Look, you guys are probably sick of hearing about it but CF is against the ropes and getting beaten worse than Chavez Jr. I'm in a position where I have to take some time away from CF due to real life and I'm a little concerned.

This has happened in the past when business got busy and what have you but I've never been looking at a break and wondering if there will be a game when I get back.

Yet it's a legit concern at the moment. Some parting advice from a veteran's perspective:

1) The edge point nerf killed a lot of people's desires. A LOT. Give it back. You can say edges were "out of control" and "bad for the game" but your player count wasn't 8 at 9pm on a Friday when you had people with 15 edges.
2) You nerfed entire classes with the empowerment changes. Make wrath one round again, give druids transmute back (even if they can only transmute their own ####), don't give healers fly back though because I want to troll the Australians.
3) Lack of diverse and engaging imms. This doesn't include Ishuli who is the best thing to happen to Cf since bash. Get Baerinika back to run fort. That is a pathetic ####show.
4) Fix lag. You can say you can't reproduce it but I somehow can *every single session*. As a serial melee player it kills my desire to PK. Which kills my desire to play.
5) Stop giving ####ty prizes as RC rewards. My last three characters had no efforts put into their roles because getting cave fighter or urbanite isn't worth the risk of getting a damn flaw which actually happened for some reason.
5) Do something crazy. Give players Masters back. Code more halloween-like forms. Do *something* to catch people's attention before it's too late. It's a game, let's have some fun.

Now you can say I'm being dramatic but I've seen this happen once with Dark Mists and the game did, in fact, die. I don't want to see that happen here.

Good luck and I'll see you fags in a few months.


Hopefully.

I will not pretend to understand the gaming industry or what makes CF tick or not tick as well as many of you.

I will give you feedback from the side of one player - me. And it's this - the low player count is a killer. An absolute killer. As someone who historically has favored exploration based characters and tends to focus on the "support role", there is little for me to do when no one is around. It makes it difficult to interact, difficult to RP and ultimately difficult to choose to devote a lot of time to CF. Logging on to make a new char in prime hours and seeing 5-10 players online is soul crushing. Plain and simple. (It's way worse than a full loot for me!)

In the past, I could justify low(er) player numbers with - well, I'm going to log in and explore a bit on my own. But with exploration/observation points removed, that incentive is less appealing. Are there areas that I've not seen or studied in detail? Sure, but not many. Is there a reason for me to take a new player to Organia and do a true IC/RP walkthrough for hours at a time? Yes - for RP reasons, no - for mechanical reasons. CF without edges is less fun. You could say that this opinion is subjective. I disagree. Perhaps I paraphrase - CF with less content is less fun. There. Isildur provided a number of thought-intensive solutions to the edge problem. So now, with a theoretical solution in place, there is a practical solution - there is no one to code it. (Or rather there are not enough coders.) I sympathize. I wish I could help. I cannot code. I can help fund coding (within reason). I suspect other people could fund it as well (with some accountability of course on the use of funds).

Reading the forums, there is a clear disconnect between the ever-shrinking staff and the ever-shrinking player base. I don't have a solution, though people more vested than me (though I'm also vested) have offered some sound solutions (with most focusing on that four letter word - "edge").

Yes, there have been many "CF is dead" threads in the past, and CF has always come back. I truly hope that's the case with this particularly bad case of malaise because I hope to continue playing CF in the future.

People want new content. Things that make them say 'Oh that sounds neat. Maybe I can do x'. These things don't have to be major changes such as Scars work on Enchanters that seem close to entering playable stages, but rather a variety of small changes that can make a big impact.

I think the work of Ishuli in Silverwood is a fine example of a small change that can go a long way. Very interesting flavor to a high traffic area. I would think and hope that maybe this is something Heroimms are currently doing, in place of or as an aside to current areas. Adding more to the more bland areas of the game IMO is more preferable than a bunch of new areas... though I do think goodies need thrown a bone with some smiting evil eq with Team HellXplorz in full swing.

Minor additions to classes. This is so key in my opinion and I don't see any of this happening. Add a macalla every month or two. How often do you see theorycrafting on builds etc. It generates interest and motivates players to play. Add to what is there! The oldguard did a great job building this up, add to it. As someone who programs, I know for a fact that some kinds of macalla wouldn't be too much work, while others might take some time but the fact remains this should be happening.

Shapeshifter forms, I can't believe we haven't seen new/modified forms. The success of Umiron's halloween forms was huge. Incorporate them into the general pool and add a new ones/modify them on a regular timeline. I would personally love to see a shift to D&D bestiary than animals. Otyugh or Cobra. Hm what's cooler.

Thieves, add some skills sometimes, tweak others. I think thieves should have wands at the end of the arcane path (including sleeks :) ). Add some poison ingredients, trap ingredients etc. I know some poison ingredients were added, including in some newer areas like Aturi Timberlands, but little things like this can add alot of variety.

Shaman, add a new path once or twice a year. These are fantastic and IMO one of the best additions to CF in a long time. Completely overhauled a class that was somewhat static and predictable.

I think you get the idea, maybe have certain imms in charge of developing ideas for each class.

Alot of diversity can be added through the dreaded 'E' word. I think Daevryn had the thinking with adding batches of these to keep things fresh. I do agree with the removing edge points for PK, however not for exploration. I think you need to replace the lost edgepoints with static gains by level. Edgepoints add flavor and make each character feel unique, similar to macalla, shaman paths etc. This needs addressed.

More immortal interaction. This is significant. There is a reason the mud follows Ishuli. Because she is willing to interact and be part of the player community. I can't remember the last time I saw Destuvius (not meaning to call you out) visible on who list, spanking imperials for being lazy etc. Which is really unfortunate because Destuvius is one of my all time favorite deities. Deormdel was great for being a part of things as well but I really believe that the staff as a whole should follow the lead of Ishuli/Scarabaeus/Raltevio in being visible on the who list, showing they exist and encouraging players to roll up followers etc.

It's the little things and I think every staff member can/must do these to keep CF afloat. If you are jaded and tired of these things, you should probably move on. I think the onus here is on the staff in a lot of ways and they need to rekindle that energy that new imms have like Ishuli. I hope Malch, Venara, Whildur etc are ready to roll soon. We need fresh blood.

Some of these are low-effort, but many of them are very high-effort. To the extent all of them require staff time, they're in competition with one another. Spend time on X and that means you're not spending time on Y. So they'd need to be prioritized.

... we must count on the staff of properly prioritize the limited resources. I, personally, would focus on high impact / low coding effort first. That said, I'm not arrogant enough and certainly not informed enough to assume that I know what those are better than the staff...

Edit: Isildur, I thought you had some good seemingly easy to implement ideas posted here and on Dio's.

1,000,000?

That's only a half a cup FYI.




If you phrased this without being as dramatic and flippant maybe you could be taken more seriously. But as you have a history of having your character denied for trying to give yourself an advantage over other players, maybe that's all your statement adds up to be: "Give me more of an advantage over players"

We'll address the lag issue elsewhere because it is being investigated by all of us. (Ishuli beats the tar out of us poor, squishy heroimms!)

I know you mean well, but take a step back and you work on you. I've said it time and time again but we need existing players to change their attitude for the better. How to do this? Behave less selfishly. Realize respect is a two way street. Show newbies the ropes and be more compassionate when there is a language barrier. Apply to the staff if you want to actively contribute.

Before applying know that you have to prove your ability to add to the game. For instance, I had many notable characters who had a large impact in the game over many years. Now, I want to use my time to add to the game in a positive way by turning character creativity and playtime into into area creativity and game lore/backstory.

So I bring free time and creativity to the table along with an open mind that's ready to learn. Current IMMs liked that, and here I am.

Something all my mortals had in common was compassion and knowledge sharing in character. I would not suggest rolling characters who only want to full sac other characters out of spite if your intention is to get on the staff. That would be a step backwards. If your characters are an overall success and well-liked, maybe even a rolecontest winner, no hiccups in the ROTD, you can make it. We like to watch interesting characters who can prove they have a head on their shoulders.

Hopefully you can work on that.

gr

gr

gr

This is an issue we've been working on. I've personally put 10+hours into trying to reproduce it, without a SINGLE instance.

If you're able to reliably cause it, PRETTY PLEASE log it and email me your logs so I can keep making a collection of the witnessed issues so we can try to find out the root cause.

Email me at: ishuli@carrionfields.com or ishulicf@gmail.com.

This goes for anyone else who is able to reproduce it as well. It's really hard for us to fix it, which we're trying to do, when we can't even reproduce it.

In the logs, please try to include a snippet from before combat starts showing the races, classes, and specifically how many people are in combat at the time.

Please and thanks!

I posted a log snippet to the bug board. Are those being seen? It's not something I can easily reproduce though, since I was being attacked by a couple of enemy PCs.

He pulled the bunch he found from the bugboard, I've been pulling them from logs posted, etc.

But it'll be easier if they get emailed my way so I can try to keep a central organized collection for us all to browse through, especially if people point out where the bug happens in their log so we can try to reproduce it in proper fashion.

I personally don't have access to the bug board, so I'd have to bug others to be able to grab them from there.

this is just my very loose hypothesis, but i think it has something to do with only some characters but not others. I have yet to experience any sort of oddities, on both the giving and the receiving side, of lag inconsistency.

I think I've been tripped, bashed, and thrown enough to have theoretically seen the lag if it was as rampant as other people have indicated.

I think it'd also be interesting to know if people are receiving lag inconsistency when it comes to mobs lagging, since i havent yet been lagged from a trip from a mob, for instance, that lasts less than the norm.

5 is hilarious (5A not 5B, you're totally right about 5B).

Totally disagree about 1,2; Agree strongly with 3,4

NT

Seriously, how do posts like these not get moderated? "See you fags in a few months"? Come on, really?

All of these ideas except for maybe the last one (that would the second number 5 entry) really will not change how many people decide to log in on a regular basis. Get some perspective, man. Complaining will not get more players and especially posts like this do not help.

Though the idea of 100 players month is good one. I'm sure Ishuli can make a lot of fun for everybody, not just her followers.

Glad you like the idea. Let's make it happen.

Why not try to promote a month of 100 players?

A pretty common saying in sales is that it's easier to retain customers than it is to go out and get new ones. Keeping this in mind why don't we set a month where we say we will all make extra efforts to roll up a character and log in. Then reach out to former players and say why not come play for 1 month. Pitch nostalgia or charity to them - whatever works.

Then if we can get the imms on board with this maybe they can do the same with dormant imms. Then they would hopefully have numbers and could make things fun by running frequent SHORT term quests (none of that #### where the quest lasts three months before just being forgot about) along with lots of learning and exp bonus periods. Hell, give out EPs as rewards like candy. Make it fun.

If CF is really dying maybe we can all have one last hurrah. Maybe it will bring players back and reignite interest with them. It would also be neat for new players to experience CF in its glory days, even if it only lasts a month.

But I'm not interested in "one last hurrah". I'm in for the long haul!


I'm game for being super attentive in a given month though, sounds like fun to me.

When we have huge numbers, there's usually something going on. Large-scale quests that a lot of people can get involved in. Easter egg-type hunts. I remember a while back Twist (I think it was him) did a trivia contest.

I also remember back in the days when Imms used to actually interact with each other. Gechos are more interesting when they aren't stupidly vague to the point that the majority of the playerbase doesn't even get what's going on. Actual interactions (or even battles) between Imms via gechos are fun. That kind of stuff can help spur IC interactions too.


Basically what I'm saying is, CF wants a DM again. As a playerbase, we need someone (beyond ourselves) driving the games storylines.

I came back from a break shortly after Entropy went in (I think it went in, didn't it?). I don't know what happened with that, but over the last few months I've seen pretty much nothing. Fort fights Empire and Scarab. Trib fights Outlander. Battle fights... entropy, I guess? But there are no ongoing storylines. Nothing is happening. The game's story is stagnant and it seems like it has been for a while now. Honestly, besides Entropy (assuming that coincided), I'm not sure what changed with the new age. Seems kind of low-key compared to what's happened in the past.

If you want people to build up interest, move the storyline along. Take us somewhere new.

Do that and publicize it, and you'll have people show up.

.. he usually gives himself an gecho to let the world know.

This used to inspire me to want to play battle or something until I realized it was just the signal to let others know he would be dormant for 6 months thereafter.

I agree with your post though!

Problem is there are too many problems.

NT

gr

Thank you very much.


*** Edit - let's not use full real names, mmmkay? ***

gr

NT

>When we have huge numbers, there's usually something going
>on. Large-scale quests that a lot of people can get involved
>in. Easter egg-type hunts. I remember a while back Twist (I
>think it was him) did a trivia contest.

I did trivia half a dozen times and it was a huge hit. Unfortunately, it took me longer than I care to admit to come up with enough hard(er) questions to make it interesting, which is why I punted a couple times and just did general game/area knowledge type stuff.

This is a good example of something that can be done by a fairly low level imm and doesn't require any of the fancier (read: higher level) wiz commands, access, above average RP chops, etc.

That was the coolest thing CF has done in a while (a while being since Zulg left) IMHO.

gr

was taking observation/exploration away after taking PK away.

Hooray to Halloween forms.

When I saw it on the newsletter email!

Alas, I lack the ability to do most of the stuff you mentioned. BUT I am doing what I can, so I hope that kinda helps.


If folks who are able to do that stuff jump in, we'll be in business.

Do lower level imms have the ability of mob control?

They have a lot of ways they can do it, but it is a far clunkier process than higher level imms have.

gr

... edges were a good "reward currency". I'm not saying that having a more active DM for RP-only reasons is not good enough, but it's particularly great when your char gets a nice little bump.

I would be totally up assisting in any way possible with something like this.

Speaking from straight opinion (this is not the views of any other of the staff but my own), I would agree with Venara's above post. While we on the staff have our issues/problems/ things to work on, it is also nice to hope for a bit of a change on the side of the player as well. Now, I am not bashing the players, I am not bashing the imms, but I think the ideas of mutual respect for one another can go along way to molding the game as a whole into the place that the players want to see, while nurturing the desire of those of us who chose to join the staff and work to make the game better for all.

I know there seems like a disconnect between the staff and the player base at times. I can promise we see the things that are upsetting the players, and we will continue to do what we can, where we can, in the time that we can devote to it.

There is a solid core of heroimms right now that are all working toward becoming full immortals. We all have had many discussions of things we want to do for the players when we get there, but we all have to work through our "entry exam" at our own speed within the time that we have to devote to it.

I have high hopes, and lots of plans!

And judging by the forum posting habits, I'm afraid it's Venara lol :)

I have plans to make a dent in some of the things you mention, and to advocate for others. Must leave it at that for now.

It directly addresses the issues you've put up.

P.S. We really should do something about these post headlines, screw freedom of speech.

Rather than repeating a mantra that puts people in denial mode, try a new line of attack:

"Let's get people excited to log in by coordinating a quest weekend to coincide with a media campaign"

"Set up a GoFundMe so we can buy a sitter for Momma Baer..."

"CF-con in Chicago on..."