Are invokers some of the best all-around mages? I think they have the biggest offense, the biggest damage reduction, the best stun protection and they rival transmuters for (support) because they can give all this to other people.

Invokers are certainly powerful in many ways. Yet, for some reason, I fear them the least. It's probably because in spite of their damaging power, you can always see them coming from a mile away. I have killed a hero invoker before, and died to one. In all other cases I would just avoid them or escape almost too easily. If anything, shifters usually cause problems for me.

Just compare the various mage classes side-by-side on various facets of the game. You'll be quite surprised at how each class stacks up against the others.

Take a look at the following considerations and tell me that Invokers are better than Shifters, Necromancers, Trannies, and Conjies:


Maledictions
Solo Exploring
Melee Damage
Support Spells
Mana Regen
Lagging
Picking battles
Stealth
Protective Magic
Damage Reduction
Healing
Movement
Ranking - Low, Middle, High levels
Surveillance and Spying
Overall Solo Killing
Detection
Solo Re-equipping
Utility Functions

Do Invokers stand at the top in every category? I think not. Even the "Solo PK" category is very arguable. I'd be willing to give Invokers the award in melee damage -- but that's assuming you haven't found a way to stop them from casting, or protect yourself from their attacks. Admittedly, they are strong in many of the above categories -- but they are far from the best overall.

I am not certain, but Invokers *might* be in a better position to singlehandedly obtain wands than some other mage classes. On that note, I'd give them very high marks. However, this issue concerns wand locations, not the class.

You may also be basing your opinion on a few players who have been very successful with invokers. Most players aren't that experienced with the game. Those same players could probably take the other mage classes and mop the floor with you if they wanted.

But if you think so, feel free to play one.

I'll go out on a limb and say you're basing this on the log Kwalin posted where he destroys half the village. Yes, in the extreme case, invokers are disgusting. Emphasis on extreme case. In that log Kwalin had shield, aura, all shields, and 'body of stone'. It's likely he was also resist_blunt. Add to this a 770hp transform, almost doubling his hit points. That particular fight was also in the context of a raid, where the defenders are obligated to defend (and have limited ability to flee, being ragers).

Some things working against invokers:

1. Can't hide outside of improved invis and dig. That means in most cases you should see them coming.

2. Can't summon. They have to run to you or get you to run at them.

3. Can't detect hidden, no dangersense. Like many other classes this makes them pseudo-vulnerable to thieves and assassins.

4. Can't heal. Makes things like blind, plague, etc. more irritating.

5. Can't lag very well. This forces them to engineer situations where their prey is trapped.

6. Benefit greatly from wands. This is a plus if you know wand locations. It's a minus if you don't.

7. Rely on "affects" to be powerful. Makes them more vulnerable to classes that can dispel and/or those that can knockout for long durations (bard/thief/necro).


I don't know about you, but necromancers usually scare me more than invokers. The only way an invoker is going to kill me is if I spam into his quicksand, if I can't see him due to improved invis, or if he jumps me when I'm already wounded. A necromancer can summon me into a gang of his friends. He can do the old sleep & flee which, if he's smart, incurs very little risk. If he has a bunch of zombies he can just let his ghoul paralyze me then beat me down. Etc.

thank you.

I think that invokers are sort of the most well-rounded mage.

Vokers are sick when they get improved invis at the lowest possible level.

Beyond that, they shouldn't kill too many competant people if the competant people are trying to stay alive.

PS. Yes, my last death was to an invoker, but I only had one had to type with and with two I -think- I would have survived.

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>Are invokers some of the best all-around mages? I think they
>have the biggest offense,

I think a necro sleeping you and getting off a pwk is pretty big in terms of offense too.

>the biggest damage reduction,

But no healing, unlike some shifters and conjurers. Some defense forms dam redux rivals a vokers, plus they usually get regen too.

>the best stun protection and they rival transmuters for (support)
>because they can give all this to other people.

Ok, they have more options to stop lagging. You can't give major shields to other people though, so I don't see how they rival transmuters.