>Were all improved last month, so I'm inclined to not tinker
>with them more yet.

As in how they were improved? I mean, would YOU now use them in high level PK...? (well, any level PK, but since we're talking about making them useful in the later ranks)

Actually now that I think about it, a rather simple improvement to elbow/knee (that would make at least me use them; though I still kind of prefer the automatic elbow/knee edge idea) would be to have them cause a minor malediction for a couple of hours in the high ranks, along these lines:

Say, from L30 upwards:
- randomly either -2str, or -2dex
- knee for 3hrs
- elbow for 2hrs (since it's weaker/quicker)
- can be stacked with each other (but not with itself, e.g. only one 'knee affect' at a time)
(- in fact, why not also a weaker -1str/-1dex affect before L30)

The randomness of the stat affect would be a sort of balancing factor, so when deciding to throw a quick elbow/knee in a fight you'd always have to roll the dice for the affect you might want (though it would be nice to have an echo about which one landed, e.g. "You weaken X with your elbow/knee strike"). Also if you think the stat affect should not be guaranteed to land on a hit, IMO it should at least have a (very) high probability of doing so.

(As an added bonus this would also make 'skilled brawler' edge useful, if it indeed is simply getting knee+elbow for only elbowing)