Note: I wasn't saying these combos were "impossible" to rank and completely worthless to any group. Just that within the sliding scale of "easy/hard" they're on the "hard" side.

>Those claws and horns they get mean they can be decent enough
>now. Especially if they stocked up on wands when not
>ranking.

Better than before; still not good. Any supply of wands will likely run out during the first 1 or 2 passes.

>I agree lowbie conjies are pretty bad in this respect. Still,
>they can use axes, and that helps a bit.

True. And magic missile isn't bad damage for the mana cost.

>I disagree here. I played a cloud druid (briefly) to about
>the mid 20s (whereupon I deleted as I never saw Oblain and
>needed to get into tribs to progress my faith). If anyone
>remembers he's the one that was going to be a trib. He was
>able to fill any role in his group well, from tanking (even
>before defenses) to damage.

Hmm. Maybe restrict it to higher levels then. My ranking experience with druids mainly consisted of them doing poor damage (few sunrays and fireseeds) and healing me, the tank. They usually ran out of mana pretty quickly. The classes I would have preferred less than the druid to in that situation are: assassin (I was one), necro, shaman, non-offense/defense shifter and thief. Maybe ranger, but only if the third couldn't heal.

>Giant shamans are great tanks. Also, they do (or at least
>did) ok against silver spirits.

Ok, ok. Mine was duergar, and I wasn't satisfied. A giant shaman w/ someone to help w/ mana regen would do okay. But then you're stuck looking for someone who can help w/ mana regen.

>Necros are excellent groupmates now that evils can rank on
>evils, although not wonderful at lower levels (though I still
>don't mind them).

Was there a change in how xp is calculated for evil vs. evil? If not, then its hard to believe ranking on evils is actually worthwhile (compared to ranking on goods). It's always been possible, just not terribly efficient.

I will say this, though -- Black Sect powers are the bomb for ranking. I recall alternating fights with a fire anti-paladin once, and I was a tanky class. We hardly needed to rest.