Fri Feb 10 06:56:29 2006

At 8 o'clock AM, Day of Thunder, 24th of the Month of Winter
on the Theran calendar Falun perished, never to return.

There are two ways you can react to being forced to deal with a superior who you IC(and ooc?) loathe for various reasons.

1) You can look at all of your plans that are crushed and become bitter and not have any fun.

2) You can look at the potential for neat character interplay that such a situation provides, and plot and plan that character's downfall. Whether it works or not, it'll be fun along the way.



I just think you can look at many of the replies to this thread, and see who had which philosophy.

It's hard to have heroes without villains. And some of the hardest villains to deal with are the ones who are on your OWN SIDE, and who may or may not really be villains at all.

I am glad there are characters like Falun in Cf, adversity is an open invitation for Glory, if you look at it the right way.

On the other hand, I do think that there are times when cf is all villains, and not enough people trying to be heroes, but that's another thread.

I didn't feel like I was wasting time.

With that being said, I have to say that I'm surprised to hear all the negative feedback on this character.

I gotta say, I get tired of hearing Immortals say bad things about Empowered Characters, yet, they let them stay empowered/keep a position.

It's a safe bet that if you (Any empowering Immortal/Immortal leader) are seeing stuff that makes you go Hmmmmm.... It's time to pull the plug.

For instance, Bjurn, He screwed up and strayed a long way from the code, but was allowed to stay empowered and heroed when he was clearly struggling.

I think that hurts CF in the long run more than it helps. I say this because a person gets emotionally invested into their character. And if they aren't being coached or coaxed by their Immortal, they do not learn. Theirs nothing wrong, in my opinion, with an Immortal giving a warning/partial unempowerment, skill sup removal/total unempowerment to an empowered class. History is full of people falling from grace only to pick themselves up to higher glory.

I always have high hopes when I interact with empowered characters but I am often left wanting and look down on them, and the Immortal who would empower them. If they are supposed to be the best, make sure you empower the best and strait up tell those who aren't, hey, you will never make it beyond this point.

At any rate I think it's excedingly unfair for any Immortal who had anything to do with Falun to say anything bad about him. At least not in the tone I am detecting. If you allowed him to make it this far, you should be saying ‘GREAT JOB FALUN!’

GREAT JOB FALUN!

Pro

>I gotta say, I get tired of hearing Immortals say bad things
>about Empowered Characters, yet, they let them stay
>empowered/keep a position.

Did you miss the part where I had a lot of good things to say about Falun?

My only criticisms of the character are perfectly fine within his role.

I'm not going to be like: "Khasotholas, you should unempower this guy, because he has this flaw that isn't bad RP or necessarily bad for your religion."

I think a lot of people (ok, Enbuergo) feel like I hate Falun and want to bash him down. I don't see it that way at all. Here's a guy who got 90% of it right playing a role that is tough to play, draws a ton of scrutiny, and a ton of player hate. I want to show him where the missing 10% is so the next character is one people will still be talking about with a sense of awe five years later.

It just seems to me that some critisisms of players are a bit harsh.

But I know yer not a total ball buster, just that you can come off like a mean older brother somethimes.

Depending on how one defines success, Falun was quite successful. His pk numbers are superb, the impact he made on others' play was pronounced, and anyone recently crawled out from beneath a rock knew his name. I liked Falun in that he gave my paladin a focus, an objective that he would never attain because of the confluence of a class with good protective supps, great offensive capability, and cabal powers that could help close a kill. That he liberally utilized a small army of hit men from the eastern side of the continent was tactically smart, and I admired that combat in which he ran freely through Galadon using several guild guards as meat shields.*

My gripe concerning Falun was not that he was an evil Tribunal who pulled underhanded stunts (eg. the incident in Voralian City where he watched Kruuank drive Sal out of the city so Falun could attack him, too). That it was not only allowed to persist but seemed to be rewarded with promotions squelched what little interest I had in playing a Tribunal. It is quite possible that the player's goal was to sow discord, and if so, he was successful there, too.


* A suggestion: Tribunals should only be able to enter the guilds of others if there is a wanted character in that guild.

Tribunal law is fine as it is.

Like many others, I have mixed feelings on Falun. Coming up, Falun was clearly competent and had some good knowledge of what he was doing. Making him vindicator was quick and easy, although he did have a definite ability to antagonize pretty much anyone.

Provost, however, Falun was the dark horse candidate. Given his past record of not getting along with others, I thought he was perfect in the role he was in, and well someone who was more a mediator would make Provost. But, you did some really good notes to me, and seemed to step up when others were just waiting for someone to be appointed. That being said, you often let me down after that. I just never saw all the plans you wrote of developed, and that disappointed me--but you were also a lucky guy.

Every time I decided, Ok, he's done, i'm moving him back to vindy & choosing a new provost, you'd do something that would say oh, well maybe I'm being hasty. I suppose, I agree with Nepenthe in a lot of respects, now that it is all said and done--this was a very competent tribunal and one that seemed to strike some fear in the foes, but not a strong leader outside martial pursuits. Regardless, I think by anyone's standards, this was a successful character and a memorable one, well done at it.

To respond to some other comments, as you were tattooed I felt your chosen god should have first shots to title you or, failing that, if something particularly remarkable happened (perhaps peace /w Fort, destruction of outlander), I'd give you something there. Any other perk would have been more of the role contest/something particularly noteworthy etc, for the most part I felt you had plenty of love in terms of Tribs, as I see your provost guards are seen a perk already.

Dalteric

Mara was convinced from almost the beginning, that you were an Empirial agent, which, I should add, wouldn't be too much of a stretch for someone tatted by Khaso.

She didn't like you. She figured that Khaso wanted the Tribunal to start #### and fight with Empire's enemies, so that most of the casualties would be soaked up by the Spire instead of the Palace, or maybe that was just you being proactive in your religion, but NOTHING I saw of you in character went against this belief.

With her own history pre-disposing her towards a violent hatred of any sort of corruption, yeah, inside she hated you.


But she was also one who followed the rule of law to the letter, and damnit if Dalteric didn't look like he trusted you, and surely he knew more of your motives than I did?

Ooc, I probably would have chosen you over me for provost also, for two reasons.

One, you had seniority over me, and you obviously hungered for it. And two, if you were looking to make the Spire become a defacto meat-shield in Empire's wars, it would give quite a large opening for RP within the spire.

Ic, Mara would rather have had Pico himself as Provost than you. heh. But it came down to, Dalteric could see into your soul, and if he said you weren't corrupt, then you weren't corrupt.

But then, a few weeks later. After you gave me the job of putting together official agreements with all of the other cabals...

I put together what I think was a great agreement, it was uniform, for all cabals, it was fair, it broke no laws or internal rules of either the Tribunal OR the other cabals, and it would have brought peace, which is what the Spire should be after, because outside wars just take resources away from the Spire's Job. Law enforcement.

Then you come back, and tell me to change it. fine, you had your own ideas....uh..you want me to put WHAT in it?

Ok, you want me to change it, so that every single cabal but empire will be *FORCED* by their own internal beliefs to not only reject it, but in some cases start a war over it.


At this point, I worked up a plan to get together with Kasdenn and a few other Magistrates and Provincials that I knew didn't like you, to catelog action for action what you were doing that was destroying the Spire's ability to do it's job, Law enforcement. The idea was to catelog all of them for a week or so, and then bring it directly to Dalteric.

I was even going to leave the Spire if Falun wasn't removed from leadership. heh. That would have been fun.

But, unfortunately, other things came up, I got sucked into another online game, I got nearly arrested for having an expired Driver's license, and by the time I had the willingness to take the time to get back into character, I just couldn't work up the desire to write out all my convoluted plans into a role addy, and I had been gone so long that most of those who I was going to use in my plots were either gone or in another place in their RP.

( As a complete aside,I admit, I also got tired of constantly making the decision between leaving food in the Spire, or leaving preps in the Spire, or leaving my boat in the spire, or needing to leave all three, if I wanted to lower my weight to the point where I could actually tank. When I do come back, I sure won't come back as a low str char, that was the most unfun part of the character)

Anyway. Hope you had fun with the character. You seemed into your role, which for me is always when I have the most fun. I'm sorry we never got to the point of the Provost and Adjutant butting heads, I think that might have been fun all around for all involved, even if it did lead to mass uninductions/resignings from the Spire, that would have just caused alot more chaos in Thera, which would have been great for the next generation of Tribunal characters, given them the ability to Shine.

First, the good, although I'm sure all of this will be missed by the time I get to the bad: Really good roleplay anytime I was watching. Once you got rolling, a very effective vindicator. A cool villainous character with a decent amount of depth, which I think is rare for a character of this kind.

A lot of people called Falun corrupt, which is standard for a successful Tribunal, and I can honestly say that I never saw anything that would validate that. Did Falun hunt a lot of good-aligned people on his off-time? Absolutely. Did he make a mistake here and there? I'm sure -- you can't play a Trib for 400 hours and not. But as far as the Law and his duty went, he was pretty dead on in everything I saw. Well done there.

The bad really only amounts to two things: First, while a great Tribunal, Falun really ran the cabal into the ground as Provost. A lot of great caballed characters don't make great leaders. Not a big deal.

Second, Jesus, but was this character ever a coward. Would Falun fight 2 or 3 people that he already knew were terrible and had no real chance to beat him? Sure. Anyone I saw have even a decent showing against Falun, I never saw him fight again without a hefty gang. I saw Falun word away from fights where he was almost certainly going to kill the other guy and the chance of him dying was almost nil. Falun was most gung-ho to repeat kill the most terrible players on the mud.

I've also never in the history of CF seen a cabal leader so frequently take his people into danger and then abandon them so readily. The iconic Falun anecdote for me is this one time that Falun and Volicitry go up against two not especially dangerous Outlanders at the Outlander cabal. They both immediately target Falun, and a barely touched Falun declares 'Too many' and words, leaving Volicitry for dead.

What I'm getting at is, you can play the game that way. You can definitely justify it as appropriate RP for a character of this type. You can put up a good PK ratio that way. What you can't do that way is improve at the game or make the best players afraid of you.

I think the potential's there for this player to be among the best PKers in the game. I just don't think that potential will be realized as long as he continues to focus on beating up the worst 10% of the players and taking their lunch money.

I really dont see whats wrong with playing a cowardly character if he wishes. There are many cowards in RL and if you look close enough you will find that a lot of people #### their pants and run in the face of life threatening danger. I would probably run from extreme danger, im betting you would too. So would 99% of the world unless a higher emotion kicks in and overides the natural RUN instinct. Emotions/rational thoughts such as hatred, love, protection, shame, sense of duty and honor will overide RUN. Even these however will break down sometimes when death seems imminent (hence armies routing). I can see how that is bad for a Villager a Blade or a Paladin.

So i really think you should get off this BRAVE ####. If a character chooses self preservation rather than fighting against slim odds, let him do it. Its only natural unless his faith/code/cabal/role forbid it. Only then should it be punished. Quit idolizing this balls to the wall ####. It should be rewarded when seen but it cant be a MUST and people get scoofed at for not having it.

Why not put a sign up on the front page of CF saying " ONLY BRAVE CHARACTERS ALLOWED - All others will receive slight to no rewards."

I don't really know what point you are trying to make, as Falun was far from ever punished for his cowardice. He was made Vindicator with what, 3 kills? All Nepenthe says is that if he wants his characters to be respected by more than the newbies who he repeatedly ganks, he'll change his play style. It is true that many people are cowards, but it is even rarer that cowards are praised for their cowardice. Falun was like the gang member in RL who gets ten of his buddies together and beats the #### out of the anyone who he thinks might have a chance of outfighting him. Effective- absolutely. Cowardly - Absolutely. Praiseworthy - no.
Further, I got a kick out of his goodbye note where he talks about cleaning clock on the Fortress. My experience with him was that he would fight me alone, and hope that every single turn of the fight went his way, if it didn't, he was gone, even as little a thing as dispelling his sanc when he was still at 75% of his life, he'd be gone. Then, he came to the fort with no less than 5 Imperials when I wasn't flagged, and summoned me out to them, which is the only time he killed me. To say that Falun recieved no rewards is absolute farce and idiocy. Let me see, without knowing anything else about him he got
1. empowerment 2. Tattoo 3. Provincial Magistrate 4. Vindicator with only 3 kills 5. Provost Magistrate, when at least 4 Tribunals were actively trying to get him removed from the cabal

I honestly thought that the only reason he could possibly be leader was because the Imms had him set up to carryout a massive change to the Tribunal cabal, and needed an evil leader, I just couldn't think of any other reason why he would possibly be leader. I will add that I was sitting in the room when Braeburn (The Provost) agreed with the Judiciar's and a few other peoples assessment that Falun needed removed. Like 3 days later Braeburn was no longer Provost and Falun was.

The guy got vindicator and leader. Nep specifically said that he was waiting for something brave to TITLE him. If he wants a chicken #### title more power too him. But it makes perfect sense not to get a menacing title if you're always turning tail. No one said coward isn't a valid role, but apparently leader and vindicator spots aren't a reward?

Im not talking about Falun, im talking about a general principle.

This is more in regards to your post, then it is to Falun specifically.

I couldn't really disagree more here. I absolutely do idolize the balls-to-the-wall characters, because they're sweet. They're fun to watch, they're fun to play with. They're certainly good to have on your side in a fight, and often people even enjoy fighting against them.

That's not to say everyone and every character has to be that way. Drok said playing a cowardly character like Falun is a legitimate role. You can also play a character that isn't quite "balls-to-the-wall" that also isn't the complete opposite that Falun was. He obviously made it somewhere with that role. It just doesn't add much good to the game.

- That's not to say everyone and every character has to be that way. Drok said playing a cowardly character like Falun is a legitimate role. You can also play a character that isn't quite "balls-to-the-wall" that also isn't the complete opposite that Falun was. He obviously made it somewhere with that role. It just doesn't add much good to the game.

The above is Aarn's opinion. I don't agree that Falun didn't add much good to the game. If I did agree he wouldn't have been tattooed, he wouldn't have gotten interaction, and he eventually would have had his power reduced. Not everyone views every character the same way, and that's part of what makes things interesting upstairs, and downstairs.

What is bothering me is that Aarn is saying that cowardly characters dont add to the game or that people play characters for his watching enjoyment. That statement makes PK shy or PK avoiding people a waste of CF space...in Aarn's opinion. If thats his standard I think he should take a closer look at who is in the Fort and apply the same standard.

There isn't and hasn't been anyone in Fort up to Falun's standard in this respect in a long time, let's say the last year.

I've avoided chiming in on this subject but I will add my miniscule two cents.

Falun made the most of his powers and skills to avoid situations that put him in a tough spot. He did manage to kill a lot of people, but I think there are other examples of people who hung in there for that extra round in a fight or took on a group they're not 100% sure they can handle with the slight chance they could something great. And IMHO that's what makes a great PKer on ths Mud. But to each his own.

I think that's the point of this whole thread. Falun was a well played character, played by a skillful CFer. I don't think anyone wants to take that away from him. I do think the point of the thread was that he could have been THAT much better had he taken a few more chances in order to really get that badass criminal or take down that competent Maran. I guess we're just saying that he has a lot of potential, and he didn't completely tap into it yet.

Anyway, good job Falun and I think you got Grysh a couple times as well as another character of mine. Damn you!
Good luck with your next!

That statement makes PK shy or PK avoiding people a waste of CF space...in Aarn's opinion.

That's a fairly laughable statement, given the cabal I've been running.

Well, is this about what you enjoy watching or what is a legitimate, realistic character? Characters have to be enjoyable for the player not for the imm watching him. I tend to not play power characters, but half decent characters that fight only when they can win or when they have half a chance to win and a 90% chance of getting away. Some may call that cowardly and a lot of imms dont particulary enjoy watching my characters. Do I care? not really, i play for me, with no expectation of imm benefits.

People dont play to "add to the game". They play for themselves. This big conglomeration of "themselves" is what makes up CF. You as imms add to the game. The players make up an environment for all other players to do whatever. A player plays a character because he is curious as to how it would interact with the other chars. Not to add to the game.

Im not saying to reward cowardice. I think bravery is a fine thing and it should be rewarded. Im saying not to discriminate between brave and cowardly characters as in "being more fun to watch." That right there may alienate the RP a cowardly character may try to get across. But hey, whatever floats your boat.

This has nothing to do with Falun, its just a post on general principle.

"I absolutely do idolize the balls-to-the-wall characters, because they're sweet."

Why is it seemingly good RP to throw away your life pointlessly? I am not saying I don't love seeing balls to the wall sometimes as well, but it seems to me like there is a plethora of praise for the 2-61 character, with everybody and their mother paraphrasing some variant of "Thanks for letting me pad my pk record with you and not complaining, good luck with the next, yada yada yada". What do you imms prefer to see more of? Realistic risk-takers, or those characters who are willing to fight anyone/anytime?

I prefer characters that take some risks without utterly and serially throwing their life away. I'll restrain myself to dead characters for examples.

As one example, I generally liked Nabburak though some people would find him conservative. Given a group of decent enemies, I'd often see him try to pick off the weakest link in a raid and try to get away alive -- but even that is exposing himself to danger from competent players.

Similarly, I don't mind seeing characters that mow down newbies as long as they're not mowing down only newbies. I don't mind seeing characters that gang unless they only gang. Examples along those lines, I personally didn't mind seeing Yagharek or Cuucqa roll people with massive gangs of Imperials, because I also had seen each of those guys as the only Empire on and to a degree taking it in the pants.

nt

Though, maybe not on a Khasotholas shaman. Shaman are religious zealots. They probably shouldn't be cowards.

>Second, Jesus, but was this character ever a coward. Would
>Falun fight 2 or 3 people that he already knew were terrible
>and had no real chance to beat him? Sure. Anyone I saw have
>even a decent showing against Falun, I never saw him fight
>again without a hefty gang. I saw Falun word away from fights
>where he was almost certainly going to kill the other guy and
>the chance of him dying was almost nil. Falun was most
>gung-ho to repeat kill the most terrible players on the mud.

So he successed where I totally failed. A lot of times I thought 'This will not go well. Most likely I will die. No, I am sure I will die there' - and still I've been going there. And dying, from time to time. 'Oh ####', - would I say after that,' I knew that I'll die - why the hell did I go there?!'

To me it's a lot harder to word or avoid a risky fight instead of entering it and taking the risk. *envy* Falun. Perhaps I just lack his willpower ;P

Was him slamming the door in my character's face, time and time again. The high aspirations I had for the character were quickly deadened when I had to kiss some butt, trying to get back into the cabal. I regret having even tried, because the Immortals simply sat back and glorified Falun for a half-way done job as Provost. He removed me from the cabal twice for having my own dealings with the Empire. I think the only thing I need to point out is the number of kills for each cabal. Fortress - 44. Empire - 1. Outlander - 36. Conspiracy? Perhaps. Anyways, just a little disappointed that I had an upward hill to climb for the entire duration of my character, while Falun was blatantly doing the same thing I was doing, except to the Fortress, and getting rewarded for it. I'm not going to say anymore. From my lowly point of view, everything seemed piss-poor. Just left a bitter taste in my mouth--about a lot of people in general, which I'm aware means little-to-nothing.

I'm a bit relieved now to find out it was Graatch who played Falun, though.

P.S. I'm glad that I chose leader back then, than stick around with his monkey butt. And let's not forget how important equipment is...apparently.

Where one person sees rewards, another sees slight or punishment, and there's no pleasing everyone.

Personally, I think the crap just got stacked too high, and everyone sort of lost interest, or didn't care.

- I think the only thing I need to point out is the number of kills for each cabal. Fortress - 44. Empire - 1. Outlander - 36. Conspiracy? Perhaps.

If you're trying to imply that an evil shaman empowered by me and in Tribunal intentionally kills tons more Fortress folk and Outlanders than Imperials, well, I think you're right.

You obviously didn't pay much attention to the quarrel between myself and Falun then.

I was mainly comparing the fact he killed more Fortress than Outlanders. And I can only speculate why this is, but I'd venture to guess it's because of his cowardly nature, and the fact he wouldn't go against odds or against opponents he couldn't see, unless he was 100% positive he would come out victorious or alive. Only speculation though.

In short, he killed 44 Fortress throughout his entire life. I killed 16 Empire. I was removed from Tribunal not once, but twice, for killing other cabal members and raiding while in "off-duty" time. Then it is mentioned not-so-subtly that he was raiding with Empire against the Fortress. This is something I addressed to Immortals, Fortress, Tribunal and several other people, and still, he never abided by his own ruling.

But please, continue to glorify him.

For Dalteric:
And I have to question Dalteric on this one. Brinrok mentioned this on Dioxide's. Why would an Immortal diliberately allow someone to lead while so many others didn't want him in that position? Falun clearly drove Tribunal into the ground in so many different ways (pause for effect). Brinrok's question on Dioxide's was as follows: "So, my question to Dalteric is this: Is a leader to you, in the Tribunal cabal entirely a Divine choice, where you decide the leader, and everyone else has to follow, or do you try at all to get the people that the Tribunals would actually choose as their leader?"

To me, this poses a fine question, in dire need of answering.

And the fact Dalteric also had nothing to reply to my also not-so-subtle goodbyes leaves a bad taste in my mouth. Really shows a lack of interest.

>For Dalteric:
>And I have to question Dalteric on this one. Brinrok mentioned
>this on Dioxide's. Why would an Immortal diliberately allow
>someone to lead while so many others didn't want him in that
>position? Falun clearly drove Tribunal into the ground in so
>many different ways (pause for effect).

I think Falun was a valid choice at the point at which he was picked. The problem then became, because he ran the cabal into the ground, there weren't a lot of good choices to replace him.

>And the fact Dalteric also had nothing to reply to my also
>not-so-subtle goodbyes leaves a bad taste in my mouth. Really
>shows a lack of interest.

One of the skills you have to develop as an immortal is knowing when nothing you will say will make someone happy. I'm not sure if Dalteric got that vibe from you, but I sure did.

It's a shame, because I really liked Kasdenn up until about the last day or so of his life, but the way you frame your forum presence is just not winning.

Strange how a "game" can bring about some disappointment, but it does sometimes. A fair amount of effort and thought was put into Kasdenn, to start with, only to be let down by nearly everyone, except his enemies, who were always exciting to battle with, verbally and phsically. And I suppose I am still bitter because of Dalteric's appearance towards lack of interest in anything I've had to say, be it contructive criticism or just criticism, it shouldn't matter.

Much like Nepenthe commented above, I have attempted to stay out of this, however, I had planned to mention this after both you and Falun were gone--until much like Nep, you really disappointed me at the end.

You were removed twice. The first time, I spent a lot of time deciding who was in the right, having a conflict between one of the more popular magistrates and the Provost isn't really a winning solution. I decided to let it follow the natural course, as long as you got another shot at returning--which you did, and I believe you were promoted back to Galadon rather quickly.

You were removed again, and I was watching this time. I was on the verge of re-inducting you, and demoting Falun--was in fact discussing it with your Patron lord, when you decided to attack Dulmisa in the Voralian City, using Tribunal powers that hadn't expired from when you last put them up as a Trib. At that point, I decided you had made your choice and that was it in terms of Tribs.

I really liked Kasdenn for the majority of his life, and had placed him in the upper echelon of magistrates at that time--but you did do some things, just like Falun, to irk me. You were in the running for the Provost at the same time he was, but it didn't go your way--if you recall, right before that, there were some discussions about your behaviour in regards to other members of the cabal. Was your character mistreated? I don't think so. You certainly had some things to overcome, but when things went poorly you chose to chuck all the tribunal hours to attack Dulmisa in a span of maybe 10 ticks. I know I had just time enough to decide a course of action and vis before you jumped on her.

Was Falun the best choice for Provost when he was picked? I don't know, he certainly seemed to be, and my comments on his performance I have made already. If you have any other questions for me, you can contact me at: dalteric@carrionfields.com

- You obviously didn't pay much attention to the quarrel between myself and Falun then.

I paid a good bit of attention to it. It made for interesting roleplay on both your parts. You both did well with it.

- I was mainly comparing the fact he killed more Fortress than Outlanders. And I can only speculate why this is, but I'd venture to guess it's because of his cowardly nature, and the fact he wouldn't go against odds or against opponents he couldn't see, unless he was 100% positive he would come out victorious or alive. Only speculation though.

I'd agree with most of this.

- But please, continue to glorify him.

If that's what you think I've done, I can't change that. I think he overall a very good character who had some flaws. You can focus on his cowardly nature all you want, and that's valid, but I put much more weight into the roleplay he created by his own roleplay.

So his actions towards me can be pawned off as "good roleplay".

I try to look at this from many angles, but I keep wanting to come back to the fact that he just wanted me out. He was looking for a reason to keep me down. And when he found one that supposedly went along the lines of his "good roleplay", I was the one getting the shaft. All I'm trying to say is his actions were nothing short of abusing game mechanics.

And to me, it just seems like there was more emphasis put in Falun doing well than there was me doing absolutely nothing wrong, according to the guide lines of the Tribunal cabal, which is where my hate for Falun originated.

You seem to be completely disregarding the fact that your neutral law character was spending a lot of time with a cabal that could loosely be described as chaotic (The fortress) and attacking a lot of members of a cabal that promotes order, albeit oppressive fascist order (Empire).

I for one interacted very little with both of you, but to me, both you and Falun seemed well within the roleplay boundaries of the their creation. It seems to me that you're still upset with the fact that he was your 'nemesis' in that without him, your character would have acheived a lot more. But then, most of Valg's characters could be called my 'nemesis', because I delete in shame after being pk'd by him .

In closing, don't hate the player, hate the game...for being so damn addictive.

Uh, huh? I did not play Falun. It was Graanak.

Not sure why it matters to you anyway.

Realized a moment too late. Disregard.

Well, this was human evil shaman #2 yeah..Boilard was a test run for Falun.

Anyway, had a lot of different parts of his life..I would have to say the most fun I had was running around with Kaazra/Ahtahthurn.

Trib: Sorry for leaving you guys now, but I really just couldn't take the experience anymore..trib..well trib is something else. I apologize to the warriors for yelling and telling you guys what to do sometimes..but after watching criminal 987 get away..it just gets to you It was fun though or I wouldn't have stuck it out 400 hours. Lots of good people.

Fort: I have to thank you guys for one thing. Falun was going to be a guy that only hunted chaotics and criminals and outlanders. I think by rank 40 I had 1 PK, I avoided everyone for RP reasons..but after 7 man group gank attempt #32 I had enough and just enjoyed ripping you guys to shreds. Thanks for the change in direction!

Battle: Same old same old. Har! lets war with tribs and beat down a bunch of noobs! har! lame. Special shout out to the worst rager berserker I've had the pleasure of helping kill, Dolza. Was cool watching the commander and drillmaster sit at the gates with out of form shifters walking around

Outlander: I don't want to be a jerk, but 400 hours and a lot of it spent at hero and you didn't try to raid once?

Empire: Helped you all out because of Khas. I turned down an opportunity to take high priest at the end because I was fairly sure Grunlath would just anathema falun.


Hmm..Okay I think that's it! Was a good run, had planned to age death but whatever. I picked up my PBF so hopefully it shows up soon..pk guess...90 and 3, 2.25 gank.

Someone else pointed us to a "log" you posted with an Immortal revealing Falun's player to you. I double-checked it, thinking someone needs a talk. Sadly, the information in the log doesn't match with our internal records. (In other words, the log is made up.)

I'm sure glad I spent that time looking for it instead of doing something useful.

Thanks for reminding me why you're long gone from this website, and staying that way. It's one thing to play a jackass character, and another thing to just be a jackass.

valguarnera@carrionfields.com

Not that I have zero faith, I do, but is it actually possible
to be 100% certain that -no- immortal had done that, using your
internal records? Does the mud actually log every time an
immortal says something to a mortal? While I got no reason to
believe the vast majority of the imm pop cares about things
such as whether so-and-so is so-and-so, I wouldn't be surprised
if an imm or two isn't a 100% clean-handed, it happens.

Of course it doesn't appear that in any way to have effected
Granaak in the slightest concerning his pbf comments, even if
it were true that someone knew who he was. Just curious I
suppose.

- Runaktla

Yes, I'm sure the log in question (the one with the imm telling him 'Granaak') is doctored. I ran my methodology by Nep as well before making that public, and we're in agreement.

No, I don't care to explain how I know it's doctored except to say that hard disk space is cheap. Assume we log anything vaguely important.

I wouldn't be surprised if an imm or two isn't a 100% clean-handed, it happens.

Why is that easier to believe than an especially bitter player doctoring a log to call attention to him? The number of people who can see IPs is small, and the number of them with the tools to research past characters is still smaller.

If you have a reason not to trust an IMM, send it to imps@cf. If you don't trust an IMP (or in this case two of them), send it to the other IMPs. If you don't trust all of the IMPs, Top Mud Sites is an excellent resource for finding another place to play, because who would want to play a game where everyone at the top level is corrupt?

Of course it doesn't appear that in any way to have effected
Granaak in the slightest concerning his pbf comments, even if
it were true that someone knew who he was.

Certainly seems that way. Given that his character absorbed no ill effects (and in fact received several IC rewards such as leadership), one might conclude that the staff acted in good faith.

valguarnera@carrionfields.com

>Certainly seems that way. Given that his character absorbed no ill effects (and in fact received several IC rewards such as leadership), one might conclude that the staff acted in good faith.

On the other hand, Falun did go 392 hours, tatted and vindicated/provosted without (a) a leader weap, (b) a title, (c) any immortal rewarded quests/skills/supps. One could also conclude that personal distate of the player motivated this to some degree. I'm not saying this is the case, but it is a valid alternative.

I think we were waiting to see something non-cowardly from Falun to give him a title. Who knew that many hours would pass without it happening?

I mean, I guess we could have titled him Falun, Holy #### Is This Guy a Chicken, but at least I personally was holding out hoping he would do something extra-tough-ass-cool and make me want to give him a scary one.

I don't think Trib does leader weapons these days, but I don't run the cabal so I can't say. As for imm-award stuff, if you read PBFs you'll see they (mostly) go out for single moments of awesomeness or role contest wins.

I think "Falun, Whose Belly Shines Yellow in the Light of the Full Moon, Provost Magistrate" would have been a good one. The last place he was during a full moon was outside of a city.

I know if I played a trib with enemies that could really #### you up during a full moon, and could camoflage themselves so you didn't know if they were around, I'd spend a lot of time strolling through woods in the light of the full moon.

The way you rabidly defend Granaak as though you were his prison bitch isn't doing a lot to prop him up.

The guy did a lot of cool things with Falun, but there's also room for improvement there. Some idea of where would presumably be helpful in making the next character even better.

Or you can keep telling everyone that, damnit, the Emperor is wearing very nice clothes, thank you very much.

I like Granaak's style. If standing in someone's corner and defending them against harsh, and in some cases nonsensical, criticism is being someone's "prison bitch," then I'm Granaak's prison bitch. Are you Valg's prison bitch? It's always rose and cheap champagne when the two of you get together.

I'll also add that you coined the Emperor's new clothes routine when it comes to CF. Don't be mad when I take a page out of your book. "Nothing is ever wrong, ever. It may seem like things are wrong, but they aren't. Trust us."

I have to go clean my cell now.

>I'll also add that you coined the Emperor's new clothes
>routine when it comes to CF. Don't be mad when I take a page
>out of your book. "Nothing is ever wrong, ever. It may seem
>like things are wrong, but they aren't. Trust us."

Would that be why, when I'm active, I'm changing and tweaking things every week to (try to) make the game more balanced/fun/better?

I'll make changes where I think players have legitimate points. This happens pretty often.

And while the running laughs about Vlad and you and Granaak are a real riot, it is easily apparent that either a) you know Granaak IRL b)you brought him over from another MUD or vice versa or c) just enjoy unilaterally defending him from even the most minor slight. Otherwise, how can you defend a character that you never interacted with or saw IC? (based on your remark you don't play anymore).

While I can agree Nepenthe and Valgruarnera tend to have each other's backs, I've seen them disagree and I'd be hard to pressed to convince an innocent bystander that you and Granaak aren't boyfriend/girlfriend, brothers or gay lovers or what have you. I definitely can't say the same about Valg and Nep, because I don't always see one running to the defend the other if he gets slighted. Anyways, best of luck and go roll a char already

Leaving only your colorful theories for posterity, without my hate-filled defenses that I am, in fact, not a prison bitch.

If I can find a criticism of Granaak where you didn't rush to his defense, I'd have said that.

He got tattooed, he got decent imm interaction. That's sort of what you're hoping for from an empowered character. As for a title, that would have been my responsibility and I rarely, rarely title, for a few reasons, none of those reasons because I have grudges against the player. As far as Granaak goes, if I knew it was Granaak who played Falun (at one point I may have known, but it's not something that stuck in my mind), it wouldn't have made a difference to me. I don't know enough about Granaak to care one way or another, so he had a clean slate with me.

All in all I thought he was a pretty interesting character, fairly well played. Perfect? No. But he acted very much like I believe a shaman should.

How about popping Drok in the snout for being such a sour arse toward a dedicated follower of yours!

Nep's major complaint about Falun happened to be something I agreed with. While he would enter an uneven fight, he often wouldn't stay long, no matter the repercussions to his allies. While this can be legitimate in your roleplay, the survival instinct or even cowardice, it is something that needs to be taken into account.

The whole point of my post was me conveying my surprise
that you can check your records for that and be able to
tell 100% that it did not occur. I did not bring it up
to give any imm staff a hard time, it was an unadulturated,
"wow, that's impressive, you can do that?" surprise, and
not an "Oh yeah, sure, right buddy. Uh huh" surprise.

As far as players doctoring logs vs. immortals not having
100% clean hands, yeah I know, and I tend to side with the
imms, or I just worry about more important things such as
whether or not its raining in Timbuktoo right now. I just
disbelieve that everything can be airtight, that's all. I
was sort of expecting more of a response like "We
generally weed out the immature dorks that are looking to
be imms early on. With one exception of one that was two
years ago* I believe most immortals could care less about
this sorta thing."

Just throwing this out there, I don't want everyone in
imm-land to think everyone in player-land distrusts them
with a vengeance.

- Runaktla

(*) I'm not referring to anyone in particular here.

Unless you youreself told him 'Granaak' and cleaned up the log

Unless log-editing is impossible. But is there anything impossible for an implementor?

From other hand, does that really matter? I do not really care if imms knows who am I and which characters I've played before (though believe me, I've been NOT very popular, and guess amongst the imms too ;P)

That log with a shopkeeper flicking him the bird... Just wanted to say that there's a bug in the rom code so that commands aren't logged if you do them while switched into a mob. Can be very useful at times

valguarnera@carrionfields.com

Yeah, having fought you a descent amount, I would have to say I completely agreed with Nepenthe on this character. You really might fool some people into thinking your a stud by never taking any risks, you might even fool yourself, with how much crap you talked over ganking me down 5 to 1 with the Empire in the Fort. But really, I saw enough of you, and went against you enough to know that I have never (that I can remember) come across someone who was more afraid of dying, as a character. I guess it's up to each player what odds he's willing to fight at, but each fight I go into, I kind of do a rough percentage of 3 things.
1. Chance of me killing him 2. Chance of him killing me 3. Chance of one of us wording
Now, Brinrok and Falun were on the complete opposite of this spectrum. Brinrok is completely willing to fight with a 10% chance of killing against a 50% chance of death, while Falun, on the other hand, I would picture wording with a 95% chance of killing and a 1% chance of death every time. To me, a shaman is supposed to be a fanatical enforcer of their Lord's will, and you didn't portray that to me at all. Bar none, every time I came across you, all I thought was, jeez, this guy really wants to protect his set badly

As for you getting Provost, I really have to question the Imm on this one, but not in a bad way. I had thought that the leader should, in some respects, be the person that others would choose to lead them, and would willingly follow, which apparently was wrong, as I know there were at least 4 Tribunals who were actively trying to get you removed from the Cabal when you became leader. So, my question to Dalteric is this: Is a leader to you, in the Tribunal cabal entirely a Divine choice, where you decide the leader, and everyone else has to follow, or do you try at all to get the people that the Tribunals would actually choose as their leader? I'm not asking this in an accusing way, as I can see either way on this, but I'm just looking for your thoughts, because I've never played a Tribunal.

Anyway, yeah, like Nepenthe said, if you want to improve, worry less about dying, because really, most people could pull that off if that was all they were worried about, which is what every interaction with you screamed to me.

With both my characters. Uurakhi was a soldier of the Hornet, and therefore, you were the closest thing to a God to him. That's the reason I gave you that Weaponmaster's Scimitar.

With Kruuank, well, we had some fun. One of these days I'll get around to sending you that e-mail, until then, keep on keeping on.

I want to see if Nepenthe's observation that Falun wasn't on the list of top post-mag Tribunals ended up correct, seeing as he had 103 kills.

Criminal kills, not just PKs. There's a difference. Could have PKed 500 people and still have only 10 criminal kills. One does not necessarily have anything to do with the other.

"Knowledge speaks, but wisdom listens." - Jimi Hendrix

.

~

In terms of total criminal kills I'm sure he was doing decent. He was a fairly long-lived character. In terms of kills/hours played he was definitely on the low end for a Vindicator, but then, he also progressed on to Provost for a large chunk of his life.

Like anything else, you can draw any number of conclusions from the numbers. Overall, I'd say Falun was a pretty effective Tribunal.

I liked Falun. One of only a few that Harkan got to interact with out of his domain. Gave me something to do on the 'mainland' We kicked alot of butt. I thought you diserved at least a lastname or some cool title. You lived a long time. Awesome.

No, really, never liked you and your holier than thou personna.

But, I hope you had a good run. And I'd be curious to hear why you deleted, and see some good-byes.

What happened here?