Just thought a water-based race more adept in the water than storm-giants would be cool.

Few ideas...

Unable to naturally breathe air but perhaps has an 'inherent' ability they can activate that allows for short periods of breathing on the surface and instead of drowning like vice cversa, they get an 'asphyxiate' effect that lasts until they either use the ability again or get underwater.

This would allow for them to play above ground with an eye to their natural limitations while above ground.

Able to naturally camo while in water and see other camoed people in water.

Immune to water-based attacks. Or highly resistent at the least.

Ram (inherent) - a modification of bash that works underwater but instead of knocking a person down, this attack is based on creatures like dolphins who will ram themselves into a target. It stuns the person momentarily and can knock the wind out of someone who isn't naturally adapted to fighting underwater causing (if this can be done) the timer on whatever is allowing them to breathe underwater to be lowered each time this is successful (not every ram, just when the extra 'air knocked out of them' message goes through. Wouldn't work against storm giants or water forms obviously.

Class choices could be mariner ranger, shaman, or warrior (assuming they don't have their own class/race like goblins/orcs)

I would make them about the same size as a dwarf.

Who knows about stats but i'd think

str 20 (being underwater should make them strong)

dex (in water - 25) (on land - 18) Should take a hit on land to speed, etc. but be better than most underwater

char: 15 they are big ugly fish like things after all.

Wis: 20

Int: 18

Con: 20

I'd make this race like orcs/goblins as a combo race/class. Fitting them into current classes I think would take away from their uniqueness as well as requiring thought to how their water-based physiology works with classes based around operating on land.

In terms of the inherent 'air-breathing' ability I would require that it lasts roughly 100 hrs and then the 'asphyxiate' effect takes hold and the sahugain would then have to get back underwater before being able to call upon that inherent again. On top of this I'd have a reverse of the 'fear' thing that arials/dwarves/felar get while they are on land (once their 'air-breathing' inherent wears off) and they need to stay underwater for a few hours before venturing back onto land once they can make it underwater.

This would keep them tied a bit tighter to water by giving them a major ongoing penalty to being on land for extended periods. However I don't see it as SO bad seeing as many areas are not far from at least one underwater area or room and 100 hrs is plenty of time for quick exploration/gear gathering.

I agree with the other posters suggestion that they be able to see camo (underwater-only) but be unable to camo underwater except for possessing that ability as a skill only a specific division of the class/race has (like orc adaptations).

I agree to a lightning vuln as a good idea.

I think my 'Ram' idea is still a good one.

As a compromise to the idea of a 'flat' dex, I think they should have a flat 25 dex but while on land they get slapped with an effect that costs them -7 dex on land but this can be covered by equipment.


If I think of specific skills I'll write them up in a seperate part of this thread.

Waterblend - Certain sahugain have learned to 'blend' naturally with their aquatic background as long as they remain still. The use of this skill requires great concentration so it cannot be performed under situations of great stress or mental tiredness.

Basically its like the outlanders 'chameleon' but only underwater and with the further restriction that it costs mana to use and can only be used when the player is is in a 'calm' state (i.e. can't be called after recent fighting)

Sharkcall - Certain sahugain priests (or whatever) have a special afffinity with sharks due to their connection to 'the shark god' (or whatever) and can call in a shark to attack their enemies.

Bloodsense - Certain sahugain have taken on the abilities of sharks and can sense blood in the water from far away. Those who have this ability active can sense when and where a fight is taking place on water as long as their is a continous water connection between them and where the fight is taking place. When mastered they can even tell who is fighting. The further the distance the smaller the chances of this working.

So for example if I (sahugain) am on the river outside Hamsah and ive got this skill mastered and a fight breaks out on Western Aryth, there is a chance I would know but the chance would be far greater if I were on Aryth of noticing.

Mertalk - able to communicate with water forms naturally.

Swipe: Like backrake, but used with naked feet and only underwater. In fact - would Sahugain even use boots? They'd need special footwear made I'd think to take into account their webbed toes.


I'm not sure if this would be a skill or what, but something that eliminates movement lag for them while on or underwater. And now that I think about it...

Tidal pull - A skill/spell/sup (whatever) that increases a target's movement lag while on or underwater.

Watery Grave - a skill/spell/sup (whatever) that allows certain sahugain to pull a target who is ON water, UNDER water (like pull,drive, etc. type skills) even if they are not using any 'water-breathing' items or spells. I'm guessing that 'last breath' edge would become WAY more likely to be picked

nt

Snoooooring.

I recall at one point considering the possibility of Merfolk (water-only) or Deep Ones (water-based, slow on land), but the terrain restriction would be pretty limiting. It wouldn't be a great race for cabal interaction, though that may not be a bad thing.

Especially if there are any water-areas in the works to boot. However lots of CF is underwater already when you think about it, Open seas, The Underdark lake, all the rivers, maybe throw a few more things in western aryth to rank on, spirits, etc. I wouldn't go water only, but slow on land is whjat I was thinking.

I would play it just to get my water-exploration on in 'relative' safety.

Got a laugh with the thought of putting the refuge under water. Storm rangers would be the new in thing and a bunch of pie eyed and bedraggled felar walking around in complete disconsolation.

The Warlocks (goodie magic cabal) was located on Western Aryth. It wasn't underwater but you had to cross alot of water to get to it. Heydey of the watershifters if I remember correctly. Great for invokers too...it was invokers back then that could destroy your boat I think....anyways I always figured thats why they closed it, probably too many complaints. I personally loved that location and still consider it to be the best cabal location ever. All sorts of wars went down outside that tower.

I forget if the entrance where the guard mob had to be was water as well. Once inside you were on solid ground though for sure. I'd love to see the Imms bring something back like that.

EDITED TO ADD:

Just reminiscing...I played as a Warlock and as a Villager up against the Warlocks and even as their enemies I honestly believe that location brought out the best in the Villagers because when you went there you had to mean business. You couldn't sneak up on them, they had advantages on water, it was just a blast.

You could always move the nexuns to the old warlock tower in western aryth

>I recall at one point considering the possibility of Merfolk
> water-only) or Deep Ones (water-based, slow on land), but the
>terrain restriction would be pretty limiting. It wouldn't be
>a great race for cabal interaction, though that may not be a
>bad thing.


Water forms and Storm giants rampaging throughout the high seas. Seaweed becomes a valuable commodity. Could be interesting.

I agree, especially now that I think about it...why not make it even more viable by simply making the oceans alot bigger? It shouldn't be that hard to double the size of the oceans like open sea and aryth by adding a bunch of empty rooms right? OR you could make crossing them a bit more hard by making parts of them 'maze' rooms like once you get about to the middle of them.

When you think about the kind of medieval setting CF takes place in, crossing the ocean should be one of the hardest things you can do. So maybe not make it 'hard' (because its hard to find people as is) but at least a bit longer to do then throw in these sahugain, maybe expand an area underwater (taking advantage of creating more surface area ocean) for more mid-level adventuring and you could see as much activity on water as on land.

>I agree, especially now that I think about it...why not make
>it even more viable by simply making the oceans alot bigger?
>It shouldn't be that hard to double the size of the oceans
>like open sea and aryth by adding a bunch of empty rooms
>right? OR you could make crossing them a bit more hard by
>making parts of them 'maze' rooms like once you get about to
>the middle of them.
>
>When you think about the kind of medieval setting CF takes
>place in, crossing the ocean should be one of the hardest
>things you can do. So maybe not make it 'hard' (because its
>hard to find people as is) but at least a bit longer to do
>then throw in these sahugain, maybe expand an area underwater
> taking advantage of creating more surface area ocean) for
>more mid-level adventuring and you could see as much activity
>on water as on land.
>
>
>
>

Or give the pirate cabal the power Entropy used to have to randomize room exits, but make it only work on water

I'm generally in favor of more water areas. Their relative lack makes it really hard make water shifters both balanced and interesting, marginalizes abilities that depend on water, etc. Right now, a heavily aquatic race (more so than storm giants) would be sort of pointless-- you'd have to downplay their aquatic-ness heavily to keep them playable across the other 80-90% of Thera, and at that point why are we doing this?

Couple reasons more water areas haven't happened:
1) Low author interest. For whatever reason, people haven't been too excited about generating this content. It's not practical for the area team to force authors to write about things they don't want to write about.

2) Tricky to integrate. It wouldn't make a heck of a lot of sense to just wedge them between existing areas, and you'd have to rewrite a lot of room on either side for the aesthetics to match. On the flip side, unless the water areas 'bridge' higher-traffic areas, it's easy to avoid water shifters (etc.) by just not going to those places.

3) Boringness. Adding 100 rooms of repetitive, open-floorplan ocean nothingness is filler content. Really, I'd want to see some deep lakes, underground rivers, etc. with interesting NPCs, treasure, etc. that would fill multiple roles.

valguarnera@carrionfields.com

I'd be willing to come on board and write a water area(s) (with some coaching) if you can write up a sahugain race to populate them

You know, there is a process for coming on board and writing areas if you are really interested in doing it. I'll even happily work with you every step of the way should you decide to go that course.

I'll go through the process (been a heroimm before) if you swear sahuagain will come out of it I don't want to be a heroimm just to write an area. I want a new race and am willing to pay for it with area writing if that is the main hurdle to getting them approved.

I'd be willing to come on board and write a water area(s) (with some coaching) if you can write up a sahugain race to populate them

1. Expand Aryth create a 'war-zone' where Sahuagain are fighting those Triton below water. Blood-tinged waters, sea monsters being sicced on each side of the conflict.


2. Expand sea of despair, throw in a whole other underwater city as the main home of the sahugain and the current one (the spirits) serve as the outskirts of that city.

3. Create a few 'waterholes' By water holes I mean spots as you mentioned - Deep lakes and such off the rivers and allow this to create more 'connective tissue' between the major oceans.

For example...maybe a lake in ugruts that connects via an underground river to that pond in holy grove. Create underwater offshoots beneath voralias tears that connect parts of that river to sea of despair and open sea via that area north of eastern crossroads. Maybe throw a lake in there as well.

Once you can go from open sea to sea of despair underwater, that is a big deal. A few good treasures (ive already thought of two) and you can drive traffic with loot and wands and cabal locations.

Oh...does CF have a Kraken? We could have a Kraken!

As for explanations, easy - the sahugain have secretly been building tunnels throughout theran rivers to try and expand their influence as part of a planned large-scale invasion on the Tritons. Maybe in co-operation with the Empire (Sahugain society being lawful evil).

Water areas are hard to effectively use for ranking/exploring now that they aren't wilderness. That means that Rangers(Except Mariners) and Druids aim elsewhere, and I was told Outlanders too. I suppose this may fall under your #1 because it may sap motivation/interest.

Every once and again, the river should expand to cover ten or so rooms on Eastern, including the Large Crossroads and maybe a few adjacent rooms in the appropriate surrounding areas.

That would probably make water shifters and mariners something worth talking about.

Shouldn't be that hard to write I don't think. If it automatically happens and the water stays for a while before drying out, all the better. Could at least give it a try in a straight sub of 10-15 Eastern Road rooms to Flooded Eastern rooms.

.

But that would be a reduction in thief and assassin power. Possibly ranger power too.

Essentially you could look at who is on and pick a route they can't ambush you on.

Also, for chars in general, finding people underwater would be tough as moving through water is pretty draining on moves.

Ranking would be low risk because by and large you can't be lagged underwater by most chars.

That said, I would love it if we had more of an underwater world.

Glymarach magicked something awful while trying to be the dragon.

Every mob becomes a ghost and every room becomes water. hohoho

It would be too much coding and area redo to be possible but having all of the major rivers run into the sea with deep water in the largest rivers. The new water highways of Thera. Yeah.. No.

Which doesn't really make sense when you think about it.


And it would take some serious re-writing but I'm fairly sure it could be done without coding anything. Rewrite a few rooms so that the rivers actually connect to the seas...not major. As Valg pointed out the major issue is having someone dedicate their time to doing it. And I'm willing to volunteer for the writing aspect is Valg or another person is willing to promise Sahuagin (or Triton maybe) to populate all the new waterways.

Which doesn't really make sense when you think about it.


And it would take some serious re-writing but I'm fairly sure it could be done without coding anything. Rewrite a few rooms so that the rivers actually connect to the seas...not major. As Valg pointed out the major issue is having someone dedicate their time to doing it. And I'm willing to volunteer for the writing aspect if Valg or another person is willing to promise Sahuagin (or Triton maybe) to populate all the new waterways. I don't need (or particularly want) to be an Imm, I just want to help if thats what is needed to get the ball rolling.

*ahem* The Khalid reaches the sea, thank you very much.

The steaming river of kiadana.

Disapproves of your overly evil ways.

I went back and played the original BG. Those games were a little unforgiving at times. Then again, original D&D was extremely unforgiving with the wrong DM. I only have 1d4 hp. "That's why, I'm always the first to die."

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EMLcy86bZNw

خالد, the eternal flow of water, thank you very much.

According to many myths about mermaids, they could produce legs for short periods of time, so merfolk could be feasible. What I would propose is give them a 'shifting' skill, not spell so that they can be ragers, that transforms their tail into 2 legs. While shifted thus, they can move on land with some difficulty as they are not used to walking. -2 dex while shifted and every tick that they are shifted, they get an affect of -5% max moves so after 20 ticks of being shifted, they have max moves of 0%, the affect is removed once they revert to tail but can only be done on water. To be fair though, you would have to put a recall point somewhere on or in water so if someone gets to 0 moves they aren't stranded. After 15 ticks, I would suggest they take damage also, starting at scratches and increasing each tick after. It would suck being a rager, but possible as long as you don't stay on land more than 20 ticks, be careful of any sleeping spells/affects.

or what? because you're knocking today's new topics down the list

I am a truck driver and don't get a chance to log in here often but today I unloaded at 1am and I don't load until tomorrow so I am just going through all the threads I have missed and these 2 I actually had comments for. I'll try to refrain from bumping anymore threads and just create new ones with a link inside to the OP.

Sorry again.

Sorry dude, and no need to apologize to me I know I can be somewhat of a ####. That said, no apology needed man

I would like to see Merfolk some day, but I would hate for it to devolve into something like Splash. I think keeping them in water would be the way to go, even if that requires a lot more water.

Bocce balls!

.

Few things :

1) Make them vulnerable to lightning, give them flat 23 dex (flat), 20 int. This is essentially human stats but with immune vs water, vuln vs lightning, and the water breathing bit.
2) Inherent spear 100%.
3) Can see camo underwater, but not get it. Mariners do get it, so that path can camo underwater.

I'm really looking forward with interest to pixies.