1) Make the look command only show the description of a player.

2) Make a secondary command that lets you look at a player's gear but have an associated lag with it.

3) Let rogues have peek work for both worn and inventory gear.

4) Make summoned mobs return to where they are supposed to be after a set amount of time.

5) Let players purchase out of level gear at a cost of:(gear level)*(cost of item). So a level 51 item that normally costs 10000cp would cost: 51*(10000cp)=510000cp way out of range for a low level character.

These changes would help alleviate the quick look and kill for gear ploy some seem to embrace. Also it would help having gear more readily available to lower levels, especially to new players. It sucks when someone tells you to go find mob X at location Y for a specific item suited to your race/class and the mob is MIA.

Other ideas:

1) Hometowns should all have at least one easily navigatable road that accesses them.

2) Some major hometowns should have a few guards, no higher than level 30, that assist the one attacked during PK.(Galadon should have about four that wander randomly and have nofollow built in to them)

3) Aggro mobs moved too close to a hometown should be removed promptly so some poor new player does not get ganked for no real reason.

These would help to make a new player feel a bit more comfortable exploring and trying to survive. There is enough opportunity to PK outside of the major cities without having absolutely no where to hide. And with just a sprinkling of assisting guards would not hinder in city PK all that much, if at all, for a skilled veteran player.

>1) Make the look command only show the description of a
>player.
>
>2) Make a secondary command that lets you look at a player's
>gear but have an associated lag with it.

Why would looking at someone's armor lag you?

>
>3) Let rogues have peek work for both worn and inventory
>gear.
>
>4) Make summoned mobs return to where they are supposed to be
>after a set amount of time.

This I could somewhat understand.

>
>5) Let players purchase out of level gear at a cost of gear
>level)*(cost of item). So a level 51 item that normally costs
>10000cp would cost: 51*(10000cp)=510000cp way out of range for
>a low level character.

I don't like this idea, doesn't add much to anyone. You should be trying to level, anything that takes away incentive to level I'm against. There's already plenty of reasons you might want to hang out at rank 40 for instance despite not being able to buy a certain level 45 staff.

>
>These changes would help alleviate the quick look and kill for
>gear ploy some seem to embrace.

Evil alignment exists in the game for a reason. Though honestly, I'd like to see some hammering done on neutrals who kill anyone with decent gear. Greed seems more of an evil concept than neutral.

>Also it would help having gear
>more readily available to lower levels, especially to new
>players.

How exactly would it do that? If anything, I'd just kill first, examine corpse later.

>It sucks when someone tells you to go find mob X at
>location Y for a specific item suited to your race/class and
>the mob is MIA.

Why is that so horrid? Any high level mobs with good gear usually can't be summoned anyway. This is a very minor thing to complain about.

>
>Other ideas:
>
>1) Hometowns should all have at least one easily navigatable
>road that accesses them.

They all do except wooded ones which are supposed to be well, wooded. Seantryn included, you can get to the water without going through the forest north of it.

>
>2) Some major hometowns should have a few guards, no higher
>than level 30, that assist the one attacked during PK.(Galadon
>should have about four that wander randomly and have nofollow
>built in to them)

Tribunal is enough. Being in town should not equal immune to being killed. If this is an issue for you go to the inn, inn is too empty these days as it is.

>
>3) Aggro mobs moved too close to a hometown should be removed
>promptly so some poor new player does not get ganked for no
>real reason.

I somewhat agree, but dying in and of itself is a learning experience. People who think you shouldn't die in Carrion Fields need to get better vocabulary skills.

>
>These would help to make a new player feel a bit more
>comfortable exploring and trying to survive. There is enough
>opportunity to PK outside of the major cities without having
>absolutely no where to hide. And with just a sprinkling of
>assisting guards would not hinder in city PK all that much, if
>at all, for a skilled veteran player.

Being wanted, having elite guards, having Tribunals assist is hindering enough. You shouldn't feel completely safe to explore. What fun would there be if you never had a bump along the way?

Evil alignment exists in the game for a reason. Though honestly, I'd like to see some hammering done on neutrals who kill anyone with decent gear. Greed seems more of an evil concept than neutral.

I figure this is as good a point as any to remind people that we don't interpret a "neutral" moral alignment as "I alternate between good and evil, depending on groupmate availability, and mimic whatever alignment I'm with." or "I kill anyone, regardless of alignment." (Then what do evil people do?) Neutral is neither good nor evil, avoiding the far extremes of either.

FWIW, we have been cracking down a bit on this. A couple murderbot neutrals were briefly ensaddened, but we're OK with that.

valguarnera@carrionfields.com

If you are recalling into the wilds, it just doesn't make sense to have a big old road running right up to your recall point.

Other than the wilderness based hometowns, Arial City is probably the recall point I can think of that takes time to learn how to navigate to a major road.

Since arials assassins are often recommended for newbies, maybe a north road extension up to arial city is called for?

I could swear we removed Arial City from the list of possible starting hometowns. If not, expect that change in the near future-- it's terrible in terms of shops, access, and low-level ranking, and the descriptions are outdated.

The other towns which have access issues are the ones on the far continents- Seantryn and Arkham. Building a road can't be done for obvious reasons, but we might look into a disclaimer for newer players.

valguarnera@carrionfields.com

Why not make a "ship" ride available for levels 1 to 9 for players starting from Arkham and Seantryn Modan? For a couple of coppers they can choose one of the three port cities as a destination. This would make exploring the world a heck of a lot easier.

Are you new to the realm of CarrionFields or to mudding in general?

y

Checked new to CF and got the following Elven starting hometowns:

Where were you born?
aladon, Hamsah Mu'taz, Voalian City, arsylon, ryn Galen

Eryn and Darsylon both suck for movement as a newbie. Voralian is annoying with Bramblefield road not have the exits properly listed in the descriptions: ie at the end of the room desc.

Maybe have a carriage ride from either of those? Or at least flag them?

Evil Arial options when you check yes as new to CF:

Where were you born?
aladon, Hamsah Mu'taz, dgaard, eantryn Modan

Again Udgaard is a pain but you have blocked Arial city.

>Why not make a "ship" ride available for levels 1 to 9 for
>players starting from Arkham and Seantryn Modan? For a couple
>of coppers they can choose one of the three port cities as a
>destination. This would make exploring the world a heck of a
>lot easier.

As it happens, I have an area project on my (very long) to-do list that would involve something along these lines. Of course, since it's me, it will be much more obnoxiously complicated than what you describe.

It's a worthwhile idea, but it's not my #1 priority just yet.

Hard to tell because it is struck out text when I read it, but if you did, didn't you notice that North Road runs right up to the gates? I'd have to say this the second most major road in Thera.

>1) Make the look command only show the description of a
>player.

Can use "examine". You only get their desc and they don't notice you looking at them. Afaik.

I think his idea was to prevent other players from seeing what gear you have in general, at least without taking lag. (Standing in front of another person and lagging yourself is not a desirable substitute. Only stealth classes would reasonably use this.)

That won't happen, largely because:

1) I'm looking at you and can't tell if you're wearing a helmet?

2) It's important to know what an opponent is capable of during a fight. Weapons are the obvious thing here, but other elements of their armor might cause you to adjust your tactics. I don't see a reason to force players to fight "blind" to that information.

3) If some enemy is really killing for gear, it's counterproductive for a new player to have their gear invisible. Instead of them looking and saying "He has nothing much I want.", they'll say "I'm not sure what he has. Better check the corpse."

valguarnera@carrionfields.com

That won't happen, largely because:

1) I'm looking at you and can't tell if you're wearing a helmet?

2) It's important to know what an opponent is capable of during a fight. Weapons are the obvious thing here, but other elements of their armor might cause you to adjust your tactics. I don't see a reason to force players to fight "blind" to that information.

3) If some enemy is really killing for gear, it's counterproductive for a new player to have their gear invisible. Instead of them looking and saying "He has nothing much I want.", they'll say "I'm not sure what he has. Better check the corpse."

I think that most of the time you would not being wearing your armor simply because you would be a walking ringworm museum. So CF compensates by ignoring all the issues of putting on your armor before battle by letting you wear it without penalty all the time.

I do not think it is AS important to know what your enemy is using before the fight because people tend to PK as soon as the opportunity arises if they are in the mood. Most of the time weapons would be sheathed. If you are so supportive of this idea, why not list all the weapons a player bears out containers since they would be obviously sheathed on their person?

Killing for gear happens all the time. I have seen it a fair bit recently with a player yacking then looking at me and WHAM attacked. Most PKers are going to kill regardless of gear because they are PK focused. The random gear based PKers tend to want to scope out their victim therefore having them pay for spending a moment to assess ALL someone is wearing would be appropriate.

Anyone thinking it takes no time to look from boots to rings, neckware and all the rest is fooling themselves. Muds just simplify the looking/peeking process for ease of application.

So I post a bunch of newbie friendly ideas and they get stomped. Same old, same old. Instead stomping why not post MORE helpful ideas?

Current PB is more interested in status quo and that is not a good idea in my mind. They are the veterans who have influence and insight, they should be posting more constructive ideas to bring in new players. Sad really, just sad.

>So I post a bunch of newbie friendly ideas and they get
>stomped. Same old, same old.

The problem here, really, is that your ideas aren't really newbie friendly.

If I'm an experienced player playing a character who is looking to kill for gear (and not a stealth class), and looking at your gear lags me, I'm not going to look at your gear. I'll kill you, and then I'll take a look at what's in your corpse.

If you think having someone look at you, decide they need a piece of your gear and kill you is unfriendly, you should try just having them all kill you on for size.

I'm sure you'll take this as me stomping on your idea, but it's more the reality of what would actually happen if your change was implemented rather than what you would like to happen if your change was implemented stomping on your idea.

So I post a bunch of newbie friendly ideas and they get stomped. Same old, same old.

The ideas you posted about looking at armor aren't going to be implemented. I can do a few things here:

X Tell you this, and give you reasons.
_ Blow smoke up your ass and tell you we think it's wonderful without committing to doing it.
_ Lie and say we're going to get right on it, then don't.
_ Ignore your post, and go rummage for snacks.
_ Post to make fun of you.

We're not going to implement ideas we don't think will improve the game. I think the most professional and useful response you can ask for is to be told that, and why.

Same old, same old. Instead stomping why not post MORE helpful ideas?

Current PB is more interested in status quo and that is not a good idea in my mind. They are the veterans who have influence and insight, they should be posting more constructive ideas to bring in new players. Sad really, just sad.

1) Most ideas are bad. As Nepenthe points out elsewhere, he's been here forever as a player and staff member, and has established himself as a reputable RPer and PKer. He should know what works and what doesn't about as well as anyone. And yet, 90% of his ideas get thrown in the wood chipper. (As do mine, for that matter.)

2) You're dealing with a highly evolved game. It's been around for 11+ years, and that means we've discussed, tried, and occasionally repealed a large range of ideas. That experience is valuable.

As an analogy, imagine walking into a major league baseball dugout and talking to the manager. If I got that chance, I'd probably ask a lot of questions and see what they think. If I started proposing radical ideas ("You should be bunting at least once per inning."), and the manager explained to me why they don't use those ideas, I'd probably be inclined to believe him.

Does that mean the manager is stomping on me? No. Does it mean that the manager is perfect? No. Do I have grounds to accuse him and all the other managers of hugging the status quo and refusing to look at new angles? No. They looked at it (and baseball went through a time where they bunted way the hell too much), did some analysis, and decided against it. It's not a conspiracy to get you, or to crush new ideas.

I'd be concerned if the manager couldn't explain to me why bunting all the time is a bad plan, but that isn't what happened here. You've got both staff and players giving their opinions on your various posts, and they're reasonably consistent with one another, despite a trend towards the reverse (see other threads).

My advice to you:
- Accept that the majority of your ideas will not be practical.
- Don't sulk when this is pointed out.
- Use the constructive criticism you're given to refine future generations of ideas.
- Keep posting them.

valguarnera@carrionfields.com

"So I post a bunch of newbie friendly ideas and they get
stomped. Same old, same old. Instead stomping why not post
MORE helpful ideas?

Current PB is more interested in status quo and that is not a
good idea in my mind. They are the veterans who have influence
and insight, they should be posting more constructive ideas to
bring in new players. Sad really, just sad."

Ok so thus far I've tried to read your posts with an open mind
and patience.  It isn't working so well anymore, mostly
because you keep trying to take advantage of the "ignored
player" persona.  So here's some news for you as I see
it...

1)  In the scope of changing the game, it takes more than one
player to like an idea before it is considered ignored rather
than just a bad idea.  From what I can tell, largely nobody
thinks you have good ideas.  As a general rule I don't.  I
don't see a whole lot of people jumping in and saying
"Hey!  What a great idea this Psektos guy has!"

You don't have any license to claim the "you're not
taking player ideas seriously!" persecution.  You are one
voice, and one that I think many people here are hoping gets a
sore throat soon.

2) The reason I don't like your ideas is that I don't find
them to be even remotely newbie friendly.  Sure, some people
are bloodthirsty and will PK you on a whim.  In the case of
your suggested look revamp, wouldn't you rather be able to
look at the big mean duergar warrior and see he has
<wielded> a really huge axe named 'n00b Slayer' and
<dual wielded> a slightly less huge axe named 'Don't
flee my gang is waiting outside for you' ?  I'd certainly want
that information available without lagging myself before the
coming pincer.

3)  Valg provided a perfectly plausible and well-reasoned
reason why this was a bad idea.  Think for a moment if you
will that maybe he squashed the idea because it is genuinely
bad and he actually represents the interest of more players
than just yourself here.  Honestly, I don't think this
proposal would spare a single newbie a death.  If they're that
new, one round of lag to run whenever someone happens to look
at them isn't going to be enough.  It just breeds paranoia.

4)  I would hardly say that players support the status quo. 
There are plenty of ideas/questions/complaints from players
about CF currently, including the newbie friendly issue among
many others that range from important to absurd.  Suggesting
that something so basic and fundamental as the look command
needs a revamp falls under absurd to me.  Consider also if you
would that perhaps the reason no one is generating more
helpful ideas is because most people genuinely believe this
doesn't need to change be it for newbies or anything else.

--Nightshade