I am sure writing this will only serve to get you to treat my char badly, but I can't stand by and be silent as to what just happened.

This was clearly not a battle immortal. And worse, it was obviously an immortal that didn't even know anything about the battle cabal.

Had you said the one thing you did at the beginning, that would have been fine. But you did not even know how the circle works, you did not even know who battle enemies are, and most of all you called out someone for doing the right thing, and for not doing the impossible. Like I said there, if you had said he had targeted non enemies, then ok that's cool. But you didn't. He didn't. He did exactly what he's supposed to, and you screwed him over. And tried to screw me, too.

I wouldn't be surprised if this person never played cf again, and certainly not the village, though to that person: you should, this imm was not a village imm. You looked to be doing great to me.

You ruined a player's fun, for no reason, and you did it out of ignorance.

The other parts were equally bad (wanting us to fight each other? One of us has to die? Why? It was just silly and wrong.)

I hope the player comes back. If I'm right about how deletions work, you can undelete. I hope you do.

Did "BATTLE RAGER" change their name to "CUDDLE BEARS" without a proper announcement?

Having had several Battle Commanders, I pretty regularly would scold people for not going after true enemies and the circle wasn't a bad way to prove a point. 1/3 con isn't the end all be all and you can also negotiate that it's whoever flees the circle.

I've been at the receiving end of a "talking to" like this one and I've seen many others get them, too. This was when the numbers were much higher, of course, but it was a pretty regular thing for the Big D to swing his 'Big D' around every once in a while to keep Ragers in line. My character that got scolded also went on to become Commander with a third legacy and a tattoo, so I can testify that it's not even close to being some kind of a terrible mark on a character.

You gotta roll with these situations and RP through it. You're supposed to be the toughest, baddest warriors in Thera and then you get your feelings hurt? Cmmmmmonnnn.

nt

with familiar name :)

I saw that a svirf warrior villager deleted. This does not tell me what happened.

Why am I supposed to care or have an opinion about a situation that is so secret that it cannot be explained, yet it can be openly discussed on the gameplay forum.

Instead of posting a bunch of conclusions about an IMM, just post a log and let me make up my own mind about it.

I gave you all the clues you need. It's soooo damn obvious if you compare things said on different forums :)

Go to the other forum. Then proceed to DL said player's post on the log board, which contains the entire character's log from beginning to end. Go the end of the log, which will have the entire conversation.

FWIW, I read the log after my post here, and I'm thoroughly underwhelmed by Phelzhis' response. I thought it was much more severe than what actually transpired, based on his reaction.

As someone privy to what occurred, I'll respond.

This is something that:

A) is not surprising, or even a big deal
and
B) never should have been posted here by an active character

Because it has now been posted here, I'll explain. The general consensus of several Imms (including me) is that Battleragers should be largely non-aggressive to non-mages or Nexans ("true enemies"). This is noted in Battle literature in the Village and is usually enforced by Battle IMMs.

We noticed a Battlerager berserker that had 50 total pks and only 5 mage kills. So, after discussing it, one of us used the Destructor to call attention to this and and begin a stern conversation about it. No one was uninducted (or even came close). It was meant to be a learning moment.

Almost immediately, the Battlerager in question removed all his gear and started putting it into the pit like he was about to delete. He then CB'd that his feelings were hurt. If you're trying to roleplay one of the mightiest warriors in Thera, throwing a hissy fit over some fairly mild criticism isn't the way to do it.

The guy did end up deleting, and then posting a log that compromised his character's identity and other private information. Per our rules and policy, the deleted character was denied.

Subsequently, there was an IC discussion about the Battle rules as they've been interpreted and enforced for quite some time and the realities of the game today. We're tossing some ideas around upstairs, and any changes will be announced.

Either way, for the several of us present during this event (more than one of us very experienced rager players), it appears to be an extreme overreaction to criticism.

To anyone who might experience criticism here in the context of roleplay with an Immortal or cabal mob, I want to assure you that your character is not "screwed" or flagged for imminent screwing. We can uninduct you or unleader you if we want. If we haven't, then it's a mere warning or nudge that might open the door to a discussion.

In the future, I hope that you all take IC criticism as just that. If a cabal mob interacts with you in a seemingly negative way, it isn't because we hate you and think you're awful. If we did, we have the tools to uninduct/demote/anath/unempower/untattoo/etc. you. Think of it as a nudge and a possible conversation starter.

That's been my understanding re: battle. You stay focused on the true enemy and that you don't drag the village into your own personal battles.

I could see the villager thinking the criticism is unfair if all those other kills were Imperials.

Also, I can see it a valid criticism if one constantly avoids en antropy mage to hunt down a blade.

Criticisms are taken very hard when they are 1) not counterbalanced with praise when appropriate. 2) done publicly amongs peers.

Of course, I don't know how much any of this applies to this situation.

Thanks for the info.

Here are the relevant passages from the Plaque. They're pretty explicit. Again, we're not talking about an uninduction or even a punishment - just a warning and conversation.

II: The enemies of the village are many and will vary with circumstance. As the village was formed by betrayal so do they war upon the very essence of that betrayal. The true mages of Thera, the conjurors, necromancers, transmuters, shapeshifters, invokers and anti-paladins have the taint so deep within them, that only death will cleanse them of it. Other groups or
individuals who war upon the Village and are marked as Hunted by either the Gods or the Commander shall be treated as enemies.

III: Those who are not magi, but who are members of such magical cabal such as Entropy, are to be treated as enemies of the Village, for their enslavement to the magi cannot be forgiven. The Equation, which is the source of their mana, their power, is to remain in the Skull Throne at all times. If you are unsure as to an individual's allegiance to this group, every effort must be made to verify they carry the taint before you strike at them. When in doubt, show patience, and bide your time until their true nature can be discerned.

IV: Those who dabble in the arts or serve to protect the true magi are misguided in thought and deed, and are to be pitied. Treat them as enemies so long as they stand beside the magi; else leave them be, for they serve only to divide our forces. Should one of these misguided fools actually strike at the Village's guardians, they should be slain for this transgression. As you stand over their still warm corpse, explain to them why you struck, and warn
them against making this same mistake again. Pen a missive to the Village informing all BattleRagers who it was that dared commit such foul actions. Those who persist will be marked as Hunted, and treated as enemies. Priests are to be tolerated, but their powers should not be embraced other than at the shrine of your deity.

V: Never should you pursue those who are not our true enemies without the leave of the Gods of Battle. This includes those who hunt you as an individual, for whatever reason or cause they choose to embrace. If pursued by those who so dispute your beliefs, and if you are unable to avoid them, make a stand and defend those beliefs, but do not draw the Village into your personal battles.

Yep. So, I'll assume the 50 non-mage PKs weren't imperials.

So in the rest 50-55 hours i only killed eight mages. It may look bad result, but i _always_ went after mages first of all, then after imperials + ninjin who kept attacking the village and me. In the end killed few tribunals who declared War to the village and took the head.

Is it my fault that i killed 42 not mages in these 50-55 hours? They kept attacking me, village and were our enemies. I _never_ attacked any non-enemy of the village, NEVER.

And about you don't think i'm awful.

I was going to be slayed and instead deleted for using triggers even though i don't use any for few years already. There is full log of my life, didn't even ever use disarm trigger. And for multicharring even though i only played 2 characters at the same time once and never broke rules.

Hell, Umiron uniducted me from tribunal only because i was actively pkilling everybody as _evil_ tribunal.

There is no need to lie, it's all too obvious.


Edited: The only exception were two warriors who assisted Scarab shaman after he struck me. I immediatelly called bloodthirst and killed them both.

People that attack you shouldn't really count negatively towards your numbers, especially when there aren't a ton of enemies to begin with.

I went 4 weeks at level 15 only seeing 2 mages in my pk so I sorta understand the lack of mage kills.

It would be cool if they let Tahren destroying items count as you destroying magic and joining the village that way. Maybe -1500 towards the veil gets him to prog.

Kind of sounds like you're carrying around too much baggage and are jumping to conclusions.

You've turned an RP instance into a personal attack and that's no way to play the game, man... A lot of times these little slap on the wrists can turn into positives. Think of it as being groomed for a management position. This same sort of thing happened to one of my chars in the past and I ended up Commander-- you just need to get out of your own way.

gr

"You're using a magic item. You must die."




Battle Ragers: The Ragers who don't battle at all.

Unless you're a mage.

Unless you're a Nexun (whoops, we can't seem to find that cabal!)

I'm 90% sure that was Jormyr and you're all wrong.

I wouldn't say all wrong. The newer Battle imms still have differing views than the older ones with regards to a lot of things so if you're used to things being handled a certain way it could seem wrong if they handle it differently.

But whatever, the trick is not to invest much then you don't lose much and don't have to be mad.

I think that the crux of this issue is something that should have some transparency, if his accusation of lack of cabal understanding is (1) true; and (2) has happened on occasion before by IMMs.

Essentially, it boils down to is it appropriate for an IMM to attempt to step in and affect a cabal in a certain way, when said IMM does not have a strong grasp of a cabal's dogma or understanding of the current or prior cabal's IMM's interpretation of said dogma. (Now, I think a lot of people like to think that they understand cabal X's dogma, but let's be real. That's just not true, for IMMs included.)

I'd argue there is a strong reason for IMMs in these cases to NOT effectuate change, unless there is a clear violation. Two reasons: (1) if you end up being wrong, then you have soured the morale and motivation of those in the cabal, and created drama. Even if you are in the right, I believe that other people in CF can just as easily recognize issues with said leader or player. I understand that sometimes you want to help oversee a cabal, at least show some IMM presence exists, etc. Unfortunately, that could end bad should you end up making a mistake. (2) It's of relevance to remember that many players of CF have been here for over 10+ years. Many are on par with or vastly exceed the playing time of IMMs in XYZ cabal. Many RP'ed with or closely followed key-note IMMs of their respective cabals.

Long story short, it is just as likely that your understanding of a cabal's dogma is weaker than the player's. Obviously, this shouldn't be a black and white policy, its always going to be in the middle. Just hopefully a jumping block for a conversation on this, should this sort of intervention occur more than once in a blue moon.

>I wouldn't be surprised if this person never played cf again,
>and certainly not the village
>
>You ruined a player's fun, for no reason, and you did it out
>of ignorance.

Since when are you worried about these things?.

Just wanted to call out hypocrisy that I witnessed personally.

In my mind I am still hoping that it was an in-char situation/attitude not the player's attitude.

gr

gr