This is mostly for Daevryn and Valg, but I've always wondered the intricacies of save vs. spell and was wondering if maybe you could throw me a few bones as far as the code?

Does a spell always do a range of damage?.. Just an example.. lets say lightning bolt for an invoker is 40-80... and then spellcraft kicks as a check and if it goes through the damage is now 80-160, or something along these lines? I figured if this was the case and thats all there was to the damage of the spell, svs just battles the spellcraft save.

Just then I was thinking about how it could also be on somewhat of a scale of lowering damage and maledictions and affects of certain spells. So just closing off my thoughts, I figured I would ask finally how it works.. and what all is svs involved in as far as bonuses and saves. We all know it's good, but just none of us know completely why. Thanks so much!

Guilo

From what I gather, save vs. spell just feeds into some formula that determines whether you "save" against a particular spell. For damage spells, I believe if you save then the damage is halved. For hit/miss spells it either lands or it doesn't.

Spellcraft increases the effective level at which the spell is cast, which makes it harder to save against. The "casting level" also factors into the determination of "variable" values, such as how much -str you get from a wither, or how many hp of damage an invoker spell does.

Then again I haven't seen the code, so I could be way off.

>From what I gather, save vs. spell just feeds into some
>formula that determines whether you "save" against a
>particular spell. For damage spells, I believe if you save
>then the damage is halved. For hit/miss spells it either
>lands or it doesn't.
>
>Spellcraft increases the effective level at which the spell is
>cast, which makes it harder to save against. The "casting
>level" also factors into the determination of "variable"
>values, such as how much -str you get from a wither, or how
>many hp of damage an invoker spell does.
>
>Then again I haven't seen the code, so I could be way off.

Saves can come into play in various different ways, but this covers the majority of stuff. There is no simple answer to the original question, since it can really come down to save vs any particular spell may be different than any other spell.

So long, and thanks for all the fish!

This is pretty close to accurate.

My correction:

For damage spells, I believe if you save then the damage is halved.

This is generally true, however, not all spells have a save, and those damage spells that do have a save aren't always for half damage.

That being said, if you assume all damage spells have a save for half, you'll be right probably 90%+ of the time.

It's boring to type eq and calculate how many saves each piece contributes.
We already have numeric values for stats (str/dex/con), hitroll/damroll, etc. Have you ever considered adding exact values for saves?

This is funny, I remember the first time I herod. I always assumed that was what I had to do to get this turned to a numeric value. I was a bit disappointed to find out I was wrong and always wondered why they never changed. I think it would be a nice little perk for becoming a hero in your guild. Perhaps there are other "little perks" that I don't know about, but I always thought this would be a neat one. Of course I have no idea if things like race play into your saves (Svirfs, etc) or if it is a factor added separately.

If I get scouraged by a spectre and have a sapphire periapt which should cure it up to level 51.. It sometimes is going to be uncurable because spellcraft could make the scourage go past a level 51 spell, perhaps even up to 60 like sleek spells, thus making the periapt unable to do anything? Or did I misunderstand the "increases the effective level at which the spell is cast" comment?

It wouldn't make it impossible, just more difficult.

A good example is the freakishly high level poison you get from fillets. Witness how long it takes town healers to cure it.

But I'm fairly certain plague gets easier as the duration gets lower, and I feel confident that scourge is similar. So while you may have trouble when it's 15 hours or whatever, it might be easier if you only have 5 ticks left.

I'm not 100% positive, but I am almost, that past level 51 diseases the periapt says "This disease is beyond your power to cure" or something of that nature, and that message always makes me sad =P. It just never crossed my mind that spellcraft raised the level of the spell, which explains now lvl 47 necros landing scourage and it being uncurable sometimes, so it all makes sense to me if I am understanding everything right. So thanks for the input Isildur.

It's been a while since I used a periapt, so you may be right.

I don't believe whether the periapt can or can't cure something has anything to do with the level.

(Although, if you have a chance to cure something, that will vary depending on the level.)