Wed Dec 1 20:03:39 2004

At 7 o'clock PM, Day of Freedom, 32nd of the Month of Winter
on the Theran calendar Yuyuya perished, never to return.

Interesting bunch of posts on this thread. I think that overall you did a pretty solid job. I thought there was nothing wrong with your RP at all, and you were a good Villager.

I agree that Ordasen and I aren't as involved with the day-to-day activities of the Village as Imms have been in the past. I know that I don't have nearly as much time for the MUD right now as I'd like, but I'm still on here and there, and I know he is as well. My style has always been more hands off than Thror, even when I was around a lot more than I am now. I don't see that changing; I like to let the mortals run the Cabal, and get involved if things seem like they need more attention on my part.

As for ponchos, I personally wouldn't condone making a trophy of a Villager's corpse to wear around Thera, but I could see RP reasons for using the power on a Villager's corpse. That being said, I could see a lot of Villagers being pretty pissed off at whoever made that poncho - like you were. I think this comes down to an individual's belief system, and what their character would think of such an action. Grounds for removal? Maybe...depends on the situation.

Ordasen and I are two different people, and we have different philosophies when it comes to dealing with the Village. I am perfectly fine with that, and with the way he does things. Would I do the same things? Nope, not all the time. But I think it works overall. There's supposed to be conflict within the Village, differing opinions, viewpoints, ways of waging the war, and our two different personalities add to that, ensure that every role that works its way into the Village doesn't have the 'magi burned my town now I want revenge' angle. Just my opinion.

BattleRagers are not Imperials. They aren't an 'army' in the conventional sense. They are a bunch of freakin' barbarians. The titles that we came up with mirror RL (because it conveyed the idea that we wanted to convey at the time) but they certainly were never intended to imply the level of authority that exists in the RL military. If you get ordered to do something by the General, or the Captain, or the Drillmaster...do it or not, up to you, but accept whatever IC consequences may come from that individual. You still have to treat them with respect, however; but I have a hard time visualizing a situation where I would boot anyone for noncomplience with an order. Ordasen on the other hand...who knows.

As for the log, it was pretty obvious to me that was a case of bad timing on both you and Acaga's part, and good timing on Urog's part. I don't think you were a coward; I think wimpy, fleeing, drawing your enemy out, using terrain are all viable options. Fleeing doesn't mean you are a coward in my eyes. In Acaga's? Sure, maybe it does. I do think that it is obvious that he was pissed off as all hell that Urog got him so easily, and I guarantee that colored the way he interacted with you following the incident. Your fault that he died? Nope, but you were an easy scapegoat, and he directed his anger and frustration at you, and got under your skin enough to force your response.

I do think you could have handled the whole situation better. But hey, that's your character, your personality, your way of interacting with others. I'm cool with that as well. But that was a situation that could have been diffused, in my opinion, and not come to a call to the Circle.

Fire giants are evil, no two ways about it. You want to help goods, hold hands with neutrals, think that 'destroying magic is more important than being evil' play a ####ing cloud giant. When you play an evil character like a neutral, you are copping out, plain and simple. Taking the easy road. It's like requesting gear from a neutral mob when you're a good, so they'll attack you; that's pathetic. You want the benefits that come with being a good, suck up the downsides and don't whine about it.

Finally, you deleted. Maybe you didn't enjoy playing the character anymore, maybe you thought you didn't have a chance to do whatever it was you set out to do, which is fine. If not (or even if), the only message it sends to me is that you accepted what happened to you and didn't have the intestinal fortitude to stick with the character and see what happens next. I think that some of the best roleplaying opportunities drop out of the sky on us through adversity. Some people sieze them, take the character to the next level. Some people don't.

Kastellyn the Devourer of Magic, Lord of Legends

>Fire giants are evil, no two ways about it. You want to help
>goods, hold hands with neutrals, think that 'destroying magic
>is more important than being evil' play a ####ing cloud giant.
> When you play an evil character like a neutral, you are
>copping out, plain and simple. Taking the easy road. It's
>like requesting gear from a neutral mob when you're a good, so
>they'll attack you; that's pathetic. You want the benefits
>that come with being a good, suck up the downsides and don't
>whine about it.


I think this is a solid reason why people don't enjoy RP as much or try anything really hard RP-wise. It seems like you're punished more for it than rewarded and people get slammed quickly for bad/iffy RP and barely rewarded for decent/good RP. CF, IMHO, sets such high standards for RP in comparison to most MUDs that I think decent RP here would be excellent almost anywhere else.

Thresinok being an example and Amarion. He bravely dies in a Duergar raid, putting him down 18K and loosing 1/3rd of a CON in exchange for 500 quest XP?

Man, I'd never RP again, save for my own enjoyment, and run like hell from IMMteraction with a risk/reward ratio like that.

I like the idea of XP for good roleplay, but it's given out too infrequently and in such microscopic doses to make any real difference. No offense, but 500xp ain't jack ####, that's one dead mob while ranking. Why put myself out for that? Why not just do what I find fun?

I also really find all these "lackey" titles and rank-sitting titles to be really counterproductive and of an almost ruthless mindset where you're quick to strike down and slow to reward. Isn't that what distention is made for? I'd wager some people are a little afraid of the IMMs and RP just to get by.

Just asking for more carrot, less stick, and a refocus on fun. CF is fun, or else we wouldn't play it, but has gotten really ruthless.

If you really want to nurture someone, you correct and warn them before punishing them.

I have seen similar, you get smacked for one thing, but when you do something amazing or something else, its an immortal cb : Good job!
Wow.. so I get smacked down for one #### up, but I get a good job for fighting off a freakin army? bleh.
More carrots!

(n/t)

Good read and good attitude Kastellyn it makes me wish you were around more often. You're missed when you're not around.

On another note, I have to agree 1000% with CFer's post. I had started to write a long version based on a similar premise but short and sweet is always better. Players don't want to antagonize Imms at least in game where it can have immediate and costly results. I had a player who told a mocking riddle about a god (the answer guessed by others though so clearly I wasn't alone in my thoughts) and when next I logged on my strength, dexterity and charisma had been lowered to 3. (A reason why I have severe misgivings when people say Cador wasn't that bad.) Stuff like that lasts forever, and there are all ranges of in-between. Last I checked, beating the crap out of someone wasn't fun for the one getting the crap beat out of him. The common goal I'd 'hope' for all involved in CF is to make it as fun and immersive as possible so that mortals and immortals alike can enjoy themselves. Sadly it 'appears' to oft time deteriorate into a case of Home team vrs the visitors and I'll let you guess who is who. This is a massive over generalization and I'm by no means sticking this on the entire immstaff, hopefully things can develop moreso towards a positive relationship as opposed to the just shy of abusive tough love.

I was suprised to read that you've been playing for a number of years. I travelled with you and had you pegged for at best a yearling.

You were fun to travel with and seemed to have plenty of knowledge, but your mannerisms led me to believe that you were fairly new to the realm.

The one event that sticks out in my mind is when I was with you in the Elemental Temple and I saw a Duergar shaman pop in for a moment. I warned you about him and you didn't seem to understand the danger he presented.

You rested and began talking about some off the wall stuff even when I warned you that he was now invisible to me and would likely summon one of us away. Me being a thief and he a duergar I assumed (Rightly) it would be me. I asked you to take us to the front of the temple so we could at least hit him as he came in if he tried that.

You kept on still seeming not to understand that it was likely that at least one of us was likely to suffer in the next few seconds. *Poof* I was summoned and before I got my berrings I was blinded and in battle.

I knew I was toast unless you came through, and you did. I told you I was blinded and needed help and my dexterity kept me in the fight long enough for you to come aid me.

You managed to drive off the Duergar momentarily and then...you began talking and acting like nothing was amiss!

I had to practically beg you to get me out of the grove, since I was now poisoned, cursed and blinded.

You finally got me out of the woods, but since you were a wood-elf and had been moving for a while, I had no idea where you were. I had to remind you again of the situation I was in, and you casually mention you can see the duergar...and start talking about something else.

I was trying hard to keep from punching your name on my screen, and finaly got you to get me to Galadon. Where in you just said. We're in Galadon. I had to ask several times where, and you answered Galadon once, ignored me a couple times, said Market square then left.

How I survived that I don't know, but I didn't want to travel with you after that unless I absolutely had too!

Still It was a fairly fun day and I ranked a few while I was with you, and I did have fun erven though I felt like I was about to have an hemmorage.

That being said, since I thought you were Noobish, I was willing to cut you some slack. Heh. Now I'm not so sure! =)

Anyway, it was a fun day and one tat sticks out in my head, and lately there weren't many of them.

I don't have a computer anymore so no CF for me, but I hope you have fun in the fields if you keep playing.

I'm too tired of it to spend much time writing about it, but in general I deleted because several things happened which showcased how cf has changed for the worse, in enough significant areas that it made having fun impossible.

In short: villagers making ponchos of other villagers has always been (from the Vass/Nimb/Bolt times through holtz up to and including Thror) one of the biggest no-no's, virtually always resulting in uninduction, and when not, in a very harsh penalty otherwise. Yet now it happens and people don't blink an eye. I suppose I blame the lack of real imm supervision, neither Kastellyn (who I want to thank, our talks were both interesting and fun and are a large part of why I've played cf for the years that I have) nor Ordasen (who I believe behaved horribly at the end, and in such a manner as to deliberately make the game less fun for someone, by refusing even a word of explanation) really watch over the village or involve themselves in anything but a very remote fashion.

The amusing thing about that last bit is that my one problem with Thror (which he acknowledged in his farewell) was that he was often far too deeply involved in the details of villager goings on, and now the problem is not enough involvement. But that's how it is, the balance has not been found.

Another example is the absurd and constant sacrifice of roleplay for easy rationalizations that a player can use to make it easier to do what he wants. I'm sure you the player are a fine person, player-of-Acaga, but in my estimation you deserved nothing but scorn, for many reasons. Chief among them however were your making of the poncho, as I noted, but worse, your constant forsaking of your evil nature. You would be helping storm giants, elves, other goodies, without caring. How many times, over how many years, do imms and other people have to say that it iss wrong and and a complete lack of good rp? Every time it was ever raised, with everyone not just you, the response was the same "it helps in the war, so it's ok."

It's not ok. You can't throw who and what your character is just because it would be expedient, just because you don't want to have the harder time that you are in fact supposed to have. The easy example being, would you quaff a potion if it would help in the war? Of course not. Your role as a villager would never accept that. But your role as a fire giant, which is just as important, was totally ignored, at least in this regard, that I saw. And I repeat, you are not the only person. You are in fact part of the majority. Which is sad.

And what makes it even worse is that those players who actually do what they are supposed to, and make the tension and friction between opposing aligns and other roleplay issues, and roleplay as they are supposed to, giving credence to align/ethos/etc., are the ones who in the end lose out because everyone else gives them a hard time. Iborenn being a perfect example, saying I was a hinderance to the village at one point. Which was ridiculous.

And yet another example: Ackuol as General thought he could order me to go level. I told him I was still working on my new skills - I was level 40 or 41 at the time. He got angry, said I was disobeying a direct order and that he was going to speak to the commander. Unfortunately he died shortly thereafter, but I am sure he would have. And, I am sure Iborenn would have uninducted me. But you know what? I spoke to Kastellyn about it a few days later and I was right, villagers are not slaves, not bloodoaths. Rather we are individuals who band together and in times of war, sure, you follow orders, but no way, no how is a general or other officer given the right to order other villagers in this way. But they wouldn't have paid the price for their mistake, I would have. I would have been uninducted. Perhaps I would have been re-inducted by an Imm, who might then set them straight, but I'm still the one who suffers, having to re-learn all the skills and powers, etc. People who think they know better, or worse, think they can just do whatever they want and not have to live with the sacrifices or consequences that a race or cabal or a history might demand in terms of roleplay. This is a big problem.

There are many such examples.

The only way these things change is with imm supervision, which just is not there now. But it is endemic and it, along with what happened with Ordasen at the end, is the reason I deleted.

I KNEW IT!
I called that you were graatch like a month before you deleted

1. Uninduction for not ranking seems reasonable to me. I was uninducted from scion for not ranking, the argument being that because of my rank I couldn't defend against heroes. I understand that argument (although in my case the timing was right after two days of failing to find a group, so I didn't like that so much, but I'd been sub-hero for a long time either way).

2. I don't see why I fire giant wouldn't help a storm giant if it benefits the fire giant. I'm not sure the storm giant should be helping the fire giant though. Being evil doesn't mean you can't carry out good acts for selfish motives. Being good does mean you can't carry out evil acts for selfish motives, so the onus is mainly on the good-aligns to behave better, not on the evils to behave worse, imho.

And yet another example: Ackuol as General thought he could order me to go level. I told him I was still working on my new skills - I was level 40 or 41 at the time. He got angry, said I was disobeying a direct order and that he was going to speak to the commander. Unfortunately he died shortly thereafter, but I am sure he would have. And, I am sure Iborenn would have uninducted me. But you know what? I spoke to Kastellyn about it a few days later and I was right, villagers are not slaves, not bloodoaths. Rather we are individuals who band together and in times of war, sure, you follow orders, but no way, no how is a general or other officer given the right to order other villagers in this way. But they wouldn't have paid the price for their mistake, I would have. I would have been uninducted. Perhaps I would have been re-inducted by an Imm, who might then set them straight, but I'm still the one who suffers, having to re-learn all the skills and powers, etc. People who think they know better, or worse, think they can just do whatever they want and not have to live with the sacrifices or consequences that a race or cabal or a history might demand in terms of roleplay. This is a big problem.


Spend some time in the military and then tell me that a General can't order you to do something. If anything your ooc feelings and thoughts conflicted with how your character should have acted.

1. The village is not the same as the military forces of a real world country.

2. Kastellyn (and all the other Imms who have addressed this over the years, which are many) agreed.

The reality is that YOUR ooc feelings are conflicting with how the characters should behave. Your experience with a real world military (if you have any) is making you believe differently than what the characters would, and how villagers have historically behaved. It is one of the pillars (no pun) of the cabal's differences with the Empire, that villagers are not drones to be ordered around in such a manner.

>The reality is that YOUR ooc feelings are conflicting with how
>the characters should behave. Your experience with a real
>world military (if you have any) is making you believe
>differently than what the characters would, and how villagers
>have historically behaved. It is one of the pillars (no pun)
>of the cabal's differences with the Empire, that villagers are
>not drones to be ordered around in such a manner.

Sure it's not your feelings conflicting?

Yes, I'm sure. Because every battle imm ever to speak on it (Kastellyn most recently) said the same thing.

You would be wrong, since it is and has always been dependant upon the situation. It has always been a statement of "one of you will no longer be a rager or deserves to be". Meaning that if the person had a valid RP reason to make a poncho, then the other screwed up in some way. However many use to make ponchos from #### which is where they initaly got in trouble. Poncho's from kobolds and other things, etc.

There is also a diffrence in making a poncho of a rager, (for rp reasons) and wearing said poncho. If Acaga had worn it, then yes. He would probably had my boot up his ass. However it took it to show me how Yuyuya wasn't worthy of my religion and was damn whiny.

So no, its not a thing that always will get insta-pimp smacked down for doing. Each case is looked at and decided if the person had a legit reason. This time it was seen as legit.

This thread was about Ackuol's ordering and the comparison to Empire.

As to the poncho thing, that's not my experience, and it's not what has been said before by other imms. Despite what you claim here, though I'm sure that's how you feel about it now.

>Yes, I'm sure. Because every battle imm ever to speak on it
> Kastellyn most recently) said the same thing.


So what orders can your general/commander/imm give you then?
You are supposed to follow the orders of your leaders. You can petition against those orders but you still need to follow them.

If you didn't like his orders you could always have called him into the circle...(if you'd ranked into his level )

Seems like there's a correct and an incorrect way to handle being "wronged" by your cabal leadership. If they do something to you that you feel is contrary to the "rules" set down for the cabal by its governing immortals, well, take that up with the immortals.

It seems similar to the whole deal with people getting screwed by corrupt tribunals, i.e. something that should be resolved in game.

Also, to some degree or another, cabal immortals typically give some leeway to mortal leaders to interpret the "rules" and create tone and direction for the cabal. Maybe the battle leaders were okay with the current mortal leadership taking the cabal in a more "martial" direction in which orders from a "superior" are something members are obligated to obey?

First thing, I think you are taking this too far, and way to upset to think rationally.

Second, I played Acaga with the thought that magic was evil, not dark elves, not fire giants, magic and anything associated with it was evil. I don't know how many discussions I had with various maran on the subject. As for Acaga, he was a fire giant, naturally, but he didn't see himself as evil. I aided many lightwalkers over the course of his life, in one way or another. If you think about it, me knocking off the emperor for instance was a big help to lightwalkers.....and going by a purely good v evil standpoint, that wouldn't have been what I wanted to accomplish. There is more than good/evil cut and dry.

Third, I trophied your corpse, I told Ordasen about it, and yes, it has been frowned upon in the past, it is frowned upon now, but I felt that Acaga was purely within the lines of his roleplay and duty in the village to do that. I made a trophy of a coward, just as I did in the past with Tonri. Cowardice was something that Acaga didn't take lightly, and he made all he could suffer for it. Your gone, live with it, and just quit complaining.

D

>First thing, I think you are taking this too far, and way to
>upset to think rationally.
>
>Second, I played Acaga with the thought that magic was evil,
>not dark elves, not fire giants, magic and anything associated
>with it was evil. I don't know how many discussions I had
>with various maran on the subject. As for Acaga, he was a
>fire giant, naturally, but he didn't see himself as evil. I
>aided many lightwalkers over the course of his life, in one
>way or another. If you think about it, me knocking off the
>emperor for instance was a big help to lightwalkers.....and
>going by a purely good v evil standpoint, that wouldn't have
>been what I wanted to accomplish. There is more than
>good/evil cut and dry.

That is exactly what is wrong, and has been wrong, and has been the subject of countless posts by player and imm alike. It doesn't matter that you wanted to in essence play a cloud giant with a fire giant's body. You were a fire giant. Fire giants come with stuff, and one of those things is being evil. Whether acaga saw himself as evil or not is irrelevant. How many times do imms and others have to say that? You just wanted the easy way out for you, you wanted the benefits of playing a fire giant, but you didn't want to accept the downsides, the consequences, one of which is that your race is evil. You can't just toss that characteristic out just because you are a villager and don't want to have moral fights, just magic fights. And your example with the emperor is just silly. He was your enemy. It doesn't matter what his alignment was in that regard. Side benefits to others are not what cause an action or reaction. Come on, don't pretend not to understand that.

>
>Third, I trophied your corpse, I told Ordasen about it, and
>yes, it has been frowned upon in the past, it is frowned upon
>now, but I felt that Acaga was purely within the lines of his
>roleplay and duty in the village to do that. I made a trophy
>of a coward, just as I did in the past with Tonri. Cowardice
>was something that Acaga didn't take lightly, and he made all
>he could suffer for it. Your gone, live with it, and just
>quit complaining.
>

I'll quit complaining when people behave even close to how they should. Like I said originally, it is not only you, you just happened to be guilty of both things. And as for trophies, I personally watched five of the seven people I recall trophying get uninducted. The other two were punished differently, though not uninducted. It's never been acceptable.

Lastly, Yuyuya never once showed cowardice. Not once. And for you to say otherwise is just plain wrong. And Ordasen wouldn't even talk about it and hear the truth, which is why I deleted. But think what you will, you are already defending so-called roleplay that allows you to ignore alignment, philosophy, history, etc., so what's another little thing in the grand scheme, eh?

>I'll quit complaining when people behave even close to how
>they should

First I liked the character. Was kind of neat.

but this whole should thing...
I'm sure you will disagree, and probably many
others until they have thought about it.

Should means nothing. Other than rules violations:
Not even the imms really
can decide how you 'should' act.
*I hear those gasps. Hush until I'm done.*
They can give guidelines, they can even beat you down
or ban you if you really piss em off.
In the end it is still your character, and you play him/her
as you see fit. Hrm, let me make that a little more clear
as some folk take you wrong. I'll play mine you play yours.
If I wanted to roll up a dark-elf who thought he was a puppy
dog. People might be amused/annoyed/pissed/etc.. but it's
still my choice.

I can see your point about people trying to get advantages
that thier race doesn't normally have. (like grouping with
one of the opposite alignment.) But why would I have to play
a typical fire giant? Normally trying to circumvent the racial
by-play wouldn't have to be even glanced at by an imm.
The players take care of it. Bad fire giant hangs out with goodies
other evils start thrashing him. good normally still kills him.

shut up me, point is people are already acting as they should.
They just aren't acting like you want them to.

Still liked the character. see ya around.
-Dremkal/Bajula

Fire giants are evil. Period.

The alignment is by nature but not forced.. has there ever been a good fire giant?
evil elf? etc.. etc..
They are guidelines. That you should lean this or that way
for race X. But do you HAVE to? No race is any one alignment
period, if that were so there would be no penalty for alingment change
as it couldn't happen.
You, the next time you see an off kilter character (the bad elf, the good duergar etc..) just go right ahead and 'make' him play the way
you want him to. You cannot, no matter what you do.. you can multi-kill him, stuff like that, but you can't make anyone play something different than what they feel like.(which was the point of my first post - you cannot choose how other people play -get it now?)

Their alignment needs to be changed and they should suffer the consequences. But when that does happen, they come running to the forums to whine about it.

You wanna be an (evil race) goodie or neutral you have to face the problems of that. There are some twists you can put in a role to
let your (evil race) character do a few good things, that wouldn't lead to alignment change (imho)

The village is one of the odd ones there, if your role involves
the ragers are brothers above all else, wouldn't that override
the say fire giants natural desire to eat the elf?

Oh almost forgot, Yeah if you play an align changing combo
and get all kinds of messed up over it, no need to whine.

Well this was all about should anyway, How should a villager act?
as the player wants them to. if that causes you to be booted, called
out, killed, hunted, reviled, etc.. Who cares, keep playing the character YOU wanted to. There are always consequences. cope.

Hehe if nothing else you just prompted a role in my head of
a 'tortured-soul' kind of guy, but not the usual kind.
Thanks, been looking for one I could sink my teeth into.
Sorry, bbl, Gotta write this down before I forget.

Please direct all mean comments to him, and nice things to me.
Thanks!


Yuyuya: Can any think of a way past the spirit guardian without being frozen and destroyed?


<14:00:16><3 AM> People near you:
(PK) Urog On the Merchant's Road
(PK) Yuyuya A library of magic
(PK) Grurk On the Merchant's Road


You follow Urog east.
An impossible hallway


A long talon of a brass dragon has fallen to the ground here.
(Hide) (Red Aura) (Orderly Aura) Urog is here.
(Chaotic Aura) (Rigid) Yuyuya is here, fighting the spirit-knight.
(Gold Aura) (Orderly Aura) (White Aura) An ethereal guardian shouts a challenge and attacks.

<14:02:28><6 AM>
The spirit-knight is unaffected by Yuyuya's punch!
The spirit-knight sends Yuyuya sprawling with a powerful bash.
The spirit-knight's bash scratches Yuyuya.

<14:02:29><6 AM>
The spirit-knight's freezing bite maims Yuyuya!

<14:02:32><7 AM>
The spirit-knight is unaffected by Yuyuya's punch!
The spirit-knight's freezing bite maims Yuyuya!

<14:02:35><7 AM>
Yuyuya delivers a blow of deadly force!
The spirit-knight is unaffected by Yuyuya's punch!

<14:02:39><7 AM>
The spirit-knight is unaffected by Yuyuya's punch!
The spirit-knight's blast of frost MASSACRES Yuyuya!

<14:02:43><7 AM>
The spirit-knight is unaffected by Yuyuya's punch!
The spirit-knight's freezing bite devastates Yuyuya!
The spirit-knight's blast of frost *** DEVASTATES *** Yuyuya!
Yuyuya leaves north.
Yuyuya has fled!

<14:02:49><7 AM>
You follow Urog north.
A bedroom


(Hide) (Red Aura) (Orderly Aura) Urog is here.
(Chaotic Aura) (Rigid) Yuyuya is here.

<14:02:51><7 AM>
Urog trips Yuyuya, sending him to the ground.
Urog steps out of the shadows.
Urog's trip scratches Yuyuya.
Urog kicks Yuyuya while he's down!
Urog's vicious attack devastates Yuyuya!
Yuyuya yells 'Help! Urog just tripped me!'

<14:02:53><7 AM>

<14:02:53><7 AM>
Urog's brilliant radiance MUTILATES Yuyuya!
Yuyuya leaves south.
Yuyuya has fled!

<14:02:58><7 AM>
Urog scans south.

<14:03:00><7 AM>
You follow Urog south.
An impossible hallway


A long talon of a brass dragon has fallen to the ground here.
(Hide) (Red Aura) (Orderly Aura) Urog is here.
(Chaotic Aura) (Rigid) Yuyuya is here.
(Red Aura) (Chaotic Aura) (Rigid) (WANTED) Acaga is here, fighting the spirit-knight.
(Gold Aura) (Orderly Aura) (White Aura) An ethereal guardian shouts a challenge and attacks.
Acaga delivers a blow of deadly force!
The spirit-knight is unaffected by Acaga's divine power!
The spirit-knight is unaffected by Acaga's divine power!
The spirit-knight's freezing bite mauls Acaga.

<14:03:01><7 AM>
Urog trips Yuyuya, sending him to the ground.
Urog steps out of the shadows.
Urog's trip scratches Yuyuya.
Urog kicks Yuyuya while he's down!
Urog's vicious attack devastates Yuyuya!
Yuyuya yells 'Help! Urog just tripped me!'

<14:03:02><7 AM>
The spirit-knight is unaffected by Acaga's divine power!
The spirit-knight is unaffected by Acaga's divine power!
The spirit-knight's freezing bite mauls Acaga.

<14:03:04><8 AM>
Urog's brilliant radiance MUTILATES Yuyuya!
As Yuyuya runs past Urog, Urog grabs a dented shield of steel from his belongings.
Yuyuya leaves south.
Yuyuya has fled!
The spirit-knight is unaffected by Acaga's divine power!
The spirit-knight is unaffected by Acaga's divine power!
The spirit-knight is unaffected by Acaga's divine power!
The spirit-knight is unaffected by Acaga's divine power!
The spirit-knight's freezing bite mauls Acaga.
The spirit-knight falls flat on her face.
The spirit-knight's bash misses Acaga.

<14:03:08><8 AM>
Urog whispers 'How's about that.'

<14:03:10><8 AM>
Urog leaves south.
You follow Urog south.
A library of magic


(Red Aura) (Orderly Aura) Urog is here.
(Chaotic Aura) (Rigid) Yuyuya is here.

<14:03:10><8 AM>
Urog drives his dagger into Yuyuya's side!
Urog's knifing EVISCERATES Yuyuya!
Yuyuya is DEAD!!
A clump of Yuyuya's hair is ripped from his head.

Urog leaves north.
You follow Urog north.
An impossible hallway


A long talon of a brass dragon has fallen to the ground here.
(Red Aura) (Orderly Aura) Urog is here.
(Red Aura) (Chaotic Aura) (Rigid) (WANTED) Acaga is here, fighting the spirit-knight.
(Gold Aura) (Orderly Aura) (White Aura) An ethereal guardian shouts a challenge and attacks.

<14:03:14><8 AM>
Acaga yells 'Die, Urog, you sorcerous dog!'
Acaga screams in agony as a black sigil forms on his chest.

<14:03:14><8 AM>
The spirit-knight is unaffected by Acaga's divine power!
The spirit-knight is unaffected by Acaga's divine power!

<14:03:15><8 AM>
Urog suddenly steps in front of Acaga and tries to strike at Acaga's belly, but fails!
Urog's gut shot misses Acaga.
Acaga yells 'Die, Urog, you gutshotting scum!'
The spirit-knight is unaffected by Acaga's divine power!

<14:03:18><8 AM>
The spirit-knight is unaffected by Acaga's divine power!
The spirit-knight is unaffected by Acaga's divine power!
The spirit-knight is unaffected by Acaga's divine power!
The spirit-knight tries to disarm Acaga, but fails.

<14:03:21><8 AM>
Urogaro: They took the Codex, Emperor?

<14:03:24><8 AM>
Urog's brilliant radiance misses Acaga.
The spirit-knight is unaffected by Acaga's divine power!
The spirit-knight is unaffected by Acaga's divine power!

<14:03:24><8 AM>
Using a bloody straight razor named 'Answer to Dissent', Urog disarms Acaga and sends a great mithril axe named, 'Glauraung's Blade' flying!

<14:03:26><8 AM>
The spirit-knight is unaffected by Acaga's divine power!
The spirit-knight is unaffected by Acaga's punch!
The spirit-knight's freezing bite decimates Acaga!

<14:03:27><8 AM> l ac
A wicked face catches your eye as you near this
gigantic figure. As you look closer you see
a face that carries many scars and cuts. The
eyes of this being appear to be narrow slits
closed by the bright sun. He appears to be
quite muscular, in fact, he is one of the
more physically perfect beings you have seen.
He continues on his way, with a slight smile
and a wicked squint.
Acaga, a male fire giant, has some small but disgusting cuts.
Acaga's coin purse is bursting at the seams.

Acaga is using:
<worn on finger> (Red Aura) (Glowing) (Humming) an Arkham signet ring
<worn on finger> (Red Aura) a fire opal ring
<worn around neck> (Red Aura) an amulet of the Viper
<worn around neck> (Red Aura) an unholy symbol of Lloth
<worn on body> (Red Aura) hide armor from a yeti
<worn on head> (Red Aura) a circlet of dark metal
<worn on face> (Red Aura) a demonic-looking mask
<worn on legs> a pair of spiked leggings
<worn on feet> (Red Aura) red-trimmed black adamantite plate boots
<worn on hands> a pair of eog-lined gauntlets
<worn on arms> a pair of knife-like arm bands
<worn about body> a large saddle bag
<worn about waist> a girdle of giant strength
<worn around wrist> the Bracelet of Longevity
<worn around wrist> a wide copper bracelet
<dual wield> a great mithril axe named, 'Glauraung's Blade'
<tattooed> a great white bear

You peek at the inventory:
(Humming) a sword with a wickedly serrated blade
a two-handed black sword
(Glowing) (Humming) Golrhun, the Great Axe
a black sword

<14:03:29><8 AM>
The spirit-knight is unaffected by Acaga's punch!
The spirit-knight is unaffected by Acaga's divine power!

<14:03:30><8 AM>
Urog: I's got 't.

<14:03:32><8 AM>
Urog's circle stab *** DEMOLISHES *** Acaga!

<14:03:33><8 AM>
The spirit-knight is unaffected by Acaga's divine power!
The spirit-knight is unaffected by Acaga's divine power!
The spirit-knight's freezing bite decimates Acaga!

<14:03:34><8 AM>
Urogaro: Aye

<14:03:35><8 AM>
Urog's poisonous bite MUTILATES Acaga!
The spirit-knight is unaffected by Acaga's divine power!
The spirit-knight's freezing bite devastates Acaga!
The spirit-knight's freezing bite devastates Acaga!
The spirit-knight's freezing bite devastates Acaga!
The spirit-knight tries to disarm Acaga, but fails.

<14:03:37><8 AM>
Urog's circle stab MANGLES Acaga!

<14:03:40><8 AM>
The spirit-knight is unaffected by Acaga's punch!
The spirit-knight is unaffected by Acaga's divine power!
The spirit-knight is unaffected by Acaga's punch!

<14:03:40><8 AM>
Acaga delivers a blow of deadly force!

<14:03:43><8 AM> where
People near you:
(PK) Qynsei An impossible hallway
(PK) Urog An impossible hallway
(PK) Ubivec On the Merchant's Road
(PK) Grurk An impossible hallway
(PK) Atanor A private home
(PK) Acaga An impossible hallway

<14:03:44><8 AM> Urogaro: That is why you are the Emperor I suppose

<14:03:45><8 AM>
Urog's circle stab *** DEMOLISHES *** Acaga!
The spirit-knight is unaffected by Acaga's punch!
The spirit-knight is unaffected by Acaga's divine power!
The spirit-knight is unaffected by Acaga's divine power!

<14:03:47><9 AM>
The spirit-knight is unaffected by Acaga's divine power!
The spirit-knight is unaffected by Acaga's punch!
The spirit-knight is unaffected by Acaga's divine power!
The spirit-knight's freezing bite decimates Acaga!

Leader: Acaga
<51 War> Acaga
43% hp 95% mana 100% mv 586900 xp
An impossible hallway

<14:03:53><9 AM>
The spirit-knight is unaffected by Acaga's punch!
Acaga delivers a blow of deadly force!
The spirit-knight is unaffected by Acaga's punch!

<14:03:54><9 AM>
Urog's circle stab *** DEVASTATES *** Acaga!

<14:03:54><9 AM>

<14:03:56><9 AM>
The spirit-knight is unaffected by Acaga's punch!
The spirit-knight is unaffected by Acaga's punch!

<14:03:57><9 AM>
Seizing upon a flaw in Acaga's tactics, Urog swiftly kicks him!
Urog's kick MUTILATES Acaga!
The spirit-knight is unaffected by Acaga's punch!
The spirit-knight is unaffected by Acaga's divine power!
The spirit-knight is unaffected by Acaga's punch!
The spirit-knight is unaffected by Acaga's punch!
The spirit-knight's freezing bite EVISCERATES Acaga!

<14:04:00><9 AM>
Urog whispers 'Shoulda called it off, fella.'

<14:04:01><9 AM>
Urog's circle stab *** DEVASTATES *** Acaga!

<14:04:02><9 AM>

<14:04:03><9 AM>
The spirit-knight is unaffected by Acaga's divine power!
The spirit-knight is unaffected by Acaga's punch!
The spirit-knight's freezing bite EVISCERATES Acaga!

<14:04:03><9 AM>
Qynsei steps out of the shadows.

<14:04:05><9 AM> stat group acag

Acaga delivers a blow of deadly force!
Acaga delivers a blow of deadly force!
The spirit-knight is unaffected by Acaga's divine power!
The spirit-knight is unaffected by Acaga's divine power!
The spirit-knight is unaffected by Acaga's divine power!
The spirit-knight is unaffected by Acaga's punch!
The spirit-knight's freezing bite EVISCERATES Acaga!
Acaga is DEAD!!


*now back in the village*

Acaga: yuyuya wut da
Iborenn: What happened?
Yuyuya: Urog came in
Acaga: aye, yer shudna fled damit
Acaga: acaga had yer back
Yuyuya: I had no choice Acaga
Yuyuya: It was not a conscious thought
Yuyuya: As I was held rigid by the spirit
Yuyuya: But how did you get engaged with it?
Acaga: yer fled
Yuyuya: You came in?
Yuyuya: While I still fought it?
Yuyuya: I have a few of your things.
Yuyuya: I will drop them by the pit.
Acaga: bah, ####e piss
Acaga: so ifin yer wus rigid, how da 'ell did yer flee?
Yuyuya: The body can flee
Yuyuya: Even if rigid
Yuyuya: And, so you know, it destroyed many things that I carried, even unworn. Its frost breath hits everything.
Acaga: yer allow yerself teh flee den yuyuya?
Yuyuya: There are many things in the pit
Yuyuya: And As I said, some of your things are here by the pit.
Acaga: acaga don't give ####es about tings
Acaga: acaga pissed off dat yer let self flee
Acaga: yer hold da mark uf da bear
Acaga: an yer flee like girl
Acaga: bloody farkin upsettin
Yuyuya: Are you doubting my courage, Acaga?
Acaga: Oh
Yuyuya: Yes, I think you shouldn't.
Acaga: yer run like pansy elf
Acaga: You tink acaga shudn't?
Arrazn: ohh, what happend here?
Yuyuya: And you die like an idiot.
Yuyuya: But do I say anything?
Acaga: Oh, acaga wus der teh save yer arse
Acaga: an yer callin acaga an idiot
Acaga: circle when yer whole welp
Yuyuya: For which I thanked you. But you are letting your anger at this one death get the better of you.
Acaga: Again, acaga ain't angry bout dyin, dat ####e happen
Yuyuya: You should know, our Lord commented on such foolishness.
Acaga: acaga angry bout yer arse fleein like welp
Yuyuya: I suggest you speak to Him when next you can.
Acaga: Oh, now yer sayin acaga foolish?
Yuyuya: But as you wish, the circle.
Yuyuya: No, the Lord did.
Acaga: Lord said acaga foolish?
Iborenn: You speak for Lord Ordasen now?
Yuyuya: No, I merely repeat his words when we spoke.
Yuyuya: And he did not call you foolish generally.
Yuyuya: Just in one particular way.
Yuyuya: Which has some bearing here.
Yuyuya: But if you wish to fight in the circle and do some mage's work, so be it.
Acaga: Some mages work?
Acaga: bah, now yer sayin it beh a mages job teh slay yer coward arse?
Yuyuya: Yes. No matter who wins, a brother dies.
Yuyuya: That is mage work.
Yuyuya says 'You let your despair at death get the better of you, Acaga.'
Acaga snorts.
Acaga says 'Oh?'
Yuyuya says 'yes.'
Acaga says 'Yer take dis as acaga bein dispared?'
Yuyuya says 'I do.'
Yuyuya leaves east.

*I go to where Yuyuya is talking to Iborenn, and pick up mid convo*

Yuyuya says 'I think you need to remember his words better.'

*Then they go to the circle*
Yuyuya says 'So'
Acaga looks tougher.
Iborenn raises an eyebrow at Yuyuya's weird actions.
Yuyuya says 'Is there to be some rule for this?'
Acaga says 'Don't run like sissy'
Acaga says 'stand up an take death'
Yuyuya says 'I will use whatever tactics I wish.'
Acaga says 'Acaga do da same'
Yuyuya says 'They are not the same as yours.'
Yuyuya says 'And if you think I am cowardly, perhaps you should speak to our Lord.'

*snapshot of gear*
l yu
Tall for a human but only average for his people, Yuyuya stands only halfway
seven feet. His skin is somewhat darker than usual, though still considered
fair among humans. The brown hair is cropped short, and barely reaches down
to the eybrows covering his piercing blue eyes. The shoulders seem tapered
though not lacking in strength. Still, it is more a wiry, lanky body that
you see. About the body is strapped a variety of weapons, with a few bits
here and there to carry provisions, outdoor supplies, various odds and ends.
Beneath the clothing you see nothing but the movements are quick and sure,
even graceful. A faint scent lingers near him, but you can't place it.
Giving him a once-over you come to the conclusion that
Yuyuya, a male wood-elf, is in perfect health.
Yuyuya's coin purse has a bit of weight to it.

Yuyuya is using:
<worn on finger> a pale white skull ring
<worn on finger> a pale white skull ring
<worn around neck> a sandy-brown desert cloak
<worn around neck> a sandy-brown desert cloak
<worn on body> a set of golden plate armor
<worn on head> a captain's hat
<worn on legs> some leggings from the snow worm
<worn on feet> (Red Aura) midnight dragon boots
<worn on hands> a pair of black steel gauntlets
<worn on arms> a pair of armguards from the snow worm
<worn about body> a dirty blue surcoat, embroidered with the symbol of a phoenix
<worn about waist> an elaborate beaded onyx belt
<worn around wrist> a thick black leather bracer
<worn around wrist> studded rothe-hide bracer
<wielded> some steel-tipped pincers
<dual wield> a brass dragon's talon
<tattooed> a great white bear

You peek at the inventory:
a dagger named 'Feathered Death'
( 2) a lion's mark steel spetum
the fang of a lion
a kayak
a wooden walking staff
a large saddle bag

<14:21:38><2 PM> l ac
A wicked face catches your eye as you near this
gigantic figure. As you look closer you see
a face that carries many scars and cuts. The
eyes of this being appear to be narrow slits
closed by the bright sun. He appears to be
quite muscular, in fact, he is one of the
more physically perfect beings you have seen.
He continues on his way, with a slight smile
and a wicked squint.
Acaga, a male fire giant, is in perfect health.
Acaga does not appear to be carrying any money.

Acaga is using:
<worn on finger> an opal ring
<worn on finger> a pale white skull ring
<worn around neck> a battle cloak
<worn around neck> (Glowing) an ivory collar
<worn on body> the hide of the Ancient Black Dragon
<worn on legs> some leggings from the snow worm
<worn on hands> a pair of titanium gauntlets
<worn on arms> a pair of armguards from the snow worm
<worn about waist> a wide, black leather belt
<worn around wrist> a serpent-scale bracer
<worn around wrist> a serpent-scale bracer
<wielded> a hefty battle axe
<dual wield> (Red Aura) (Glowing) a flaming axe
<tattooed> a great white bear

You peek at the inventory:
a pair of titanium gauntlets
(Humming) the Battleaxe of Mondurian
( 2) a great mithril axe named, 'Glauraung's Blade'
(Humming) a sword with a wickedly serrated blade
a two-handed black sword
(Glowing) a shirt of shining silver chain


*back to small talk*
Yuyuya says 'Or the corpses of our enemies I made this day.'
Acaga says 'Oh, acaga gonna'
Acaga> Iborenn tells you 'Whirl the wench.'
Yuyuya says 'How many have you slew today?'
Acaga smirks.
Arrazn growls angrily at Yuyuya, the low roar rumbling with anger.
Acaga holds up one finger.
Yuyuya says 'Three for me.'
Acaga says 'How long has yer been villager?'
Yuyuya says 'And yet I do not insult other villagers when they die.'
Acaga says 'Acaga been villager long enough fer three uf yer coward lives'
Acaga says 'Now have at yer'
Yuyuya says 'I am older than you Acaa.'
Acaga chuckles politely.
Yuyuya says 'I was born before your parents met.'
Acaga says 'Doubtful'

*then acaga starts*

Iborenn laughs at Yuyuya's humorous antics.

<14:22:44><4 PM>
Yuyuya's bite wounds Acaga.
Overbalanced from his attempt to hit Yuyuya with his shoulder, Acaga goes down.
Acaga's bash misses Yuyuya.
Yuyuya yells 'Help! Acaga is bashing me!'

Yuyuya's bite mauls Acaga.

Acaga can no longer find the strength to wield a flaming axe.
Yuyuya hurls a throwing dagger at Acaga, striking him square in the chest!
Yuyuya's hurled dagger hits Acaga.

Yuyuya's bite mauls Acaga.
Yuyuya's bite wounds Acaga.

Yuyuya's claw wounds Acaga.
Acaga's chop DISMEMBERS Yuyuya!
Acaga seethes with anger, and a low growl escapes his lips.

Yuyuya thrusts his dagger towards Acaga, attempting to sever his artery!
Acaga's artery begins pumping out bright red bursts of blood!
Acaga can no longer find the strength to wield a hefty battle axe.
Yuyuya's deep gash wounds Acaga.
Acaga appears more confident as he shouts 'RUN RUN RUN FRUM ACAGA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!'


Yuyuya delivers a blow of deadly force!
Yuyuya's claw mauls Acaga.

Yuyuya's eyes become bloodshot and his face contorts into a mask of rage!

Yuyuya delivers a blow of deadly force!
Yuyuya's bite MANGLES Acaga!
Yuyuya's claw maims Acaga!
Yuyuya's bite devastates Acaga!

Acaga's eyes become bloodshot and his face contorts into a mask of rage!
Acaga looks more enlightened.
Acaga fills the air with his hatred of magic.

Yuyuya's claw devastates Acaga!

Acaga wields a hefty battle axe.
Acaga dual wields a flaming axe.

Iborenn looks at Acaga.
Yuyuya stops using some steel-tipped pincers.
Yuyuya stops using a brass dragon's talon.
Yuyuya wields a lion's mark steel spetum.

Yuyuya's kicked dirt misses Acaga.
Acaga unleashes a guttural roar as the savage power of Ordasen burns in his eyes!

Acaga breaks Yuyuya's weapon with a mighty blow from his axe!

Yuyuya's punch maims Acaga!
Acaga's chop === OBLITERATES === Yuyuya!

Iborenn grins evilly.
Yuyuya unleashes a guttural roar as the savage power of Ordasen burns in his eyes!

Yuyuya wields a dagger named 'Feathered Death'.
Yuyuya delivers a blow of deadly force!

Yuyuya stops using a dagger named 'Feathered Death'.
Yuyuya wields the fang of a lion.

Acaga drives his axes into both sides of Yuyuya's body.
Acaga's brutal attack >>> ANNIHILATES <<< Yuyuya!
Acaga's brutal attack *** DEVASTATES *** Yuyuya!

Yuyuya seethes with anger, and a low growl escapes his lips.
Yuyuya's pierce devastates Acaga!

Yuyuya dual wields a dagger named 'Feathered Death'.

Yuyuya lunges at Acaga and stabs him with his dagger!
Seizing a lucky opportunity, Yuyuya takes advantage of the situation.
Yuyuya's stab EVISCERATES Acaga!
Yuyuya twists his dagger further into Acaga's thigh wound!
Yuyuya's twist maims Acaga!

Yuyuya's pierce maims Acaga!
Yuyuya's pierce maims Acaga!
Yuyuya's pierce maims Acaga!
Acaga's flaming bite *** DEMOLISHES *** Yuyuya!

Acaga tries some fancy axe-work, but just whacks his axes together.
Acaga's brutal attack misses Yuyuya.

Yuyuya's kicked dirt misses Acaga.

Iborenn shakes his head in dismay.

Acaga's chop misses Yuyuya.
Acaga's flaming bite *** DEMOLISHES *** Yuyuya!
Acaga's chop === OBLITERATES === Yuyuya!

*right here, im like.. #### he hits hard, what's his hit/dam*

Hitroll : 63 Damroll : 67

Acaga's flaming bite *** DEMOLISHES *** Yuyuya!
Yuyuya is DEAD!!

Acaga gets a wild look in his eyes.
Acaga makes a poncho from the burnt corpse of Yuyuya!
Iborenn raises an eyebrow at Acaga's weird actions.
Acaga says 'Acaga takes dis to bear'
Acaga says 'Acaga no wear, just take to bear'
Iborenn frowns at what Acaga did.
Yuyuya: So you begin without even a word, while I am speaking.
Yuyuya: How courageous.
Acaga says 'Commander understand'
Iborenn whispers 'No, I do not.'
Acaga: Yer in da goddamed circle, acaga gave yer three hours uf warning
Acaga says 'Dis bastad coward'
Acaga says 'Acaga say it straight out'
Acaga says 'Acaga take trophy uf coward to bear'
Acaga says 'to show bear'
Iborenn shrugs in response to Acaga's question.
Yuyuya: And I asked what rules if any would govern. As the Lord Kastellyn has said, it need not be to the death. Or any other rules. But as you wish, enjoy your triumph.
Acaga: Yer cud have fled, but yer didn't
Yuyuya: You made a trophy of my corpse??
Yuyuya: Did not arrazn's deed teach you nothing?
Acaga: yer damed right
Yuyuya shakes his head in dismay.
Yuyuya: You disgust me as well.
Acaga: Acaga take coward to bear
Yuyuya: Then you will go yourself? Good.
Acaga: Yep
Acaga: Acaga did same in past wit da cowards
Acaga: Acaga do same now
Yuyuya: You do not understand. When you say you bring a coward to the Lord, you mean yourself. So go, yes.
Iborenn whispers 'I do not say that she didn't deserve to die.'
Acaga: Your words sound jumble
Yuyuya: But it, like this, is a waste.
Iborenn whispers 'But I do not understand how you could make a trophy of any you consider a brother.'
Acaga snorts.
Acaga points excitedly at Arrazn!
Acaga points excitedly at Iborenn!
Acaga says 'You two, no coward'
Acaga says 'Dat welp, coward as all 'ell'
Acaga says 'More den da lowliest pierial
Acaga says 'Ifin lord tinks acaga wrong'
Iborenn whispers 'Acaga knows what I would do if I thought him a coward.'
Acaga says 'Acaga take punishment'
Iborenn nods at Acaga in agreement.
Acaga says 'but dis'
Iborenn whispers 'That is why I do nothing.'
Acaga says 'Dis will no go on like has'
Acaga says 'Yuyuya may have quick tounge'
Yuyuya: And as I said, I must go. Farewell.
the Destructor: Yuyuya has left the fray of battle.
Acaga says 'but actions no back 'er up'
Acaga says 'An village no need represent like dat'
In his fury, Acaga stomps a mighty foot on the ground, causing a small tremor!
Iborenn nods at Acaga in agreement.
Iborenn whispers 'I agree, I do not like her attituide.'
Acaga says 'An da welp said she older den acaga teh boot'
Acaga says 'Acaga been meanin teh talk teh yer bout dat ####e as well'
Acaga grumbles and growls. You wonder what's wrong...
Arrazn says 'youngers like teach olders one'

Yeah, and? This is exactly my point. I was rigid, right? It's called wimpy. There was no fleeing and running away. And nobody said for Acaga to come in and fight the knight and get held.

In fact, you, Ordasen, when tattooing me, specifically mocked Acaga for always spending his life foolishly. Fleeing from a battle is not cowardice. That's just plain obvious. And if you wanted warriors who never wimpy, why not just have their wimpy set to 0 when tattoo'd? It's not like it was hidden that I, like everyone else, has a wimpy set.

And once this all was done, you're saying (Ordasen again, not you Grurk) that Acaga behaved appropriately? Seriously? Both from your follower's standpoint and as a villager?

And lastly, how do you justify not even saying a word after removing the tattoo? Silence. Nothing at all about why or what was done. How does that make the game fun or help someone? How does that do anything but just be an ass to someone?

1: If it was only the incident with the knight, nothing else would have really happened. However it progressed and thus where everything came in.

2: No, in fact I didn't mock Acaga for spending his life foolishly. In fact I thought Acaga was a hell of alot better rager and follower then you. That is my opinion, and when it comes to my religion that all that matters is my opinion. What I did do was call Acaga hard headed which I even told him myself.

3: Yes I am saying Acaga behaved appropriately. Seriously. To him, you acted cowardly, which is a damn valid in his view. You are the one who is so high on wanting to actually rp the character, and thus he was doing so. He called you out as a warrior and as one who representes me a god of war and courage. I would expect any of my followers to enjoy the chance to challenge and be challenged in battle, not to sit around and play word games. That is all I saw, someone trying to twist and turn things to fit his own adgenda and when things did not go his way, complain about it. The trophy issue was addressed already in another post.

4:How do I justify not even saying a word after removing the tattoo? Thats simple. Your first tell was telling me I had made a mistake in an arrogant attitude. Followed by baiting tells that seethed with wanting to play word games once again. I knew it would be pointless to even try . The pray that went up right before you deleted said it all "You dont deserve me".

You certainly are the arbiter of your own religion. But I'm still waiting to hear what Yuyuya did that in your eyes was cowardly. Ever. And this is the log of what happened at the end. You think you should have said nothing? Really?

<857hp 495m 756mv 21008tnl> cb Greetings, Lord.
Yuyuya: Greetings, Lord.

<857hp 495m 756mv 21008tnl>
Through a painful process, your tattoo has been destroyed by Ordasen.

<857hp 495m 756mv 21008tnl>
Ordasen tells you 'Your actions has disgraced yourself and not only that, but me as well.'

<861hp 525m 756mv 21008tnl> t ordasen I am sorry you have done that Lord. I think you are mistaken.
You tell Ordasen 'I am sorry you have done that Lord. I think you are mistaken.'

<861hp 525m 756mv 21008tnl>
Ordasen uses his head to try and strike you, but misses.
Ordasen's headbutt misses you.
You yell 'Help! Ordasen just headbutted me!'
Ordasen is in perfect health.

<861hp 525m 756mv 21008tnl>
The healer closes his eyes for a moment and nods at you.
You feel better!

<861hp 525m 756mv 21008tnl> repl I think you have been lied to, Lord. But as you choose.
You tell Ordasen 'I think you have been lied to, Lord. But as you choose.'

<861hp 525m 756mv 21008tnl>
The healer closes his eyes for a moment and nods at you.
You feel better!

<861hp 525m 756mv 21008tnl>
Plaxxin yells 'greetings'

<861hp 553m 756mv 21008tnl>

Autosaving.

<861hp 580m 756mv 21008tnl> repl I am dismayed that you do not even ask to hear anything at all, and merely do as you do.
You tell Ordasen 'I am dismayed that you do not even ask to hear anything at all, and merely do as you do.'

<861hp 580m 756mv 21008tnl> whoi pl
<40 Svirf War> (PK) Plaxxin the Master of Weapons

<861hp 580m 756mv 21008tnl> yell Not now.
You yell 'Not now.'

<861hp 580m 756mv 21008tnl>
Plaxxin tells you 'me just resting a few seconds'

<861hp 580m 756mv 21008tnl>
The healer closes his eyes for a moment and nods at the Destructor.

<861hp 587m 756mv 21008tnl>
The healer closes his eyes for a moment and nods at you.
You feel better!

<861hp 587m 756mv 21008tnl>
The healer closes his eyes for a moment and nods at you.
You feel fully refreshed!

<861hp 587m 756mv 21008tnl>
Ordasen tells you 'I care not for words of a coward, you are no better then an orc. I do not need to hear any words for I have seen the actions myself.'

<861hp 587m 756mv 21008tnl> t ord How have I shown cowardice, Lord?
You tell Ordasen 'How have I shown cowardice, Lord? '

<861hp 587m 756mv 21008tnl> t ordas I am very interested to hear. Please, tell me.
You tell Ordasen 'I am very interested to hear. Please, tell me.'

<861hp 587m 756mv 21008tnl>
The healer closes his eyes for a moment and nods at you.
You feel better!

<861hp 587m 756mv 21008tnl>
You feel less tough.

And for about 15 mins real time, nothing.

As Vynmylak so succintly put it to Calheil when I approached him about the Fortress wanting to turn me evil...the Gods need not explain their actions to mere mortals. From an *RP* perspective...hell, your God makes a visible presence, and even speaks to mortals. That's a hell of alot more than any God I know of RL.

Cowardly. How about:

* Fleeing from the spirit knight. (Yes, I know it was wimpy.)
* Whining about Acaga getting the jump on you in the circle.

But neither of these really seems so egregious. My guess is you were smacked down for (for lack of a better phrase) being a total prick.

Yes- you fled because of wimpy. But you're the one who sets wimpy.

Had it been me, I would have explained to Acaga that I didn't expect him to come to my aid, and that in his absence I thought fleeing to be the most tactically sound decision. I would have expressed sincere regret for his death and implored him to better coordinate such rescue attempts in the future. I'm guessing that, had you approached it that way, Acaga would have calmed down, the fight in the circle would never have happened, and you'd never have lost the tattoo. 'Course I could be wrong.

>But neither of these really seems so egregious. My guess is
>you were smacked down for (for lack of a better phrase) being
>a total prick.


What happened doesn't seem to be the main problem, but the rules-lawyering, attitude, and the total IC and OOC disrespect to an IMM does.

Lawyers don't belong in a barbaric village.

I have to agree with Ilsidur's post. I wouldn't have implored anything but I'd have definately mentioned that I had no prior knowledge that he was intent upon aiding me in any way and it's unfortunate that both of us fell. If he'd shown anger beyond that I'd have chalked it up to the fact that he was irked about getting so sadly killed by Urog and that he was operating under the mistaken assumption that any follower of his god would be a carbon copy of himself.

For future reference I'd offer up two tidbits in general.
First: Never bitch and moan about getting caught offguard in the circle, as a villager you're always supposed to be ready and secondly this goes doubly so in the circle.

Second:If you're going to fight a villager berserker who uses heavy weapons, definately don't thirst and give him the excuse to if you have the means to maledict him and make him weaponless. You slit your own wrists there.

With regards to Imms in Battle a brief warning. Just because you think you're righteous in a course of action, you generally 'won't' get Battle Imm support unless you act like a dumb ass barbarian who proves his points with corpses and deathblows or whatnot. Doesn't matter if you're right or wrong really, Battle Imms don't respect talk or who's right or wrong in such situations. See the Keeper of the Tablet and Nullrick for an example of this.

Is this wrong? Not sure it kinda of depends on the situation but regardless you have to know what to expect going in. Personally I don't like Ordesan and I do think if your log is complete that his actions were cheeseball. On the opposite end of the spectrum though you certainly didn't whip much ass in stating your case with him. Such is life.

In my opinion had I been in your shoes I'd have asked Ordesan if it is his intent that I be responsible for Acaga's actions. Setting a wimpy is not grounds for punishment in my book. And just because Acaga figured that like him you wouldn't wimpy out and it got him killed isn't your fault. I saw Acaga flee lots when I played my invoker, but likewise I never thought it was stupid, just tactical. In most cases involving a mob that will hold you, it's tactically sound to have a wimpy in effect so what's the offense?

Bitching about how a fight goes down in the circle is likewise bad form but not really a big issue. When all is said and done however you did yourself the biggest disservice and proved everyone right about you. When things didn't go your way you deleted, you didn't stand up and prove they'd made a mistake, you crawled off with your tail between your legs. If you believe in the common front aka Village against mages etc. you should take less of this kind of #### personally and in most cases your willingness to strive and sacrifice for your fellow villagers keeps you safe from recriminations like this.

G'luck on the next.

I picked on you about deleting and I'll append this issue. If another villager whips my ass in the circle for some perceived slight or because he stubbed his toe or whatnot, ok I'll make sure I get recompense in some form or fashion but we're villagers so I deal with it.

If on the other hand an Imm ####s on me then yeah that overtly crosses the line. Immortals should be really careful about bitchslapping players, primarily because players don't feel like they have much of a recourse in such situations. If a police officer shoots you undeservedly who are you gonna tell? The other police officers will side with him. That sort of situation makes the whole of CF suffer.

Removal of a tattoo is no big deal as neet as some might be and this wasn't a hit out of a clear blue sky you knew there was friction happening. Gods like players can be capricious, and seriously I do think elements of personality that 'are' going to come out in an Imms RP like that should be mentioned in their helpfiles, that way you know what you're getting yourself into. But there is something to be said for a general understanding and idea of an Imm based on their cabal. You might for example, expect a Tribunal Imm to be arbitrary in his decisions, a villager to be barbaric and an Imperial to respect who is more important to the empire and so forth. If you don't want to set yourself up for that kind of potential negative Immteraction, go sans tattoo. Remember, though they may be omnipotent in the game these are just people like anyone else, they screw up just like players and just like players they sometimes won't be willing to own up to such. The choice on how to approach all of this is always yours. Control what you can and don't worry about the rest...

Also, this whole thing essentially boils down to wimpy flee. You're saying that you view that fleeing from any fight, anytime, for any reason, if cowardice? Really?

>Also, this whole thing essentially boils down to wimpy flee.
>You're saying that you view that fleeing from any fight,
>anytime, for any reason, if cowardice? Really?

No, he says you resorting to lawyer speak is. Read isildurs post above this. It's a perfect summation.

But Acaga also looks like he's being a whiny little b*tch
in this one. Yuyuya could easily rationalize that wimpying
while rigid is simply reflexes at work. Acaga was mad that
he died and was crying about it, it looked like.

But again, that was an outsider's comment from my perspective
on just this single situation.

- Kazadan

I think it is so very wrong for a rager to call a bloodthirst on another, even in a dispute like that. Its to be kept for true enemies imho and I would never use it if I were calling anyone to the circle.

-----Abernyte's Humble opinion

asdf

>I'm too tired of it to spend much time writing about it, but
>in general I deleted because several things happened which
>showcased how cf has changed for the worse, in enough
>significant areas that it made having fun impossible.
>
>In short: villagers making ponchos of other villagers has
>always been (from the Vass/Nimb/Bolt times through holtz up to
>and including Thror) one of the biggest no-no's, virtually
>always resulting in uninduction, and when not, in a very harsh
>penalty otherwise.

Strange, i still remember craevenwulfe and a number of ragers from that day forth, trophying other villagers.

Even to the extent of trophying a villager and then sacrificing it in front of him, to show the level of disdain you feel for him.

The rule regarding trophies was that it had to be worth wearing as a trophy. No trophying kobolds.

From a few chars back.. Your still bitching about specific events like it happened yesterday, and coming from someone who refused to fight in the rights, then lost in them twice, and still disrespected his elders.. I just cant take the time to read your post.

If you scorn the neglegent actions of villagers, do it because you were a part of it, not because you think your always right.

Didn't interact with you much.. though I can say I did want to beat your ass and uninduct you =D
See you in the fields .. I guess?

I never really had much interaction though you seemed to try and play the elfy thing a bit too strongly off, for just a lowbie *smirk*

May I ask why you decided to delete...and especially after all that time? I find myself enjoying playing wood-elves, and had considered the idea of a wood-elf warrior. Was it the race by any chance that made you delete? It seems like a real underdog. And I always thought you were doing pretty well, from what little I had heard. Anyways, just looking for some information on what you thought about the race/class, and possibly what weapons you had taken, if you dont mind sharing.

Good luck with your next, and I wish I could've helped you more, but you never seemed to need/want it.

Selessya