Mon Aug 31 22:47:43 2009

At 11 o'clock PM, Day of the Great Gods, 19th of the Month of Futility
on the Theran calendar Zaireh perished, never to return.

I liked Zaireh for the short time I knew her.. the only freaking Outlander who put it to themselves to actually talk to me (and I had no idea you were an Outlander previously). Thank you for that, and thank you for rejuvenating me (no pun intended!)

I like Padwei too. I know it probably doesn't go here, but both of you (mortal and imm) have been quite the exemplary people to keep me trucking.

So.. thank you. From the bottom of Aetsrras' heart, and from the bottom of -my- heart. You're cool.

This pretty much turned me off of three things:

1) Outlander.
2) Empowerment.
3) Mortals in general.

The end.

Care to elaborate? I mean, hating mortals and empowerment is going to make playing an empowering imm sort of tricky, right?

1) I'm personally turned off at the idea of playing an empowerment character.

2) I'm personally turned off at the idea of playing mortals.


I don't think this was a bad character by any means, but it definitely felt like a
waste of time.

n/t

Huh. So do you dislike the empowerment process as a game feature, and just try to make it as fun as possible (within the existing framework) for the folks you empower?

The mortal thing kind of confuses me too. Honestly, I'm not trying to nitpick. It just seems like all being on staff does is remove the PK aspect of the game, assuming you never play mortals. If conversational role-play is your bag, is it not possible to get that as a mortal? Or is it just a matter of quantity?

This specific instance of empowerment (looking for full empowerment for
40 hours) made me bitter on the whole thing.

I think I touched on this somewhat before, when I mentioned Padwei had been
my first hero in 4 years. Mortals are hard for me to get into in general. In this
instance, I really couldn't get much in the way of conversation out of anyone
in the cabal with a few exceptions, and it just felt like pulling teeth otherwise.
I get it now - it's a loner cabal, so you basically do your own thing and get
powers for it, but meh. It just felt like I put a lot of effort into the character
and got little in return, which in general makes me not want to spend my
time in that manner.

That cabal seems really clannish. The goodies stick together, neutrals stick together, etc. Weren't you one of like...two?...goodies, with the other being a shifter who's in form half the time.

NMFT

having never really played a Warden, I dont necessarily agree or understand the roleplay of one... was actually really pissed that time you wouldnt even give me a sanc when trying to defend scales from an elf,glad I could run back and kill him in front of you, and that time asked for aid, you did not answer me until I asked what your answer was, that kind of pissed Darnik off as well... but one thing I like about the tree is we go for pretty much the same goals, but we dont need to like each other or get along

Anyways thought Zaireh was cool, thanks for learning with me in Dreams and wished you would have decided to rank up a bit more... think you were waiting on something to happen religion wise before you did???

Plus healers are pretty friggin boring to me... play something more fun next time

later

>him in front of you, and that time asked for aid, you did not
>answer me until I asked what your answer was, that kind of
>pissed Darnik off as well... but one thing I like about the

Yeah I was trying not to get killed by someone so I didn't really have time
to respond to you immediately. Sorry.

>Anyways thought Zaireh was cool, thanks for learning with me
>in Dreams and wished you would have decided to rank up a bit
>more... think you were waiting on something to happen religion
>wise before you did???

I was waiting for full empowerment - I was only empowered to 40.

>Plus healers are pretty friggin boring to me... play something
>more fun next time

Generally speaking I enjoy healers, but this one, not so much.

n/t

Did this empowerment issue you had influence a conversation I had with you (when you were Iunna) and I was a healer up in the temple - and you said you were going to kick Thror's ass?

From my perspective as the mortal, I enjoyed the interaction - but now I wonder if your Thror hatred helped push that conversation along

Oh, and thanks for the Grog - Too bad the heat in Thror's shrine evaporated the last of it.

--- oh, and I didn't know your mortal char one bit, but I love your Iunna persona!

If you know anything about Iunna, she always says she's going to kick
Thror's ass. :p

I love Thror, it just didn't work out and I'm not looking to try again any
time soon.

It was a while ago, so you might not recall but I do remember a conversation where you asked why I liked to hunt alone. It was the rp of the char but I really just wanted to see how well a moderately high exp-penalty pc could do leveling and surviving.

I've had other characters in Outlander in the past that were a lot more social and communicative and they did make the whole cabal seem more fun. Just prior to my deletion it seemed that it was all 1) let's raid 2) just saw an orc on Eastern 3) something else similar.


I'm also with you on empowerment. I've done a couple of druids and it was painful for me because I've never liked parroting religious dogma and going the independent route is painfully slow with no one to watch over you.

Play a bard and have fun writing notes. I had one a good while ago that wrote a lot of limericks that were a lot of fun coming up with and brought a lot of interaction.

Outlander is a #### cabal.

What's your complaint then? Surely it's not that you don't get enough opportunities to role-play...

I am not Dwoggurd but I will respond.

1. They dont help each other. Me particularly but I did not see they helped each other too. Therefore they all weared crap just a bit better than fine leather.

2. They dont raid.

3. They are damn sissies. One instance I clearly remember is when I ranked on Calandaryl (I was bard) with Waysha and Urulkaan. Adeg came in. Before I could blink with my eyes both of them disappeared and were gone. I camoed, called some rager and he drove the mummy off.

Thats were some past times, maybe now the things are different. Quird kicks ass for sure, Tangni likes to fight too.

It was awesome couple years ago when I played Gherion.

>1. They dont help each other.

I thought that was sort of built into the cabal, similar to Imperial sects?

No. Thats about people not "cabal RP". When I was Gherion people helped, of course goodie wont help evil, but except this things were fine.

Imperials help each other too.

The friction between the different branches is built in. It is supposed to exist and it has been said multiple times before, if you can't stand on your own two feet and do what you want to do, then Outlander is probably not for you.

The option to plug fellow cabal members is one of the things I love about the cabal.

Edit: I enjoyed Zaireh too. The first time I met you in nonveil I knew you were an imm, I just didn't know which one. By the way, weren't you tat'd? How in the #### do you get a tat but not full empowerment?

And I feel your pain on the empowerment woes and I doubt I'll tread that #### path again unless I find an imm I really want to play a char under.

Essentially, they exist in a parallel world (95% of players don't see them).
Their enemies hardly can hunt them (unless they choose to throw themselves on enemies) plus they don't really raid/retireve unless thay have ridicolous oods.
Consequently, this turns the whole cabal into conservative campers that annoy the rest of the playerbase.

Their RP is topped at talking about themselves in third person.
And we get delusional people like Mreash who believe they contributed a lot while others simply didn't notice him.

PS. We already have stealthy classes (hide, duo, camo) which are somewhat "bad" in that respect too. No need to bring the whole cabal with the similar behaviour.
CF would be better if more people would actually be able to hunt each other and fight. With stealth classes this is pretty much one-sided.

So here's what I'm hearing from you:

1. Stealth classes are bad since they can choose to only fight on their terms. Outlander is in essence an entire cabal full of stealth classes.

2. There is a predominance of cowardly players in Outlander who choose to only raid/retrieve when they enjoy a ridiculous advantage. This is <b>more true</b> for Outlander than for other cabals.

3. There is a predominance of players who don't have interesting roles, and whose role-play consists of nothing more than gimmicky speech patterns.

4. There is a predominance of players who are just flat-out delusional (e.g. allegedly Mreash). This is <b>more true</b> for Outlander than for other cabals.

Of those, the only one I might possibly agree with you on is #1.

Mostly because of the "more true than for other cabals" clause. Every cabal has some members who are delusional and/or cowardly and/or exhibit weak role-play. Outlander doesn't leap out at me as being "worse" than the others.

Some of the "conservative camper" rep may also be due to the cabal having an overabundance of terrain-specific classes (e.g. ranger, druid) compared to other cabals.

When last time did we have outlanders actualy raiding/reraiding with somewhat fair odds? As one who played Empire for quite a long period I must say I don't really saw them taking part in cabal war when they had chances to die. With few exceptions or when they teamed up with Fortress to raid 5 on one

Of course there were few cool people but 90% of the time this cabal full of crap

because serpent striking the outer, inners, and the Imperials in range all to death is probably the best strategy ever.

wat is lojik?

if you have problems with playing one class, don't play it. But when I see outlander group that actualy have good chances to pull off reraid and they just quit, it's sad.

I generally agree, but current leaders do decent job imo

n/t

I'd be interested to know what you consider "good chances".

Is it "good chances" if lich (or possibly lich+1) is in the brewhouse with centurions west, and another set at the north end of Balator?

I think I've proved already that I'm good enough pkiller and I'm able to count chances. So if you want discuss my seeing of good chances, post descrition of instance and I will tell you if they are good or no.

Fact that you can lose one of reraid group does not mean you should not do it. Of course it's more easy to enjoy cabal power without taking any resposobilities(like reraiding)/risks. Which is exactly why we have ####ty outlander for about few years already.

Yeah. I guess I'm not sure I view that as a reasonable situation in which someone should be expected to re-raid. Guaranteed loss of one person? Especially to a character who will be enriched by that person's death? No thanks.

I'd rather let him sit there in Imperial Lands until he gets bored and leaves, THEN re-raid.

I've said "have chances to lose one of raiding party". Since then it's "Guaranteed loss of one person"?

Nobody said you should go there when lich sits there. But sure quitting of enemies will get lich "bored and leaves" much faster.

The chance of losing one person is pretty high, depending on the makeup of the re-raiding party. If that chance approaches "guaranteed" then, in my opinion, the re-raiders should not even attempt.

Which, apparently, you agree with. So we're in agreement. I definitely think quitting out is bad form.

Honestly, I'm not really even inclined to take a chance of dying against the potential of feeding a lich more phylacteries or an already powerful AP even more charges. Not unless I have an equal chance of winning, that is. Which is probably less than 1% chance of it ever being equal.

It'd be awesome to have a Lich with full a/b/s or AP with full a/b/s like the current Imperials juggernauts do.

If you're going to say that, you shouldn't be someone that should raid Outlander, that I didn't see raid Outlander unopposed for RL months+ at a time.

I'm just saying.

is 80-90% of why people love you.

want me to post logs or something?

+ it's hard to raid outlanders opposed if they are not online, right?

>want me to post logs or something?

What would that prove?

I didn't say you've never raided that cabal. I've certainly seen you do it multiple times.

I am saying that there was an, oh, 4-6 month period in which I personally saw you raid Fortress probably over a hundred times, Scion dozens of times, Nexus a bunch of times, Battle a bunch of times, and Outlander zero.

Maybe killing-nature-o-clock only happens after I go to bed. It's possible, but I doubt it.

Which is certainly your prerogative, but doesn't put you in a position to say with a whole lot of authority what the cabal would or would not do to raid or get their item back.

Anyway, we can have the rest of this out sometime after you delete if you want. I've said too much already.

>When last time did we have outlanders actualy
>raiding/reraiding with somewhat fair odds? As one who played
>Empire for quite a long period I must say I don't really saw
>them taking part in cabal war when they had chances to die.


I started a re-raid alone against Hanstian and the bard Emperor and drew them off and Sulye went in against them and finished it alone.

I re-raided solo against Laugash, Artenno, some transmuter and Edika even came to help the Tribunals.

Those are just 2 quick examples from not all that long ago.

Saying that it never happens is simply asinine (p.s. I was an elf ranger and fighting outside the wilderness was definitely taking a risk).

----Saying that it never happens is simply asinine (p.s. I was an elf ranger and fighting outside the wilderness was definitely taking a risk).

I said that there are cool people from time to time, but over all Outlanders full of crap.