I was thinking about something, so I thought I would bring it up for discussion.

Bard's fiend song does not hit their groupmates and fighting the fiend is a pretty bad experience already..now if the bard is with another you are fighting a fiend + the bard + the groupmate..most likely you're dead..

BUT if the bards song hit his groupmates..he'd have to start the fight alone..and since the song doesnt lag you..you'd at least have a shot to flee + quaff and then fight the fiend alone

I think that may be a fair trade considering how lethal the song is. It also is not terribly limiting..the bard's groupmate just has to be ready to strike (bash) or walk in immediately after the song is sung.

now i havent really thought of how this would affect 3v3 fights..having the bard walking in alone up to a group of 3 is not the best idea..but his backup is not that far away and he has other songs in his arsenal..anyway just a thought

>I think that may be a fair trade considering how lethal the
>song is.

Frightful fiend is tough, but there are a lot of tough abilities in this game. Certainly, whatever you're playing has tools in its arsenal no less potent. I don't personally see it in need of change, and it's not because bards with gangs of people haven't sung frightful fiend as they dogpiled on me enough times.

While my current char has skills that are potent.

Warning for text below:
(im still a pretty new player so I may be wrong here)

I believe that there are only two other skills similar to fiend in the game. The hunt and gaunts (each have pro's/con's). They seem to be similar to the extent that they track (some faster/better) than others and do decent enough damage to be feared. What I see as different is that the hunt and gaunts have specific limitations on when they can be used and

1) each can be called on only one PC
2) groupmates can fight them (not sure about the hunt)

The limitations combined the two statements above..just made fiends kinda stick out from the group.

Anyway thats all I have. So thanks for the quick responses and as I believe we are all at work.. 3 more days to go

Fiend has one major restriction the other ones haven't - you must be in the same room as the guy you want to fiend.

Hunt has big benefits as it prevents victim from using transportation spells.

Gaunt has the nice effect of bringing the victim to you if he fails to kill it.

And there's loads more to it.. but it's late.

Hostile bard songs do not adversely impact groupmates. Friendly bardsongs do not help enemies. There's a significant precedent for bards having some choice in who they are manipulating and how, and it seems odd to reverse that just for one case.

valguarnera@carrionfields.com

However I think there is also another basic premise/precedent that is being "broken" (not sure thats the right word). In CF if its a normal NPC anyone can fight it, if its a player called NPC anyone in the PK range can fight it. If its a fiend..?

The above should probaly have been attached under my post to nepenthe.

again,
thanks for the quick response, have a good one

Well, we do strive for the abilities of CF's classes to play out pretty differently. It's certainly not an oversight that frightful fiend only exists in the mind of its victim.

That said, support-style characters can certainly help the victim fight it with their abilities, if they're free to do so.

There are some restrictions and weaknesses to FF that you might not know. The best way to find them out is probably to play a bard and take notes whenever you try to FF someone and they kick your teeth in anyway.

Barring that, you could talk to bards your character knows IC and ask them for advice. That could be a fun little bit of RP, honestly. Your brave warrior (or whatever) is frustrated because he feels unmanned and defeated by his fears, and begins researching ways to triumph over them. Whatever, you get the idea.

Fighting bards or fighting with bards is a third, if less efficient, way.

Don't get me wrong; FF is definitely a great ability. In some situations and against some opponents it's absolutely fantastic. However, it's not unbeatable by anyone, and I'm not personally of the opinion that it's too good -- just a tough, unique ability.