Summary

score damage
Bash      : Resistant              33%  Pierce    : Resistant              33%  
Slash     : Resistant              33%  Fire      : Resistant              33%  
Cold      : Vulnerable            -33%  Lightning : Normal                      
Acid      : Normal                      Poison    : Normal                      
Negative  : Normal                      Holy      : Normal                      
Energy    : Normal                      Mental    : Normal                      
Disease   : Normal                      Drowning  : Normal                      
Light     : Normal                      

the hide of the ancient blue dragon can be referred to as 'hide ancient blue'.
It is worth 10755 copper, and is of the 48th level of power.
It is armor worn on the body.
It is made of dragonscale and weighs 11 pounds 3 ounces.
When worn, it protects you against piercing for 16, bashing for 11,
  slashing for 16, magic for 3, and the elements for 0 points each.
When worn, it affects your lightning resistance by 50 points, 
  your save vs breath by -5 points, your hit roll by 1 point, 
  your damage roll by 1 point and your hp by 20 points.

nt

nt

.

I haven't played for 6 months (work load) but I try to keep up with the changes and live of CF.

And I'm so happy that this game exist and that you the code time put so much effort into it.

Thank you and I hope you have a great 2013!

A question or two:

Might I ask for your reasoning for dropping halfies exp penalty to 0? It kinda feels they should have a bit more (like the old 100) than humans...

If I understood correctly, you can now have two (or more) same protections cumulatively, e.g. while wearing a 'resist fire' item you could now quaff a potion of 'resist fire' and have them stack? Or do the additional effects have to be of a different type (like prot from heat)?

>Might I ask for your reasoning for dropping halfies exp
>penalty to 0? It kinda feels they should have a bit more (like
>the old 100) than humans...

Because.

>If I understood correctly, you can now have two (or more) same
>protections cumulatively, e.g. while wearing a 'resist fire'
>item you could now quaff a potion of 'resist fire' and have
>them stack? Or do the additional effects have to be of a
>different type (like prot from heat)?

They have to be different affects, but they can stack. You can't just keep quaffing resist fire potions and build up your resistance.

So long, and thanks for all the fish!

>A question or two:
>
>Might I ask for your reasoning for dropping halfies exp
>penalty to 0? It kinda feels they should have a bit more (like
>the old 100) than humans...

Dunno if Zulg has any deeper reasoning than this, but half-races were among the least popular race choise in CF in nearly every class. Human population is nearly twice as much or more in every class than that of a half-race.

I also had the same thought on the reasoning.

At a glance half-races now seems the more default choice than human, but having played one some what recently I really feel the amount of gear you can't use balances them out.

These changes might have good or bad effects on CF (I think they all are positive) but it's not THAT important.
The most important point is.. You (All the implementors) are still coding and do huge changes which is VERY appreciated.

Thanks again.

Keep up the awesome work.

Somewhat counterbalancing low level former-0-penalty classes no longer having a level advantage to lord over the higher penalty characters, the following changes have been made (coming next crash/reboot):

- Spellcraft is a little more front-loaded. That is to say, it gives more of its bonus earlier but is similar around hero.
- Weave of Elements, Nether Protection, and Arcane Absorbtion are now available at level 20 and have a duration that's more front-loaded than previous.
- Most of the former 0-penalty classes get parry (and where applicable, shield block) earlier than before.
- A-P lightning bolt is very slightly weaker at low levels. Invoker lightning bolt is unchanged.
- Wrath is slightly weaker at lower levels. At higher levels it is as current.
- Ambush deals less damage at lower levels. At higher levels it is as current.
- Shield jab and shield mastery effectiveness scale slightly with level now, being somewhat less effective at lower levels.

There's still more tweaking to do but this is the start.

Love it. Thanks!

Curious if the wrath and shield changes are being evaluated or considered to be good as is?

As a level 25 paladin I can't see wrath being a viable option for damage as compared to weapon skills given it's reduced damage...small sample size so far but getting a decimates level of damage with wrath at this level seems a bit off to me.

Web page still needs updating with the new class & race penalties.

That will be taken care of when we switch over to the new server (soon, I hope).

You made me want to roll up something eventhough I dont have time.
Thanks Zulg!

Zephon

nt

Attachment #1, ( file)

This must have been A LOT of work, + all of the other santa zulg stuff + the extra edges thrown in + all the other stuff that you do in terms interactions etc etc.

Great start for CF 2013!

Sucks thought that immunities are removed from the game. hehehe I've always loved playing around with immunities and exploiting them. hehehe but it's better this way really.

And I must say that humans became a much more interesting choice now because of these changes. Not have ANY vulns became worth a whole lot more.

Always shoot first and then call whatever you hit the target.

Dig the changes, and the fact that you made them. The fact that in 2013 a text based game is still being actively developed by highly competent developers. If I continue to see this level of commitment to the game I will probably start actively recruiting new players. Have you thought about sending out another newsletter?

Arials are still annoyingly good, but not ridiculously overpowered (relatively speaking). I think a good way to bring them in line would be to make more lightning and water weapons available. Particularly since resist lightning is SO easy to get.

All this last week I was going back and forth about making a character and about 6/8 months away... I finally decidde no. And then you do something to totally make me say F it! I'm in!!

Thanks man, you guys are all awesome in my book.

This seemed like it was a lot of work.

It's awesome now that you've created a system whereby you can create gear and such that actually fits into the new system. This IMHO is the best part of this change (especially when mentioning skills/spells/edges like forgiving curor). I always wanted to wear to resist heat items as a felar, glad I finally can and the second piece of gear will actually do something.

About the class exp penalties, not sure how I feel about it. In one way, I think it's awesome that my fire ap doesn't have people 7-9 ranks above him at all time...but I kinda think the fire ap needed that (in a way, so to speak) because fire is generally the best choice for an AP.

Willing to definitely give this a shot. Thanks again Zulg.

Curious about the change from immunity to 90% resist for storms and water. What's the thinking behind that?

>Curious about the change from immunity to 90% resist for
>storms and water. What's the thinking behind that?

Immunity to anything tends to break things balancewise (you can now go kill random high level mob because you can't take any damage from it). You won't be able to gear up to immunity, diminishing returns will cap out at 90% resistance.

You'll probably see more changes along these lines in the future.

So long, and thanks for all the fish!

Does this affect absorb_fire? Ever since I saw one of them running round smacking some of the big mobs in the High Lord's Keep and healing up on the firedrake I felt that was broken.

>Does this affect absorb_fire?

Currently no, but that doesn't mean it won't change in the future.

So long, and thanks for all the fish!

Just a suggestion:

Healing through fire+mantle could go in some ticks (Five battle ticks for example).
So a high-level mob can do enough damage to ruin you in 3 ticks, but same level mob/pc can't do much probably.

The idea behind:
Mantle get's the fire and changes it into healing but it takes sometime (Based on the phoenix itself) to take it fully under control.

Is that it will make skill practicing for storm giants quite easy, since your skills will improve with 90% resist, but not with immunity.

>Is that it will make skill practicing for storm giants quite
>easy, since your skills will improve with 90% resist, but not
>with immunity.

Yup, this is something we've talked about a few different ways to fix. I'll have to see which makes the most sense to implement.

So long, and thanks for all the fish!

Like, you have the 100% skill learn bonus that you give as a gift.

Would there be a way to code something like: if resistance = 90, (-)50% skill learn?

Just thinking if that's not difficult, that would be the way I do it.

Like vuln mithril, vuln iron, resist metals?

Also on a side note, I've always wondered about the felar help file which, to me, suggest that they should be able to take blows that would kill a normal human yet they have no damage resists other than fire? ie "It is said a Felar can withstand blows in battle (or from an angry
master) that would kill a human outright."


I am a big fan of the monster effort that you and the staff put into trying to bring, we the players, a better gaming experience and applaud your dedication and hard work.

>Like vuln mithril, vuln iron, resist metals?

They are completely separate in the damage formula, and not reflected at all in the score damage command (there isn't really a way to do it that way).

>Also on a side note, I've always wondered about the felar help
>file which, to me, suggest that they should be able to take
>blows that would kill a normal human yet they have no damage
>resists other than fire? ie "It is said a Felar can withstand
>blows in battle (or from an angry master) that would kill a human
>outright."

That's history I don't know, but yes they only have resistance to fire.

>I am a big fan of the monster effort that you and the staff
>put into trying to bring, we the players, a better gaming
>experience and applaud your dedication and hard work.

Thanks!

So long, and thanks for all the fish!

>>Also on a side note, I've always wondered about the felar
>help
>>file which, to me, suggest that they should be able to take
>>blows that would kill a normal human yet they have no damage
>>resists other than fire? ie "It is said a Felar can
>withstand
>>blows in battle (or from an angry master) that would kill a
>human
>>outright."
>
>That's history I don't know, but yes they only have resistance
>to fire.

I think felar are also resist light. It is documented in the help section of this website too. I think the text in the helpfile refers to 23 con of felar as opposed to 20 con of a human.

>I think felar are also resist light. It is documented in the
>help section of this website too.

Someone didn't read the summary

I always thought same about felar. It seemed that they might have something like vanguard (which do some resistance against high damages).

1. Is it right?
2. If not, is it a good idea to add it?

nt

>Also on a side note, I've always wondered about the felar help
>file which, to me, suggest that they should be able to take
>blows that would kill a normal human yet they have no damage
>resists other than fire? ie "It is said a Felar can withstand
>blows in battle (or from an angry
>master) that would kill a human outright."
>

Years ago I was told that is the explanation for their high con. Blows that would kill a human because the felar has the health to sustain it, not because it can resist it. Just heartier than humans.

And thanks for all the work.

Any thoughts to adding dam redux to the score damage?

>And thanks for all the work.
>
>Any thoughts to adding dam redux to the score damage?

Nope, because there are a zillion factors into what that number would actually be (are you getting hit with a mithril weapon that does freezing damage both exploiting your vulnerabilities with protection from evil up).

So long, and thanks for all the fish!

First, thanks for this great change AND its bug fixes! You rock.

I assume vulns and resists are still checked for first, then other damage reduction/amplification(soften/sigil/pbrand) when calculating damage?

>First, thanks for this great change AND its bug fixes! You
>rock.
>
>I assume vulns and resists are still checked for first, then
>other damage reduction/amplification(soften/sigil/pbrand) when
>calculating damage?

They're checked in the same spot they always have been, somewhere in the middle of the damage reduction formula.

So long, and thanks for all the fish!

Like sanc, ABS, etc. I can understand prot vs good and some other redux not showing up since they depend too much on what you are fighting, but some stuff is equal across the board, and I was thinking those might show up. Not a big deal either way, just for clarity.

n/t

-----------------
"My view of Borkahd IC"
If you anger him, he'll rape you to death, eat your flesh, and sew your skin into his clothing. And if you're very, very lucky, he'll do it in that order. ~Twist

nt

Wow, that is a lot of work you did here Captain Z. These are all awesome changes, and I predict these changes will increase the fun factor by about 22%(give or take 2%, my calculations are not based on solid data *snicker*). Thank you, I freaking love you, and god bless.

Couple clarity questions:

1. What is the interaction now between racial vulns and gear that grants resistance?

i.e. If you're a fire giant with a 33% vulnerability to cold and you wear a piece of gear that would grant a human 33% resistance to cold are you now at 0%?

2. Should "magic" be on this list since dwarves and certain other races are supposed to resist "magic"?

Elf paladins and fire/cloud giant Battleragers rejoice?

>1. What is the interaction now between racial vulns and gear
>that grants resistance?
>
>i.e. If you're a fire giant with a 33% vulnerability to cold
>and you wear a piece of gear that would grant a human 33%
>resistance to cold are you now at 0%?

Yes, you are now at 0%.

>2. Should "magic" be on this list since dwarves and certain
>other races are supposed to resist "magic"?

Magic was never really done correctly or consistently (as I found throughout the project). Now it will work as I believe it was intended, but RES_MAGIC equates now to 20% resistance to cold, fire, lightning, acid and energy.

So long, and thanks for all the fish!

>Now it will work as I believe
>it was intended, but RES_MAGIC equates now to 20% resistance
>to cold, fire, lightning, acid and energy.

Does a character with res_magic have an increased chance to save against spells & communes? Or is it purely a melee damage thing now.

>>Now it will work as I believe
>>it was intended, but RES_MAGIC equates now to 20% resistance
>>to cold, fire, lightning, acid and energy.
>
>Does a character with res_magic have an increased chance to
>save against spells & communes? Or is it purely a melee
>damage thing now.

They never did as far as I can tell, and it hasn't changed.

So long, and thanks for all the fish!

>>>Now it will work as I believe
>>>it was intended, but RES_MAGIC equates now to 20%
>resistance
>>>to cold, fire, lightning, acid and energy.
>>
>>Does a character with res_magic have an increased chance to
>>save against spells & communes? Or is it purely a melee
>>damage thing now.
>
>They never did as far as I can tell, and it hasn't changed.

What about things like the resist arcane edge?

>>>>Now it will work as I believe
>>>>it was intended, but RES_MAGIC equates now to 20%
>>resistance
>>>>to cold, fire, lightning, acid and energy.
>>>
>>>Does a character with res_magic have an increased chance to
>>>save against spells & communes? Or is it purely a melee
>>>damage thing now.
>>
>>They never did as far as I can tell, and it hasn't changed.
>
>What about things like the resist arcane edge?

That affects the chance of the spell landing.

So long, and thanks for all the fish!

I'll do the list styled questions since you respond to those more.


Goblins are vuln to acid/fire/lightning/cold/energy, including damage from, as an example, a fire weapon?


Is this how it was before as well for anything vuln_magic?

Dwarves resist all of the above weapon wise?



Not arguing against it, just trying to make sure I understand it all correctly.

Thanks, and I personally really really really really like this change - arial int-drop and the damage resistance revamp.

Best santa zulg present ever <3

>Goblins are vuln to acid/fire/lightning/cold/energy, including
>damage from, as an example, a fire weapon?

Correct.

>Is this how it was before as well for anything vuln_magic?

No, it wasn't. Res/vuln magic were broken/inconsistent previously, this change makes it much better.

>Dwarves resist all of the above weapon wise?

Correct.

>Thanks, and I personally really really really really like this
>change - arial int-drop and the damage resistance revamp.
>
>Best santa zulg present ever <3

Merry Zulgmas!

So long, and thanks for all the fish!

>>1. What is the interaction now between racial vulns and
>gear
>>that grants resistance?
>>
>>i.e. If you're a fire giant with a 33% vulnerability to cold
>>and you wear a piece of gear that would grant a human 33%
>>resistance to cold are you now at 0%?
>
>Yes, you are now at 0%.

What about two pieces of gear, each of which would give human 33%? Are you now at 33% or are diminishing returns already in effect due to covering the vuln with the other item and having points?

>What about two pieces of gear, each of which would give human
>33%? Are you now at 33% or are diminishing returns already in
>effect due to covering the vuln with the other item and having
>points?

You are already in diminishing returns.

So long, and thanks for all the fish!

It seems as if the points are purely additive and then the resistance is computed from the point total according to some formula.

Based on the values you published (20 pt = 20%, 50 pt = 40%, 70 pt = 50%) a piece of gear granting 33% resistance should have around 35 points.

If that's the case, then two such pieces of gear would be worth 70 points, which is 50% resistance.

Perhaps not coincidentally that seems pretty close to what a human would have experienced pre-change if he could somehow make himself "double resistant" (e.g. a character with resist_positive and resist_metals being struck by a metal weapon with a positive attack).

33% resistance meant you took 2/3 damage. 2/3 * 2/3 = 4/9, which meant you'd be taking around 44% of the damage you normally would have. Post-changes you're looking at taking ~50% damage instead of 44%.

>It seems as if the points are purely additive and then the
>resistance is computed from the point total according to some
>formula.

And there's the rub...it figures out what your percentage resistance would be (with diminishing returns), and then subtracts the vulnerability from it. So a vulnerability is always bad, and much harder to cover up.

>Based on the values you published (20 pt = 20%, 50 pt = 40%,
>70 pt = 50%) a piece of gear granting 33% resistance should
>have around 35 points.

Those numbers are accurate, 38 points = 33%.

>If that's the case, then two such pieces of gear would be
>worth 70 points, which is 50% resistance.

50% resistance, and then you subtract 33% vulnerability from it and you get 17% resistance.

So long, and thanks for all the fish!

So the vuln is not like starting with a base of -38 points. It's worse than that.

Do other forms of protection work on the points system now too, e.g. sanc, barrier, stoneskin, etc.?

>So the vuln is not like starting with a base of -38
>points. It's worse than that.

Correct.

>Do other forms of protection work on the points system now
>too, e.g. sanc, barrier, stoneskin, etc.?

They haven't changed at all. All of this basically replaced the one section of the damage code that dealt with vulnerability/resistance/immunity to specific types of damage. Nothing else has changed.

So long, and thanks for all the fish!

I like all balancing and the resistance change will make the game really interesting and I like the possibility that some weaker gear can help your resistances a little, not just the very powerful way of going from vuln to resistant