,
sleepy,
20-Sep-17 09:00 PM, #28
RE: So being off-duty matters after all?,
Ishuli,
20-Sep-17 09:17 PM, #35
RE: So being off-duty matters after all?,
sleepy,
20-Sep-17 09:34 PM, #42
RE: So being off-duty matters after all?,
Ishuli,
20-Sep-17 09:53 PM, #45
Fellow 2L checking in!,
Andrlos,
21-Sep-17 05:51 AM, #56
Three law students? You poor bastards :),
lasentia,
22-Sep-17 08:56 AM, #63
RE: Fellow 2L checking in!,
sleepy,
22-Sep-17 02:34 PM, #66
RE: Fellow 2L checking in!,
Andrlos,
22-Sep-17 05:29 PM, #67
RE: Fellow 2L checking in!,
sleepy,
22-Sep-17 10:38 PM, #68
RE: So being off-duty matters after all?,
Kstatida,
21-Sep-17 05:15 AM, #55
RE: So being off-duty matters after all?,
Jarmel,
20-Sep-17 09:04 PM, #30
I mean...,
sleepy,
20-Sep-17 09:15 PM, #33
RE: I mean...,
Jarmel,
20-Sep-17 09:33 PM, #41
RE: I mean...,
sleepy,
20-Sep-17 09:38 PM, #43
RE: I mean...,
Jarmel,
21-Sep-17 12:38 AM, #50
My example was terrible Criminal A Criminal B,
Jarmel,
21-Sep-17 12:43 AM, #51
Tribunal library. Look for Precedents :-D,
Quixotic,
20-Sep-17 07:00 PM, #19
RE: Exactly,
Jarmel,
20-Sep-17 06:22 PM, #18
4b with some investigation can allow a flag. 8 doesn't,
Murphy,
20-Sep-17 07:54 PM, #20
RE: 4b with some investigation can allow a flag. 8 does...,
Jarmel,
20-Sep-17 08:45 PM, #24
Are you just deliberately misinterpreting my words?,
Murphy,
20-Sep-17 09:05 PM, #31
I simply quoted you first and questioned what was said,
Jarmel,
20-Sep-17 09:18 PM, #36
See post #37.,
Murphy,
20-Sep-17 09:27 PM, #38
RE: See post #48.,
Jarmel,
21-Sep-17 12:54 AM, #52
RE: Exactly,
sleepy,
20-Sep-17 08:33 PM, #23
He argues that your intent doesn't matter,
Murphy,
20-Sep-17 08:49 PM, #25
Focus on my example first ...,
Jarmel,
20-Sep-17 09:00 PM, #29
RE: Exactly,
Jarmel,
20-Sep-17 08:58 PM, #27
RE: Exactly,
sleepy,
20-Sep-17 09:16 PM, #32
RE: Exactly,
Jarmel,
20-Sep-17 09:16 PM, #34
That doesn't really answer the Q,
sleepy,
20-Sep-17 09:24 PM, #40
RE: That doesn't really answer the Q,
Jarmel,
20-Sep-17 10:06 PM, #46
That line in the sand cannot be drawn the way you draw ...,
Murphy,
20-Sep-17 09:19 PM, #37
RE: That line in the sand cannot be drawn the way you d...,
Jarmel,
20-Sep-17 09:48 PM, #44
Here's what I imagined that can justify a flag:,
Murphy,
20-Sep-17 10:31 PM, #47
I can see your point,
Jarmel,
20-Sep-17 11:57 PM, #48
What if...,
sleepy,
21-Sep-17 01:42 AM, #53
RE: What if...,
Jarmel,
25-Sep-17 10:36 PM, #69
Ok I have got this now,
Jarmel,
21-Sep-17 12:18 AM, #49
| |
|