Im on my second character now after almost a ten year hiatus. I see cabal numbers long in and log out in huge groups at a time. I see cabal members log in only for defense and log out. I see cabal members log in only for the domino affect of more memebers.

We dont have 60-100 players online anymore, so why are there 8-15 cabal members online while all of the others are offline?

Multi-charring has been a longstanding pass since this game came out, at least when I started playing in 2000.

Right now, its gotten to the point of ridiculousness Im starting to regret coming back in the first place.

I dont recognize a single Imm, and the OOC violations, and fair weather play that just is allowed to go on baffles me. Back in the day the Imms would never have tolerated this.


Please crack down on people logging in to scout, or do just a quick task and log back onto another character, or this long time player recenlty returned will go back to playstation. This is BS.

To me, in the old days, it very much felt like a group of cliques, and no one was helpful. I do not buy the claims of coordination, but I do believe people avoid the big bads, but also, people have less time, and short logins always look odd.

But my short fort experience in 2009/10 was probably the worst character experience I've ever had. Elites hanging with elites, clearly planning where they'd be, using you only for eq runs or raids, and not giving a #### about you otherwise. I still see this in some players (we all know who they are), but its the exception now.

I can see with fewer players how it looks more fairweathery, but also, high-hours, active characters can single-handedly swing the pendulum (as you've seen first hand). Also, even with fewer imms, I've had more first hand immteractions with my 4 characters than I have with all my middling characters from the old days.

In short, I'm still here *because* of the current imms.

They do crack down. I lost a thief and orc because I stole a norem legendary polearm off a paladin which made him easier to kill on my orc with grapple. Though I still claim it was not planned and I just found myself benefiting from the circumstance.

I stick to single characters now. Other people don't but they run the risk of pushing the line too far.

I would like to see more cracking down on people who log in, see a pk or pks they don't want to participate with and then quit out. Unfortunately the more the imms crack down on this the more incentive people have to cheat with OOC sharing of the who list. It's very common for outlanders to log in same time each night and then not do so when there are a lot of enemies on for a change, so they either log in chameleon and quit or not log in by magical knowledge of the who.

I think the solution to this, is more imm exp for people who log in and take risks to deal with bad odds. So reward based, rather than punishment based. Outlander IMHO should have such merits before getting insects. Leader/insects should not be strictly due to conversations.

As for your comment in subthread about lack of looting.
The reason for this is the reduction in player base from the good ol days (I first played CF in 1995). When there was over 100 people on, you didn't mind getting full looted because there was a loot for you just around the corner, either by cabal mate helping or just random fight you sneak up and loot. CF is less bloody and so now a full loot generally means working your way back up from scratch.

Also people use grief looting as leverage to influence behaviour, the following reasons may activate grief looting,

1) You're a griefer thief
2) You grief loot them first
3) You send them a lot of abusive and/or ooc tells.
4) You summon zombies
5) You overly harass them and/or multikill them.
6) You have not died for a long time and quite strong with the gear
7) You have too much advantage over the opponent (Shapa only).
8) You take almost no risks, but still aggressive. So relentlessly hunt vulnerable people and then log off against strong people.

I came back to see if things changed and it has not. I have seen imm and characters clique up. I have seen new players isolated due to the lapse of enforcing rules. I stayed long as I could. I'm out.

My first character back, I believed I was seeing some serious fair weather play which isnt entirely against the rules. That being said the player base is a quarter of what I was used to be around if not less, so
it kind of made more sense after I made a quick post just to bitch.

Seems far more fewer imms now but after a few characters and a couple
different immteractions with a few of them... its not cliqued up at
all. The imms that mostly loved me are gone, the imms that mostly hated me, are gone. For the most part ive got a fresh start but I made some
serious waves back in the day and have had quite the hate/fan club going on.

What's been possible these days with purely focusing on RP instead of
straight Murder Druid PK Die Hard, I never thought was.

I've been rewarded quite well for things I really put effort into to
make real, in depth, and solid characters.

I also have gone out of my way to help new players, and with so many things new to me, Every Single IC interaction ive had about being obviously new, recalling areas that dont exist anymore, among other things everyone IC has been super helpful.

Hell, people barely even loot anymore and I remember when full looting was standard operating procedure for enemies.

Sorry you had a bad experience but some advice, expect less and judge less of other players. Challenge yourself and set the example.

This has gotten me a ton of cool stuff, gifts, awesome titles, etc.

The more you focus on what you "think" the other guy is doing, the less fun you are going to have, and that only cheats yourself.

Hope you come back, but with a different perspective. It's gonna make it more fun for you, and you're going to make it more fun for everyone else.

If I was rewarded alot, I would say all that too. Good for you. I know better.

Goes back to my last bit of advice, dont look at others with expectations, but set the example. If youre comparing your experiences
with what you think everyone else is doing you're going to be
dissappointed.

I was over 200hrs before my first path on my shaman. Never got a title, but did wrangle Nightreaver. No tattoos, no special abilities, no
title, but I got some other things I wont announce. Those are personal
rewards more so than public recognition.

If you're playing for rewards, you have the wrong idea. Rewards are given, that's the simple matter of it. Rewards are icing on the cake, but you have to bake your own cake!

You gotta be you ic and not worry about the other guy. That's what will
make you stand out, and even if you never get rewarded so to speak,
the rewards arent the point. Theyre just gold stickers.

Dude what are you talking about rewards? I'm lost completely. I don't care about rewards. I care more about people using ooc information to play their character. There is clearly a favor club, here.

But rewards... I don't know what you're even talking about.

gr

nt

Shifting between alts so that you're never the underdog isn't technically multi-charring, btw, so far as I understand the definition of multi-charring. Still crappy behavior, but not multi-charring.

I would add: don't assume that every player on the side with the advantage is selecting shifting between alts. I don't play alts, ever, and I have absolutely had characters where my side had a steep advantage for most of the character's life.

I have always found it best, if I am running multiple characters, to make sure they are at least partially if not diametrically opposed to each other in the factional power structure. That automatically reduces the temptation to use a different character to try to hunt an enemy for OOC reasons.

I personally would always rather play on the underdog side, so I'd say I'm more of a 'foul-weather' player. If I log on to 5 cabalmates cooling their heels guarding a few opposing items, I'm much more inclined to either go PvE or play something without so much crowded backup. Those numbers should be for advanced PvE (area explore) things or major cabalwar battles.

I'm a dirty ArPee Nurd, though, so Glory in Battle > Hawt Lewtz.

Part of this could also be that the majority of us that still play this game don't have those excess hours that we used to in our youth. So, playing for 45 min -2 hrs is about the limit at any given time.

This can certainly appear that there's far more fair-weather play than there really is because people aren't logging in a different char, they're simply logging in for what time they have then logging out and trying again when they have more time.

I was just going to post this same thing. I know I can login thinking I've got an hour or more zone out, but when you are a parent at home with people needing you, not a teen at home hiding from everyone, its much much harder. Very common for me to login, only to have to logout unexpectedly.

I used to do no alts because I had so little time, and would get so locked into a storyline (and plus can't remember and keep names/friends/interactions separate). Now I've found having a lower-level uncaballed alt to work on is a good way to get a fix when I may only have a few minutes.

This also happened back when you were playing regularly and you also complained about it then, don't knock the current IMM staff for something that happens now that has happened forever.

Goodies are on during morning/days, evil usually dominates night/late night.

Fair weather play happens. People are allowed to have fun playing what they want. I think they game would benefit from having a no alt rule for caballed players but apparently that would be a very slippery slope for enforcement and a huge headache for staff.

It def sucks to be on the opposite end of whats in power, but it also makes for more things to do.

Roll up something that can survive against bad odds if it bothers you too much, like an Outlander or thief/assassin/ranger.

There are a few of us who don't play alts and who play long hours, and yeah you end up noticing things. The imms catch people sometimes. There was a recent case where a player had two characters denied due to some alt character shenanigans. For the most part, if you notice anything too heinous, you need to report it because imms are not super active and don't have eyes on everything.

But then there's non-cheating level alt fairweather play, and it's not technically against the rules. Some people don't like playing against massive odds, so they log out. If they wait a short period before logging in an alt, it's not cheating. You can call it a lame way to play, and I'd kind of agree with you, but I also don't want to too harshly judge the way other people have fun. I want all of the players to have fun. And unfortunately, sometimes what they think is fun won't coincide with what I think is fun.

In the end, it is a free to play game with a small volunteer staff. It is the players who make the game what it is. I try to take a "be the change you want to see" approach. I don't like alts. I don't like murderbot characters. I like higher RP standards. So those are the things I focus on myself. I can't control what other people do. But I have noticed positive responses to my characters which I really do believe will, over time, cascade into changes in other's playstyles if they find enjoyment there.

Anyway, for what it is worth. Welcome back to CF.