>1. How badly are the sleep spell (and others) nerfed for dumb
>races? Or conversely how greatly are they juiced for smart
>races? If I go fire giant will my sleep spell totally suck?

It's a sliding scale, affecting mostly the save but potentially the duration a tiny bit (e.g. probably not more than 1 tick difference). Being a d-elf a-p is almost like having spellcraft for sleep, except instead of everyone being half a dozen levels down on you like when you're a human necromancer, it's the other way around.

By the time you get to fire giant dumb, the save is about as easy as any save against something from someone in your PK could be. That said, I've still killed a lot of people with sleep as a fire a-p. Sometimes people dump their saves for other stats, and sometimes you just get lucky.

>2. Vessel of the Pit Fiends. What does this do? Bloodlust
>just gets "better" (how?) the more unholy controls you have?

The stat mobs on the spell get marginally better with each control. By the time you have a full set of controls it's a nice little bonus in my opinion.

>3. Demonskin. The helpfile for this says that you become
>resistant to blessed weapons if you're not already resistant
>to that weapon's attack type. If I took both Demonskin and
>Unrepentant Sinner would the limited resistance from
>Unrepentant Sinner nerf Demonskin for positive damage from a
>blessed weapon?

That statement only relates to resistance in your traditional immune/resistant/normal/vulnerable to a damage type sense.

>4. What are the pros/cons to each physical method of starting
>combat on a slept person? Vault, cleave, faceslash...etc.
>I've heard vault has a chance to guarantee next command for
>the attacker. Is that true? But faceslash has a chance to
>lag too, right? Plus they both cause bleeding? Is vault
>bleeding just way better than faceslash bleeding?

Vault, IIRC, is trip lag. It's a hell of an opener and would almost always be my preferred choice, except in the sense that it requires getting a spear into your hands in time and, depending on what you're doing with it and how much of a gambler you are with irongrip and losing unholies, potentially keeping a spear in your hands for a time.

It's a hell of an opener against awake targets, too, but that's a little riskier.

Vault bleeding is generally way better than faceslash bleeding. It's also guaranteed (again, if I remember correctly) lag if it hits, whereas faceslash only has a chance, and I wouldn't call it a great chance.

That being said, dual wield is a wonderful thing if you're not a felar, and I've been on both sides of lucky kills that otherwise wouldn't have been possible when faceslash decides to do its thing.

>5. How heavily influenced are the physical skills by str/dex?

Depends on the skill. Most care a fair bit about their relevant stat(s), probably on the order of what you expect from a statbound warrior skill like flurry or jab. Some care about size, with crippling strike caring the most.

>Would lashes be more or less useless on a fire giant?

I wouldn't say useless, but it wouldn't be my first choice in most situations and I wouldn't probably UB a whip just to use it as a fire.

>6. At what point does iron grip become undispellable? Or does
>that come from an edge? I didn't see any in the AP edges list
>that gave that effect.

It's the first control, if a control-that's-not-a-control.

It beats dispel magic / dispel and similar skills; however, note that there are still things that aren't dispel that can get rid of your irongrip affect, the most obvious being Force of Will.

Can Faceslash and Vault bleeding stack?

Without looking, I think no.

Now that felar can use their claws to faceslash, would they still need "merciless ambidexterity" if they wanted to get max use of the skill whilest using a spear/polearm?

Basically asking if claws are treated like daggers in that main-hand is more effective than offhand.

Thanks!

Vault lag is better than trip, you are guaranteed one command after vault.

You do realize you're talking to the person who wrote that skill, right? (And has played a lot of A-Ps who have used it, for that matter.)

The amount of stuff I've heard that just isn't true, but is widely believed...

I dunno what you wrote and don't care. I had 120 kills with Hildara and 80% of them were achieved by using vault. You always get that hot trip or other command before they flee.

You claiming that no one EVER escaped before you got the trip in? Because I've had many people flee before I could enter a command, and I've probably had more than 120 kills with an unholy spear, bearing in mind how many different ap's I've used a spear with.

If I'm slept, and I'm not in a locked room, you can bet that I'll be having my wimpy at 50% unless I have some edge/flaw to prevent that. Has saved my ass a bunch of times.

Always shoot first and then call whatever you hit the target.

nt

So here we have real experience vs. the person who coded it.

Can we have a neutral third party verify who is right?

It's not guaranteed to get you the next attack. I have a huge amount of experience with vault.

Maybe it's never failed for someone else, but the fact that it HAS failed for me proves it isn't guaranteed to land the next attack. And it's failed numerous times.

As Thuorn, I do recall running around with like -80/-90 svs (sometimes even 100+, but I just happened to not run into anyone with sleep at the time) and still get slept on first try. If that's followed by worldbind, you're just pretty much screwed from the get go.

Well, anyone can get slept on the first try. In fact, saves you make with additional attempts get easier, not harder.

That being said, int/wis does exert an effect on saves and that effect tends to feel more pronounced as your saves get really good. Made up numbers: let's say a gnome with max stats has 10% more chance to make his saves than a fire giant with max stats. Assume they always both carry the same amount of -save. When they have enough -save that the the fire giant makes his saves 50% of the time, the gnome's making his 60% of the time, which doesn't feel all that different. Suppose instead the fire's carrying enough to make his saves 80% of the time; now the gnome's clearing his 90% of the time and failing half as many saves. Now his mental stats feel like they mean a lot more, even if it's a static bonus.

Would have to wear, say, -80svs to have the same protection as a gnome wearing -60svs?

>1. How badly are the sleep spell (and others) nerfed for dumb
>races? Or conversely how greatly are they juiced for smart
>races? If I go fire giant will my sleep spell totally suck?
>

It will still be worth using, because most people don't take steps to handle getting slept, but I do find it works better for drow than fire giant.

>2. Vessel of the Pit Fiends. What does this do? Bloodlust
>just gets "better" (how?) the more unholy controls you have?
>
>3. Demonskin. The helpfile for this says that you become
>resistant to blessed weapons if you're not already resistant
>to that weapon's attack type. If I took both Demonskin and
>Unrepentant Sinner would the limited resistance from
>Unrepentant Sinner nerf Demonskin for positive damage from a
>blessed weapon?
>

I seem to recall I benefitted from both, when I had both.

>4. What are the pros/cons to each physical method of starting
>combat on a slept person? Vault, cleave, faceslash...etc.

Vault does damaging bleeding guaranteed. Generally if you've got someone poisoned, plagued (especially if you gave them plague malison), then a vault's bleeding as well will finish them even if they escape, unless they have some way to heal themselves or get to a healer.

Vault lags like trip in my experience, on a drow. I'm not convinced it guarantees the next active command. In my experience, it's like trip. Vault also does a maladict to strength, so sometimes it'll make the victim drop his weapon even if you ran out of mana before that happened. You do need, if I remember correctly, maybe 20 mana for vault? I might be confusing this aspect with charge of the morosa which needs 20 - 80, depending on how long you charge up prior to charging.

Vault has an advantage in that you can't be struck when you are in the air. So if someone runs in who can't wake your victim, you might well want to vault. Sometimes they get confused by being unable to attack you when you're in the air and don't try again after you've landed on your victim.

>I've heard vault has a chance to guarantee next command for
>the attacker. Is that true? But faceslash has a chance to
>lag too, right?

Faceslash tends to lag when it opens combat. The bleeding is less damaging than vault, but lasts longer. It also does -dex, which is nice against bards, for example. An advantage over vault is that it allows dual wielding even if you are not a felar. Personally I prefer vault.

Plus they both cause bleeding? Is vault
>bleeding just way better than faceslash bleeding?
>
>5. How heavily influenced are the physical skills by str/dex?
>Would lashes be more or less useless on a fire giant?
>

High dex helps lashes. I have a sneaking suspicion that the edge for lashes of the slave might require a certain amount of dex too, but I've not tested that.

>6. At what point does iron grip become undispellable? Or does
>that come from an edge? I didn't see any in the AP edges list
>that gave that effect.

15 is what you're thinking of, but the watcher can still dispel it. So be careful.

nt

Not sure why I said dex. I certainly meant charisma.

Faceslash rocks when the bard has a pocket healer, because he still can't do much to you once you've landed it.

I only knew some of these off the top of my head and I forgot to look up the rest last night. Maybe tonight will be your lucky night.

I have the Lucky edge IRL so I'm hopeful.

http://www.carrionfields.net/CFwiki/AntiPaladin
http://diku.qhcf.net/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?APEdgeHelpfiles (probably not 100% right)

1. Pretty bad as a giant. It's generally a "spellcraft" type of effect.
2. Never took it.
3. That'd be a Nep question
4. Read the FAQ...Vault is impale lag, Faceslash is like poison damage (aka annoying at best). Faceslash can lag but it doesn't work all the time. Vault will always lag, but sometimes it'll guarantee the next command.
5. Lots and yeah, it'll suck.
6. Iron grip becomes undispellable after 15 charges.

i can answer few of the questions. correct me if im wrong here.

spell for dumb races are alright, i dont know what it takes for a sleep spell to succed, expect % and victem vs spell.

Vault are only good if you have them slept, though if you fail you can hurt yourself badly, there are en edge to avoid this. Cleave to alot of damage, but lags yourself so the enemie can flee, very good in closed room, or if you have a alley to bash.
Yes, vault let you have the next command.

Faceslash can lag to, but its more like a trip lag. remember there are wands you can open fights with. (that lags to)

Lashes works best for high dex races.

when you get your first unholy control, i think its after 15 souls.