I amongst others would like to see Carrion Fields grow even more, and I don't
think the dark and gloomy setting of the mud really is a setof to many
players, but the fact that you have to work harder than any mud I have ever
played to acomplish anything or even reach the 30th rank.

The main reason here is to get to know the areas that are somewhat
dangerous, not the nasty areas. Its to give a safe first taste of thera.
Sort of like when you take a bite out of something you have not tasted
before, if the taste is good, you soon want some more of it. If your first
tast is a bad one you quickly will put it away.

As most of you probably experienced (if you can remember) is that learning how to play CF is a 3 stage game. 1 learn layout and basic ranking areas/gear. 2 Learn how to survive those elites :D and 3 how to kill other players. When you gone through all phazes you are a fully fledged competitive CF player :D
(ofcourse RP is a lerning curve through all phazes).

New players can have an extremely hard time getting into the game and learn
how things are. I have to say when I started a few years ago I found it
extremely hard to explore at level 10 to get to know the layout well enough
to survive. I even used a couple of characters (heroes bouth of them) to
learn how to survive after I learned the basic layout of the mud. After that
I started learning how to kill... So the learning curve is pretty steep :D
But though I love the mud now when I feel I can compete.

I have a suggestion to how newbies can get faster into the game, and even give
Carrion Fields more players in the long run. It is a major project
implementation wise but I think it would be worth the trouble.

Today you have the choice to select that you are a newbie so you get better
followup from the imms in the game. What if we make this a status that gives
restrictions to the player, to help him learn the game and mechanics faster.

I was thinking of the following restrictions:
1) Not able to rank beyond level 30
2) Not be able to hold any limited items.
3) Not able to choose empowerment classes or support classes (esp bard and
transmuter). So we dont get out of range adventurers aiding in pk fights.
4) Deny the use of herbs or the like on a character that is under the
influence of PK Adrenaline.
5) Not able to participate in PK fights or be a victim of one.
6) Not able to loot player corpses.
7) Not able to join any of the cabals we know today (look below).

Given this you get a safe environment for a newbie play and learn the ropes.
Allso when you pass level 11 your entrance to the newbiezone will be switched
for a cabal entrance for an adventurer cabal with an outer guardian, and
inner guardian. Let the cabal be run by hero imms and the newbies
automatically gets inducted into this cabal. This should give them the
oppertunity to learn how cabal works and at the same time learn them how to
RP well. The inner guardian can be used to give quests and guide RP and in
sorts as a kind of a newbie IC channel for the "experienced newbies".

Maby give them a cabal power which works once a day or week where you can get to your
outer guardian if your in really bad problems (like wind up in an area where
you just have no idea how to get back from). Maby a power called 'safe haven'

I know this is not an easy change, but it might be one of those bigger projects that might get us a few more of those newbies who stay and give good reviews hehe.

Tirach

because I'm getting somewhat tired of the pathetic logins of many cabaled players, and the ooc connections between them.

Anyway, I believe this mud shut down within the last month, and reopened with only one imm. It was based, if I am not mistaken, on the carrion fields code (perhaps on a mud that was itself based on cf). So it wasn't exactly the attraction one might hope.

Anyway, I personally considered it a decent idea as it allows you to get the basic layout of the cities and ranking areas learnt without being attacked and killed by players (because you didn't know your way around and therefore couldn't escape them effectively).

I also thought some of the websites I visited were a lot more helpful in terms of what to expect from a mud. For example, one I looked at had a good explanation of why the immortals insisted that all drow are evil, with no Drizzt equivalents. Another had a good explanation of what is acceptable in terms of ic and ooc speech. For example, it specifically said that, used sparingly, it was ok to make an ooc comment if you preceded it with "ooc". Now, that personally was enough to stop me looking further at that mud. However, something that spelt out that it is not ok to do that on cf would be useful.

Basically what you're saying is extend the newbie range from 1-10 to 1-30. When learning the game mechanics, this is fine, but CF is mainly a PK mud (other than RP). With this, I fear newbie players will end up frustrated, as they think they are getting pretty good at the game, where in fact they'd get utterly tooled when they roll a new char and enter PK. It's better to know that you'll have to deal with (ie survive) pk, than to think you're really good, and get disappointed really quick.

1) Not able to rank beyond level 30

As exploring is the main focus of your post, I don't really agree that you should cap it. The safest time to explore, is at hero. Capped at 30, you're still going to get attacked by a lot of mobs, which wouldn't attack a hero, and mob die, which I think will nullify the no-pk arguement. You'll end up getting frustrated either way.

2) Not be able to hold any limited items.

Seen as an extention of the newbie status, I'd keep it like it is for newbies: You're able to take and use them, but lose them when the session is over. Also, the gear should crumble fairly fast (maybe after 1,5 hours). Limited gear that you received (as opposed to those you found yourself) should crumble after perhaps 10 minutes. Which means people will be able to give you limited preps and you'd be able to use them. Giving you normal items would be useless, as they'd crumble rapidly and get into rotation again. (So looting your pk victim's corpse and giving all his limited items to a newbierange char, just so your victim can't get them again is not an option, as it will crumble anyway)

3) Not able to choose empowerment classes or support classes (esp bard and
transmuter). So we dont get out of range adventurers aiding in pk fights.

All of the empowerment classes are exceptionally good at exploration. You can deal with being blind, poisoned, plagued, ... very easily without having to know any single preps, which can not be said about the other classes. True, empowerment is still a limiting roadblock, but I don't see why it should be denied.

I totally agree on the no-support char issue. Or perhaps your spells/songs would only affect newbie range chars (which is extended for you, not necessarily for others)

4) like 3

5-6-7) You're in extended newbie range, so this comes automatically


About that Adventurers cabal

I'd make it an Adventurers Guild. There you'd find a board with notes on them, like: WANTED: Red Dragon, for setting the roofs of Galadon on fire. Contact the old Geezer for more information, or: Lady Goodwife lost her wedding ring while walking in the Voralian Gardens, please return it to her if you find it, reward garantueed.

Then, you would have to find the old Geezer and do something like this: sayto Geezer Where can I find the Red Dragon? And he would tell you that he's seen the beast, knows it's whereabouts and will guide you to it.

The newbie channel is still available to you, so you don't need cb (which would be a duplicate newbiechannel anyway)

In short: I think it's better to show you everything about the game. Too rough for you? Cool, your choice. Feel like giving it a go? Welcome aboard. At least you know what to expect. I'd hate to waste my time with a game that looks nice in mode A, but totally sucks for me in mode B, and where mode B is the main theme of the game.

I still like the idea of it capping at lvl 30, just to limit those "nonpk" chars choosing newbie status all the time. Youre right that heroes explore more easilly and safer than a 30th char, but you need to consider that this is ment for basic knowledge, and hero mobs is not basic exploration. Most of the places in cf will be explorable for such a character... He has the moves, he has the hitpoints to get away from an unlucky strike and he can gradually get the knowledge needed to proceed into the frey.

I can't exactly see the problem with mode a and b, since mode a is an option to get ready for mode b. The player is made painfully aware of what is going to happen in bouth modes and he will see when grouping with other character what this is all about. He will have friends killed, see enemies killed. Friends ganked and full looted... I'm pretty sure the average human will set this into relation for what he is preparing to.

Tirach

I don't know, I'm not convinced this would really help newbies.

Put aside for the moment that to make this really PK-fair these guys shouldn't be able to even group with normal players.

A big part of learning CF, especially if you don't come from a PK MUD heritage, is learning to deal with PK. I'm not sure you do anything but set them up for frustration by letting them avoid it in this way. Certainly, they're learning to play A game, but it's not really CF.

Imagine you and some of your friends play a fighting game like Street Fighter or Tekken at home. You end up making some "house rules" as you play each other. Perhaps you decide throwing is cheap so you don't do it, or a certain character is too good so you won't play him.

Then you go to the arcade and play, and you get stone-cold owned by some guy who is playing the game as it truly exists, not by your rules. He plays the forbidden character and throws your ass into next week.

You spent all that time playing with your friends, though. You should be great, right? Well, not really. You haven't really been playing the game. You've been playing a somewhat similar game of your own creation, and you'll probably discover painfully that skills in your game don't translate as well to skills in the real game as you'd think.

I believe that implementing a system as you suggest would turn out a lot like this.

You heard the 'but' in that already eh?

I personally feel the are you new to cf or mudding in general
should be placed earlier in the list. (and perhaps listed individually)

Then when the class choices come up have an if statement which
determines what is shown.
and if new to mudding make a very bright pointer to these forums.
I was pointed to the mud by a friend, always skimmed through
the logon, didn't notice there was a website for a long long time.
Reading things here helped alot*.


Take all this with a grain of salt, because the last time I
started to complain about something that happened in game to
someone outside the community I stopped and said 'Well what did
I expect when I first started playing this? The game opens with
a skull and by which name do you wish to be mourned?' :)





*The old database of messages had loads of help for pk as well
but that all broke down to learn to run, run, RUN!, carry teleport/recall potions so you can RUN!, when you feel comfortable
running, then start hunting.

If a computer ever poses the question How about a nice game of chess?
best answer: Yes
worst answer: Later, let's play global thermoneuclear war.

Actually I dont agree with you on this one.

The basic thing that is missing for most players to be able to survive and avoid PK is the simple thing called Area knowledge..

As I stated in the original post you have 3 stages you go through to become a competitive player.
1) Getting area knowledge.
2) Learning to survive those "basterds" hehe
3) Learning to kill.

My suggestion is solly to give newbies 1... Then the real stuff starts. You know how to run, get teleport potions, coins and what not. Maby even learned that dirt kick prevents disarming and so on. Then you can step into the fray at stage 2. Learning how to survive.

As I have painfully experienced, we have newbies hardly knowing how to move and talk, it's probably not a very nice experience to them poping into PK, hardly think they would be able to survive at all, and probably not even how to get to a home town, getting coins and food... Its actually hard when you have no idea at all.

This protected state is more to observe what happens in the battle fields, and learn areas and gear locations. And at the same time learn that thing called RP, every time I play an empowerment char and meet a total newbie and he starts talking about his homework and what not, I am in a dilemma... What the hell should I do? Normally I just throw a lame comment like Home work? Dont you work at your fathers farm or something like that; nofol player; and leave. I'm not one who risk my empowerment because someone havent learned the basics of the mud. That sets the lvl 13 newbie in a big jam, even if I dont want to do that I have maby put 20-30 hours int prayer and what not for that empowerment, and I would like not to do that again.

Its all about basic education for the newest players, the ones who convert from another mud will probably be very grateful for an explore option before they enter the fray. I know I have a few pals who would like to try out, but they find it to hard to get going... Being under 11 and exploring is a real pain (no moves, no survival against mobs and so on) + getting food is even hard for them in the start.

All this is my intentions for the original post.

Tirach

If those newbies was happy with the current system we would hardly get those flaming reviews on the different mudlists around.

Cant say I aggrea with you there nep.

As cf is now is not newbie friendly at all. Heck once you try cf your experience is that everyone talks about how easy it is to get killed. By allowing a player to learn how to get from a-b-c-d and "show" that player a place or two to get a teleport potion and or a return potion, and how to get coins enough to aquire said things you will make a better player and one that would like to stay just because of that he now knows he can survive atleast by walking about and learning of an area.

90% of the times I die, is ither to a group or Im in an area that I really dont know and die to a room where I cannot get out of.

Cant say I see any house roules being in affect if properly told that what you are making is to allow you to get to know part of some of the classes cf provides and also allows you to learn some of the realms ways. Even get a taste of how a cabal works.

Also this would re-inforce the rp part of cf, as they would have an innerguardian that could aid each of them.

Just my few cents.
LH

I tend to think this could be tossed around as a general idea and turned into something exceptional. First off, it allows for a "second" newbie channel from 11-30 that couldn't be snooped by players looking for newbies (i.e. easy pickings). It provides a hero-imm or two to be patron of newbies & the clueless, immteraction being a great way to keep new players excited about playing. An immediate support network to share good gear, new places found, potentially more newbie-academy like rooms with signs and stuff.

As far as the pk-safe player concept, there are just too many variables - the only I can really see doing this without any affect on game balance is a separate instance of the game running on a different port, and even that isn't really fair since hell, I'd probably log into it just for the opportunity to explore an area in absolute safety.

Yea if the pk limitation is not put in, this could be a cool newbie cabal where some powers are given to the adventurers to make exploration far easier for them.

And at the same time when they choose to rank beyond 30th rank they are automatically uninducted from the cabal so they get a normal character who can try for one of the serios cabals in the game.

And at the same idea there qould be a quest board/quest mobs in the cabal that give out quests to push people in the cabal to explore thera and prepare them, bouth area knowledge wise and basic item wise.

Lets run this through the spinnof machine and see what the CF community can manage to pull up of ideas so the imms get something to work with... You never know, if this gets good enough something might happen... And we desperately need som way of preparing those new to the game :D

Tirach