Come on, guys, bring OBS/EXP edges back again. Let's agree that the social experiment has failed and rollback, making for a fine Christmas present to the playerbase.

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I like the new system much more than the old one!

Commerce XP:
Previously - Every 1k up to 21k
Now - 7.5k, 15k (L30+), and 30k (L51)

Exploration XP:
Originally - Every 1k up to 30k? Plus a bonus for hitting
a target before level 30.
Now - 5k, 10k (L30+), 15k (L51), and 30k (L51)

Observation XP:
Originally - Every 1.5k up to 35k? Plus a bonus for hitting
a target before level 30.
Now - 5k, 10k (L30+), and 15k (L51).

Loss of tattoo and title edge points. Massive nerf to obtaining the retrieval targets.

I'm no Euclid but I'm pretty sure I can smell a massive net loss.

OH but we got Obs/Exp back (yah!) /s

Put edge points out of their misery once and for all.

Then you have to fix all the skills that edges artificially broke, just to create edges to fix them.

Fix those skills, remove those crappy edges completely and let people pick the good ones as RC rewards or even acceptably as mature/old age rewards for having a long lived chars. That'd be my Santa request.

Part of the goal with this change is to make it so a character can end up with more edges now than they could previously. So we'll be keeping an eye on that.

We did some number crunching and I felt satisfied (for now) that there will be a net gain in number of edges a character can/will have.

If, after some time with this system, there truly is a net loss (for many/most characters) we will revisit the amounts awarded at each tier.

But can we do with edge points what we did with thief points and just display the values so we can make better informed choices and cost/benefit analyses?

There seems to be a small return to hiding info with the new administration (see lack of code changes and announcements board use), which is disappointing for me, but on the whole I am very hopeful about the direction I see and the new stuff that is going in, even if it isn't announced necessarily in the way I would prefer.

Random add-on: Have you considered making edge costs dynamic, in that the more people with edge X the more edge X costs, and vice-versa?

>But can we do with edge points what we did with thief points
>and just display the values so we can make better informed
>choices and cost/benefit analyses?

I just don't see this happening. There's a pretty solid consensus amongst the staff that this would be a huge headache we don't need.

>There seems to be a small return to hiding info with the new
>administration (see lack of code changes and announcements
>board use), which is disappointing for me, but on the whole I
>am very hopeful about the direction I see and the new stuff
>that is going in, even if it isn't announced necessarily in
>the way I would prefer.

This just isn't the case. As has been the case for as long as I've been around at the very least, every change that impacts gameplay is announced. I'm sure we've missed a thing or two over the years, but basically what you see is what you get. We simply don't have people hacking on the codebase like we used to.

So for anyone who is glad/upset that xyz skill was shadow nerfed/improved recently, you're making things up.

>Random add-on: Have you considered making edge costs dynamic,
>in that the more people with edge X the more edge X costs, and
>vice-versa?

Not automatically, but we (as of somewhat recently) log this stuff and it will be factored into future decisions with regard to individual edge power/cost changes.

I disagree with you about the headache stuff, but I'm content that I'm not going to change the feeling behind that choice.


The lack of changes is probably what I'm noticing more than anything. And maybe missing area as announcements but I don't recall if that was ever announced that way now that I think about it.

For what it is worth... I didn't believe anything was being shadow nerfed or whatever.

I'm glad you are logging it and taking that into consideration. Thank you for that and all the other work you guys put into the game.

I've pointed at that problem before.

Can you add the edge to all classes like Buki to assassins?

It will be a great impact for char customization that we all love.

Like you can take only one edge from 4/5/6/7/8.

The staff still is very short of coding time, which is way too obvious. Even with Umi back.

If you're asking if we can make some edges mutually exclusive (ala the Buki edges), you may actually see some of that. One of the things we're hoping to do is evaluate edges that are widely taken (especialy class-specific ones) and if there are ones that seem too powerful, rather than just "making them cost more", maybe making it so if you take powerful edge X, you can't also take powerful edge Y.

So...yes? If I understood you correctly.

It incentivises longevity much more than the old system, and it tilts towards mechanical gains vs immexp begging. Which definitely nice.

I read Kstat's post on QHCF. I haven't played in a good while, and am going to give it a go with these changes.

One question, with the lvl 30 requirement for obs/explore if you've accrued the needed obs/explore points (some need to be obtained prior to lvl 30) are they "counted" when you hit lvl 30?

>One question, with the lvl 30 requirement for obs/explore if
>you've accrued the needed obs/explore points (some need to be
>obtained prior to lvl 30) are they "counted" when you hit lvl
>30?

For example, if you hit 10k exploration XP at level 29 and then advance to 30 you won't instantly get your edge points, but you will as soon as you receive any subsequent exploration XP. It's not perfect, but coding it the other way would've been hacky and I just didn't care that much.

This applies to all the experience categories.

Do they not add edge points anymore or just an oversight?

asd

With the retroactive statement regarding the edge point change, does that mean that an established character will not benefit from previous experienced gain, or will they get the edge points released, from previous benchmarks, once they hit the next benchmark from the already gathered benchmarks? Or is it possibly like the example you gave about level 29-30 which requires an amount gathered once they hit the level 30 mark and get more experience in the fields?

I've updated the MOTD to hopefully be more clear.

All of the experience changes should be retroactive.

Things like cabal leadership aren't. If you became a leader a week ago you're out of luck.

Is there a chance you can elaborate on how refractiveness works if you get a spare minute? I'm really struggling to wrap my brain around it, I've past most of the brackets and any new explore/obs points haven't had any affect on anything. Thanks in advance :)

Heh, sorry... Autocorrect! Body of the message was meant to say retroactiveness too, which I guess is a new word...

I read it as you lost the EPs if you hit the benchmark too early. Nice.

tt

Can you only get the edge points if you hit those levels before hitting level 30, or at they just awarded at 30 (or after) if you have them?

Is it only awarded if it's hit before 30, or can I get all tiers on 51?

When a tier is L30+, such as Exploration 10k (L30+), does that mean I need the 10k Exploration BEFORE I reach 30, or that I have from level 30 until level 50 to reach 10K Exploration XP?

I don't want to see a characters with all possible edges again.

Assassin with the one edge

and the warrior with the one edge.

What don't you want to see? Do you understand that the system is broken? :)

Its the russian chat now.

First of all it's not one edge.
Hero - 1 average edge, 21k commerce exp - 2 average edges, 10 retrievals - a bit less than average edge, 1 400 role exp - average edge, leadership - average edge, tattoo - a bit more than average edge, lastname - few edge points.

Warriors get few very useful edges as well as assassins. But there are much more good assassin edges than just few good edges for warriors.

So in the current system everything is alright.

But if we add few more edges for everybody because of obs/exploration exp then an assassins get much better edges than a warriors because of it's quality.

P.S. Overall i don't agree why some classes got much more love with the quality of edges than others. The system became less balanced than before. For example why do assassins need edges to improve martial trance or throw or vanish?!

One assassin with the one edge or one warrior with the one edge

One edge to find them,
One edge to bring them all
And in the darkness bind them.

I jest, everyone but me can still manage a handful.

:D

which totally means it should be rolled back.