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Avilion | Thu 07-Aug-03 09:14 PM |
Member since 18th Jul 2003
25 posts
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#1918, "Complaint about Practicing"
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As someone who has deleted 4 mages 20-30+ in frustration, I don't think I'm wrong when I say that the practice code is screwing me over.
As a mage, I am not taking blows regularily. I do my best to take blows WHENEVER I can. At level 30, my latest creation had 76% shield block 75% parry. In the 20s, everytime I grouped I was taking the blows every chance possible. In the 30s, mobs were to strong for that.
In my various creations.. the only successfull way to do it was to stop at 16 and SPAM for days. (16 so I had hand to hand to help with parry).
This "forget about it and enjoy the game" mentallity is just plain wrong for non-tankers. Support classes are getting shafted. The learning curve at higher levels is not good enough. After level 20, there didn't seem to be any mobs which I use to effectively practice defenses (I've tried). After level 30, the situation is amplified.
After analyzing the situation, I blame the practice code for the frustration I've faced. I do not like the choices: spend multiple hours for a couple days maximizing defenses, or suck for the rest of your life.
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You have to consider.,
ATK,
08-Aug-03 08:01 AM, #7
It rewards the spammer -nt-,
Avilion,
08-Aug-03 02:59 PM, #13
You forgot to salient details,
Theerkla,
08-Aug-03 07:06 AM, #6
don't spoil a good whine with facts,
incognito,
08-Aug-03 11:47 AM, #10
don't bother with defenses as a mage,
incognito,
08-Aug-03 06:40 AM, #5
Since this is the most BS post,
Avilion,
08-Aug-03 11:35 AM, #8
wrong,
incognito,
08-Aug-03 11:45 AM, #9
Yea, I dunno what's wrong with me.,
Avilion,
09-Aug-03 02:07 PM, #14
I almost always hate to hear a new player leaving CF fo...,
Theerkla,
09-Aug-03 04:21 PM, #15
and regarding tactics...,
incognito,
08-Aug-03 11:53 AM, #11
Standard Reply #289,
nepenthe,
08-Aug-03 01:32 PM, #12
By design. Perhaps checkers? (n/t),
DwE,
07-Aug-03 11:24 PM, #4
RE: Complaint about Practicing,
Valguarnera,
07-Aug-03 10:51 PM, #3
RE: Complaint about Practicing,
Isildur,
07-Aug-03 10:47 PM, #2
RE: Complaint about Practicing,
fleshofchaos,
07-Aug-03 10:11 PM, #1
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Avilion | Fri 08-Aug-03 02:59 PM |
Member since 18th Jul 2003
25 posts
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#1934, "It rewards the spammer -nt-"
In response to Reply #7
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and hoses the full who expects things to work out normally.
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Theerkla | Fri 08-Aug-03 07:06 AM |
Member since 04th Mar 2003
1055 posts
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#1924, "You forgot to salient details"
In response to Reply #0
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First, and most importantly - every change the imm's consider putting in place is first analyzed to see if it will sufficiently piss you off, and perhaps end your whining forever. If the answer is no, that idea is tabled for other better ideas.
Secondly - changes to defenses requiring you to fight tougher mobs in order to improve went in some two or three years ago. Perhaps you should reread the post about the RECENT changes on the announcement board. The recent changes actually increase the odds of improving your defensive skills.
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incognito | Fri 08-Aug-03 11:47 AM |
Member since 04th Mar 2003
4495 posts
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#1931, "don't spoil a good whine with facts"
In response to Reply #6
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the fact that defenses have not been made harder in any respect should not be mentioned on this thread.
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incognito | Fri 08-Aug-03 06:40 AM |
Member since 04th Mar 2003
4495 posts
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#1923, "don't bother with defenses as a mage"
In response to Reply #0
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any fighting class character worth his salt will use a weapon you don't know anyway, meaning your parrying will be very poor even if you have it at 100%.
Mages are not about parry, dodge, and shield block really. They are more about avoiding being targeted or reducing the damage through spells.
You blame -something- for all of your problems. Look for a solution within the current framework. Since you were playing a conjie recently...
Gear for hp. Use reduce and enlarge potions to avoid being lagged. Avoid axe and mace specs. Don't spam. Now, when you get engaged by an enemy, you should be able to flee as soon as your servitors get involved, and after that you don't have to tank in most cases.
Also, you don't need to gear for damage like a warrior. You can gear for hp. You can use magic to haste yourself more easily than a warrior and protect yourself more easily with magical sources, since you can use them all whilst a warrior is restricted to potions.
At lvl 30 you haven't reached the peak of your power yet, and mages to tend to be on the defensive until upper ranks (though conjurers are different). Maybe you need to be attacking your enemies while they are already fighting something else, so a mob tanks for you.
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Avilion | Fri 08-Aug-03 11:35 AM |
Member since 18th Jul 2003
25 posts
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#1929, "Since this is the most BS post"
In response to Reply #5
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I'll respond to it. I've done mages where I spam up defenses at 16, and I've done mages where I don't.
The mages who spam up defenses at 16 can take a few rounds of hits against warriors.
The mages who do not spam defenses at 16 get raped.
The evidence is clear, non-tanking classes are obligated to spend days spamming up defenses early.
My guy had 600 hps at level 30. I went against an elf warrior 5 levels below me. I had a tier3 morosa demon, and a tier3 elemental. I preped (shield) (fly), and (stone skin). He had (haste). He didn't use my vuln against me. I lasted 4 rounds against him, my elemental couldn't hit him.. and the Morosa didn't attack.
The reason I died, is that parry was at 75%, and shield block was at 76%. I had 18 int, and I went out of my way to tank with the character.
I didn't spam, so I was ineffective. 'nuff said.
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incognito | Fri 08-Aug-03 11:45 AM |
Member since 04th Mar 2003
4495 posts
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#1930, "wrong"
In response to Reply #8
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The reason you died is...
HE HAD HASTE!
Also, what weapon did he use? Is it one you knew? If not, parry would likely be even more useless than it already is against a hasted character.
Shield block is not a great defense against many weapons. It too is virtually useless if the other guy is hasted and you are not.
The reason your elemental couldn't do much to him is...
HE HAD HASTE.
Conjies can haste their servitors, using preps bought in a shop. Had you done that it would have greatly improved your defense and also your attack. More than the shield and stoneskin (particularly as stoneskin can be bypassed frfom what I've seen, if using the right kind of weapons).
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Avilion | Sat 09-Aug-03 02:07 PM |
Member since 18th Jul 2003
25 posts
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#1935, "Yea, I dunno what's wrong with me."
In response to Reply #9
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Boosting my mana up over 700 with gear so that I can get tier3 servitors..
Using a shield prep, Using a fly prep,
Bringing up (by luck of the draw) a tier3 Morosa, and tier3 Earth elemental (special cuz I'm a svirfnebli)..
Attacking someone lower level then me.. (levels affect defense %)..
Boosting hps up +200 from gear..
If I would of had decent defenses, I would of rolled over him. I needed more time in combat.. which would happen if I had good defenses.
I just hate spamming, so I'm gonna go with my gut and give this game up.
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Theerkla | Sat 09-Aug-03 04:21 PM |
Member since 04th Mar 2003
1055 posts
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#1938, "I almost always hate to hear a new player leaving CF fo..."
In response to Reply #14
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The key word in that sentance is almost. Farethewell.
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incognito | Fri 08-Aug-03 11:53 AM |
Member since 04th Mar 2003
4495 posts
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#1932, "and regarding tactics..."
In response to Reply #8
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why not enlarge yourself, improving your chances of fleeing and letting your elemental take the blows.
why not shockwave/incinerate to start the fight so your elemental takes the blows?
Wrong elemental to do these things? Then change your tactics accordingly. (ie consider not fighting on his terms.)
You walked in on him? Perhaps you should have let him come to you.
Controlling lag is, in my opinion, a lot more important tactically than controlling damage, especially where survival is concerned.
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nepenthe | Fri 08-Aug-03 01:32 PM |
Member since 04th Mar 2003
3430 posts
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#1933, "Standard Reply #289"
In response to Reply #8
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>The evidence is clear, non-tanking classes are obligated to >spend >days spamming up defenses early.
You're welcome to draw whatever conclusions you like from your experiences, but don't expect us to take them seriously or change the game as a result if our mileage varies.
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DwE | Thu 07-Aug-03 11:24 PM |
Member since 04th Mar 2003
358 posts
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#1922, "By design. Perhaps checkers? (n/t)"
In response to Reply #0
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fleshofchaos | Thu 07-Aug-03 10:11 PM |
Member since 04th Mar 2003
133 posts
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#1919, "RE: Complaint about Practicing"
In response to Reply #0
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>As someone who has deleted 4 mages 20-30+ in frustration, >I don't think I'm wrong when I say that the practice code >is screwing me over.
Honestly? How so? Personaly, I have a mage and honestly, I (IC speaking) am about dumber than a box of rocks... hey, rocks are cool...
>As a mage, I am not taking blows regularily.
Oh thank god.
>I do my best to >take blows WHENEVER I can.
And you made it to 30+?
>At level 30, my latest creation >had 76% shield block 75% parry.
Really?... Mages, as far as I can see, are power hitters... They don't win battles, they make them shorter. If that makes sense.
> In the 20s, everytime I >grouped >I was taking the blows every chance possible.
Not many mages, probably short of certain shape-shifter forms, make good tanks, again, not what I think they were intended for.
In the 30s, >mobs >were to strong for that.
For mages, yes, gernerally they are. Bards on the other hand, I've found, are quiet good, not perfect, but good, at tanking... At least for a while, and I won't promise anything.
> >In my various creations.. the only successfull way to do it >was >to stop at 16 and SPAM for days.
As I said, my non-to-bright mage, who I think is doing excellent, is having no spam based problems. I don't spam, I refuse to, then again we each have our faults. *wink* Anyway, he is having no problem what so ever mastering each new (important that is) spell he achieves.
(16 so I had hand to hand >to >help with parry).
>
>**This "forget about it and enjoy the game" mentallity is just >plain >wrong for non-tankers.
I beg to differ. Role Playing... *taps his head* anywhere..
> Support classes are getting shafted. >The >learning curve at higher levels is not good enough.
See above... Every class is different and unique. Every class isn't for every person. There are the ones we like, and the ones we don't. From what I hear, things are balanced certain ways for a reason. Just look around, find what You like, and go with It.
> After >level 20, >there didn't seem to be any mobs which I use to effectively >practice >defenses (I've tried).
After level 30, the situation is >amplified. > >After analyzing the situation, I blame the practice code for >the >frustration I've faced.
...
I do not like the choices: spend >multiple >hours for a couple days maximizing defenses, or suck for the >rest >of your life. >
No, no, no... Ok, there is only one way is "suck for the rest of your life", in Carrionfields. And, to me, that is living a life that amounts to nothing. So you can't tank... then don't try. YOU, supposing there's a reason your not letting others tank, can command. If they don't know, tell them. Teach them the knowledge you know... and tanking, or not, you'll make a difference.
"Do not merely practice Art, but penetrate to the very heart of it. For only Art and Science elevate man to the Godhead." Ludwig Van Beethoven
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