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#10776, "Can we have the Paladin Code changed?"
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I mean seriously.
I've been cussed at by Paladin #1,435.
A bit of an exageration, but it drives me ####ing nuts to be laying Paladins and adhereing strictly to the code only to see Virtued foul Mouthed Paladins. I've gotten my virtues too, but I feel cheapened now.
That is all.
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My take on the code,
Aarn,
02-Nov-05 12:58 PM, #8
My feelings as well. All this babble makes me (txt),
Larcat,
02-Nov-05 10:25 PM, #11
Paladins of different flavors should still taste like p...,
Tharena,
02-Nov-05 07:08 AM, #4
About the code..,
Grurk Muouk,
02-Nov-05 04:07 AM, #2
Code = Guidelines.,
Caleban,
02-Nov-05 05:18 AM, #3
Moral Reletivism,
(NOT Pro),
02-Nov-05 09:39 AM, #6
D&D Paladins,
Caleban,
02-Nov-05 01:16 PM, #9
And some clarification about how Trib Paladins can even...,
Larcat,
02-Nov-05 01:27 AM, #1
I've had a couple Trib Pal's,
(NOT Pro),
02-Nov-05 08:01 AM, #5
I agree with you, lemme quote you and lets talk some mo...,
Larcat,
02-Nov-05 11:22 AM, #7
I think race needs to be taken into account,
jasmin,
02-Nov-05 03:42 PM, #10
I think that is a rather narrow view.,
(NOT Pro),
03-Nov-05 01:59 AM, #12
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Aarn | Wed 02-Nov-05 12:55 PM |
Member since 04th Feb 2005
566 posts
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#10790, "My take on the code"
In response to Reply #0
Edited on Wed 02-Nov-05 12:58 PM
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My take on the code.
Me as a player, I see the code as guidelines for how to play a paladin, which can be intrepreted many ways. I do not see them as optional in any way though.
When you're roleplaying a paladin, however, that character should view them as hard and fast rules that they have to follow. That character will be viewing them through whatever roleplay lense they choose to view the world through , which allows for a lot of variety. I think a Tribunal paladin should have SERIOUS issues with working with evil Tribunals, else they're not roleplaying a good paladin. Make it an internal conflict that your character has to deal with one way or another. Likewise a Maran paladin should have serious internal issues about breaking the law and how it might conflict with their duty. Heck, I consider those conflicts half the fun of playing a paladin.
In my opinion, Tribunal is one of the most dangerous cabals for a paladin to be in - but it can also be one of the most fun for just that reason. Although I personally want to break things when I see Trib paladins working with evil Tribunals, rescing them, hunting with them, etc. Communing on them is the worst though. Even in raid situations. You're a damn PALADIN, not joe-schmoe-goodie. If you wanted to play a goodie Tribunal that could make compromises with evils in the name of the law, then you shouldn't have played a paladin. But that's just my take.
Here's an excercise for you. If you're playing a paladin, stop and ask yourself if you're really a paladin, or just a warrior with communes. Could your role be executed just as smoothly if you were a warrior or healer? If it could, then you need to read over the paladin code some more, and adjust your roleplay.
Sorry, this got long and rambly, but there you have it!
Aarn
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Larcat | Wed 02-Nov-05 10:25 PM |
Member since 04th Mar 2003
495 posts
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#10795, "My feelings as well. All this babble makes me (txt)"
In response to Reply #8
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Want to play a paladin whose complete center of rp is the code.
This paladin would not be able to be in any cabal I can think of, but still might be a raging blast to play. "New payment options w/ Iron Realms"
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Tharena | Wed 02-Nov-05 07:08 AM |
Member since 21st Aug 2005
80 posts
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#10782, "Paladins of different flavors should still taste like p..."
In response to Reply #0
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They really should follow at least a couple of the "guidelines".
Personal opinion is that a paladin who uses foul language is still just wrong, no matter who you're a paladin of. =P But this is along the lines of shades of grey. Everyone has their preference, and their idea of what a paladin should be.
Since they're supposed to be generally virtuous though, can't they still be *all* held to some sort of standard, as opposed to a pick and choose philosophy? Maybe not a total change of the code, but a reworking of the text? These strictures are the must dos, the unbreakables; and then these are strictures that ideally you should follow as well?
I mean can you really consider a foul mouthed, drunken, gear horde a paladin? =P There really do have to be some restrictions.
My $0.02. I actually found 2 American pennies, so it really is worth that much today!
- Tharena
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Grurk Muouk | Wed 02-Nov-05 04:07 AM |
Member since 15th Mar 2004
538 posts
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#10779, "About the code.."
In response to Reply #0
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I will admit, there has been much internal debate over the code since my time began as an Imm.
There are basically two camps when it comes to the paladin code. The first camp, feels the code is black and white. The second feels that the code is just a general guideline, for paladins to follow. A mostly loose set of rules.
I belong to the second camp. Else how could you ever have Tribunal and Maran paladins? Tribs work in a cabal with evil. Marans are constantly breaking the law.
I think the majority of Imms belong to the second camp. But this is just my opinion, I could be wrong. The two guys who wanna hear talk about the code are Arvam and Shokai.. they seem to have the strongest opinions of it. (Aarn too!)
Anyways, just some background on the code for ya, and my take on it.
Grurk
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Caleban | Wed 02-Nov-05 05:18 AM |
Member since 26th Oct 2005
90 posts
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#10780, "Code = Guidelines."
In response to Reply #2
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I see the Code as a piece of clay from which you mold your paladin into a being of specific morals and responsibilities. That allows for paladins of many shades yet all having a core set of properties to have been developed from.
Having played a paladin follower of Ordasen I think the Code makes fore better roleplaying when applied to each character individually rather than one broad brush.
Just my .12 cents worth.
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#10786, "Moral Reletivism"
In response to Reply #3
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Has no place with the Paladin code or those who follow it.
I say this because I've seen it stretyched too far.
People have always and will allways justify their actions to fit thier own schemas unless they are held to a standard of conduct.
You can chose to do otherwise with your Paladin, but I think, it should be unempowermewnt at first, then reassignment toi the warriors guild second.
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Caleban | Wed 02-Nov-05 01:16 PM |
Member since 26th Oct 2005
90 posts
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#10791, "D&D Paladins"
In response to Reply #6
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I can see where you are coming from and agree with you absolutely under the right situations.
The strict definition you espouse appears to me to be a copy of the oldschool D&D paladin code. The code in that form works extremely well for the table top game because the world played in is dynamic. With the permament presence of a Game Master to ensure that there will always be new situations and new avenues for the paladin to maintain/restore his paladinhood. Heck a paladin in a party gives the GM a great source of plot lines.
CF is for all purposes a static world and therefore if a strict paladin code is enforced all paladins become pretty much the same. The lack of a permanent Game Master further scrunches down the avenues of a paladin roleplaying opportunities. I think the flexibility that majority of Imms would like to have paladin enjoy is a great way to offset these issues.
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Larcat | Wed 02-Nov-05 01:27 AM |
Member since 04th Mar 2003
495 posts
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#10778, "And some clarification about how Trib Paladins can even..."
In response to Reply #0
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nt "New payment options w/ Iron Realms"
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#10785, "I've had a couple Trib Pal's"
In response to Reply #1
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And I think they are a perfect choice for Tribunal.
I think Tribunal's acceptance of evil is the only real problem. I don't think Evil should be allowed in their ranks, for a number of reasons I won't go into here.
What I do have a Problem with is watching a Paladin Chumming it up with an evil. And when I say Chumming it up, I mean laughing, whisperto-ing a necromancer so Other Paladins, in the room, (In the Guild hall at that) can't over hear. Same Paladin refusing to acknowledge, or even come half-way toward resolving a conflict ith another Paladin. Same Paladin Cursing, and using vulgar Base language when adressing comments of others.
And that Paladin getting everything a Paladin could want. Virtues, possitinal power, etc.
Like I said. I play the code strictly. Always have, but I've never gotten more than people like this.
Another thing that Drives me up the wall is Pal's killing for Gear. I have in the past, but felt guilty for doing it, killed an evil for gear, but I just can't bring myself to do it in good faith with what I percieve a Paladin to be.
Paladins are about causes and Ideals. Not Foul Mouthed warriors with Perks. (Not that such can't have causes and Ideals.)
I would just ask that if there is a divide in the heavens, they should be on the interpretaion of behavior, not conduct.
As a soldier, I am required to say Sir, Sergeant salute and all that Jazz. It's not open to interpretation, even though many of my day to day activities are.
I'm Bailbondsman on the civilian side. The Documents and ID I am required to carry on a Fugitive Recovery are set in stone. How I go about finding these guys and apprehending them, while still pretty clear, is left more or less up to me.
Paladins need a clean up. I really believe they have become cheapened.
I have to go Thanks
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Larcat | Wed 02-Nov-05 11:22 AM |
Member since 04th Mar 2003
495 posts
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#10787, "I agree with you, lemme quote you and lets talk some mo..."
In response to Reply #5
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--And I think they are a perfect choice for Tribunal.
I think Tribunal's acceptance of evil is the only real problem. I don't think Evil should be allowed in their ranks, for a number of reasons I won't go into here.--
Unless you kick the necromancers and aps out of all the protected cities, this cant change.
If Evils weren't allowed in Trib, I'd have no problem, and agree that they are a great choice. As it is, they are allowed. "New payment options w/ Iron Realms"
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jasmin | Wed 02-Nov-05 03:42 PM |
Member since 04th Mar 2003
237 posts
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#10793, "I think race needs to be taken into account"
In response to Reply #5
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You wouldn't expect a dwarf paladin to act like an elf paladin in a different suit. The only foul mouthed paladin I've had was Dorn, and I did it purposely knowing that even though I'm a good paladin, it will stop further rewards. It was actually mentioned in my PBF that I missed some rewards, and I assume it was because of Dorn's mouth heh. I actually thought a few times before I said it, that it would penalize me later, and should I really do it. However it didn't fit Dorn if I HADN'T said it. Now should every paladin be like that? No way, but I think you need to stay true to your character's spirit, and if you think dwarves curse, then do it. My picture of dwarven society, (kind of like some black people today), is that cursing isn't a taboo thing. It has just become how they speak, and they will even do it when speaking fondly of someone. But this rationale doesn't fit with any other paladin race except maybe an occasional human perhaps. I think an occasional paladin that swears is all right, but not something they should all do all the time. One part of the paladin code is something like: Is fair in word and deed?
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#10800, "I think that is a rather narrow view."
In response to Reply #10
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Just because it's popular to play Irish Dwarven Warriors, doesn't mean every dwarf is that way.
I picture Dwarven Leadership (Insert Paladins) as tolkeinesque.
Read : Thorin Oakenshield.
I do not expect a Dwarf Paladin to sound anything like an Elf Paladin, far from it, if anything, I would expect an elf to be far more succinct. But you can have accents and mannerisms with out swearing.
I feel a large part of it has to do with people not knowing any other way.
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