Has there been a time before when there was only one coder in CF?
If so, how long did it last?.

And just to create a conversation, is there something that could be done to bring back old imms that left CF?. All imms matter, but I think mostly of coders such as Zulgh, Nephente, Cador and now Umi.(Those are the only ones that come to mind).

-J

I am still around and impersonate a hapless noob every other year or so.

But I was never a coder, just somebody who would occasionally modify and break other people's code. I could probably find most of the other former imms if I wanted. But we all grew up and moved on.

With regard to coding, I would do the happy dance to have any of our veteran coders back on staff: Zulghinlour, Nepenthe, Valguarnera, Jullias, Umiron, Sebeok, Vilhazarog. Though there has been some quick-and-dirty code written over the years, that's a sorely missed load of creative talent there.

For as much trouble as y'all give Valguarnera, I wish he were still writing for CF. He started in on some of the materials-based code for Artificers and I would love to have seen where he was going with some of it.

i mean, we could even put together an Inn event and have a hoe-down just for stopping by and considering it

For some I no longer have contact information (e.g., I'd have no idea how to contact Sebeok any longer and I've lost track of Valguarnera's non-CF e-mail address). I suppose if anyone has those and wants to e-mail them to me...

And he's still playing so he might even give it to you guys!

>For some I no longer have contact information (e.g., I'd have
>no idea how to contact Sebeok any longer and I've lost track
>of Valguarnera's non-CF e-mail address). I suppose if anyone
>has those and wants to e-mail them to me...

Sebeok is on Facebook. I don't know if you have/use it, I can at least tell you several current IMMs are FB friends with him. May or may not be a place to start.

Valg was always super private, so I can't help you there unless he used a personal email for Fantasy Baseball back in the day, someone might have that.

Tried to send you an email using the forum software; not sure if it worked. Let me know if you don't get anything from me.

Certainly nothing marked from the forums. I'd just e-mail scarabaeus@cf

If we dig back even deeper into the vault, Vassagon and Ra####on did a lot of coding back in the day. I have zero idea how to find them now.

Seriously?

Tee hee. Just kidding! :)

Asking for a friend...

There's no short cut to the system of imm progression, right?

I wouldn't mind fixing bugs as time allowed, but with what little time I have available to play there's no way I could be both a presence on staff *and* play mortals. And given that choice I'd prefer to play mortals.

If nothing else, I'd love to figure out what's causing those small random pauses that bug me so much.

That being said, its not unheard of for someone to help with code related things as a heroimm/lower level immortal.

He has heroIMM'd before.

Wait...WTF, I thought Isildur WAS Destuvius?

So many questions now :)

Sometimes my personalities like to chat with each other.

Is the area requirement still in place?

You have to know how to walk from one area to another.

=)

I didn't code. Heck, I was just a chump. However I would come back in a heartbeat if the process was a bit different and the big guys would allow it. I -loved- the RP aspect of things and even though I didn't have my religion released I still ended up with a following as a hero-imm and that was pretty darn neat. It was cool to have players insist on following you when they knew I couldn't empower or anything. It is all about the players and having fun!

n/t

nt

Straight RP badass

But I know that at least once during my time as an imm, someone on staff reached out to you about a return and got no where with it.

If you honestly want to make a return to the staff then give it a shot. The process is pretty much nothing like what it was during your last go around (as I have gathered from the people who were around during your attempt).

So you actually reached out to us, were given the go ahead with the condition that you heroed another char to do it. What ever happened to that attempt to return?

Thanks for the info! Knowing that the process is a bit different is definitely something that is appealing.

I reached out in May of 2015 regarding a return and gratefully received a response that same month. In short I was told that I was free to try again if I like. I couldn't bring myself to going through that again. I don't want to go into too many details here but if you are curious please feel free to shoot me an e-mail and I'll offer more information.

don't be a ninny. two weeks and some double exp love and we're there. feast.

I had a lot of drive to want to do the stuff with interacting, as far as desc rooms and helpfiles and stuff, but once I started on my area I totally lost interest...just kinda killed the fun for me and I never was able to get back into CF after being a heroimm.

Destuvius was right though. The process is different, and they offer you alternative ways to progress as an immortal.....unfortunately all of those started with writing an area, which once I started doing I realized I hated it. :(

The staff was awesome though when I met everyone, treated me great, and certainly were working as a positive whole for CF. So I am glad before I exited the game, I was able to see that side of the staff a bit. Lots of good peeps with good intentions up there working on stuff now.

Was good seeing the forums today.

Gap/Druktu

NT

The greatest trick Valguarnera ever pulled was convincing the world he wasn't still on staff.

I mean, he's on Greetings screen ffs!

He also implemented the NPC random targeting code which everyone adores. Especially cabal apps (when inner randomly dirts them during an enemies retrieval) and conjurers!

He also made modifications to berserk and implemented recuperate - which is why all the Orc's love him so very much.

Without the handful of changes made by coders that you don't agree with, CF would've been over as a stock ROM game back in the 90s before it started. Every single new command, feature, skill, spell, area, bug fix, etc. wouldn't have happened if all the stuff you've gotten so much free and quality enjoyment out of didn't come with a few things that didn't fly your specific kite.

CF would be in a lot better shape if it had a few more Valgs. Or just the one.

NT

I don't think it's the changes that drive people away, or angry as the case may be with myself. I think it's the perception that any negative feedback is simply brushed aside. I actually have no qualms with you, or what you did.

I mean, when you have umpteen posts on the forums and people who were once the biggest advocates of edge removal (looking at you Sam) saying it's less fun - You'd think that perhaps some of the changes could simply be rolled back until an alternative solution came to fruition.

I'd be fine if they were rolled back and lessened a bit. I mean, we don't need that many edge points from obs/explore.

I suppose the more important question for the imms....are you even considering an alternative solution? Or just fine with the way it is? Because if you're not even considering it, I guess there's not much of a point to make suggestions.

>mean, we don't need that many edge points from obs/explore.

Speak for yourself. I don't insist on "from obs/explore" part, but I desperately need that many edges.

Half of my fun with Zqoemoa was typing "edges" and reading the list.

I still have no Imm exp. So it cuts into my edge points dearly.

And maybe I am wrong.

But it was specifically stated that in response to the PK edgepoints being cut WAY more Immortal experience would be handed out for awesome CF moments to mitigate the loss in edgepoints.

Now we have nerfed the other main character driven way to gain edgepoints and still have no noticeable increase.

Automation is necessary, especially with dwindling players/imms

Make milestones that award edge points. Example

Flat 100 pk wins
Flat 200 pk wins
Flat 300 pk wins
Every time your age changes

Don't have to give much, just give some. That would increase player appreciation, reward characters that are doing good, reward characters for being long lived.

I agree with you milestones should be implemented, but from what I'm gathered from Destuvius's posts is that THERE ARE MILESTONES...they just don't give as much edge points as people want.

FWIW, I mentioned the IMM xp "doublespeak"...they don't have enough IMMs right now. I've played CF for 12 years now (my god) and I've never seen the IMMstaff smaller.

tl/dr #### happens.

nt

NT

You're absolutely right about the changes being what makes CF great, and not just another stock ROM. But you're painting with a very broad brush there basically saying that any change to the game is good for the game. This is NOT true. That, plus when people give you feedback about it they're basically met with a middle finger in their face. Granted a lot of those people don't give constructive criticism and basically throw a crying tantrum, but still you have to expect that is going to happen. You need to brush that crap off and focus on what really matters. There is a LOT of VERY constructive feedback about this issue, it's not all crybaby whines and rants. I don't see why we can't just give a little bit of edge points out every 10 levels, or something like that. It's fair, not game-breaking in any way, and a guarantee increase of funstick. Do you or don't you agree?

> But you're painting with a very broad brush there basically saying that any
> change to the game is good for the game.

That's not what I was saying at all.

I was saying that insinuating that not having someone around because you don't like a fraction of the changes they've made (e.g., Valg and NPCs targeting random enemies respectively) would be preferanble is kind of silly because if that were the case then no progress would be made. One or two or ten specific changes aside, I think it's hard to argue that even from a subjective / "funstick" perspective, even some of Valg's (for example) biggest critics wouldn't be way happier off if he were to come back and add a lot of new content to the game, even if they only end up agreeing with 50% of it.

Absolutely nothing I said had anything to do with edges at all.

That may not have been what you MEANT, but you still basically said all changes are good for the game even if you don't like them all.

You didn't specifically say edges in your reply, but you were talking about "changes made by the coders" and that general subject includes changes made to edges.

Practically everyone has said the game is more fun with edges, please give back SOME edges. Even other imms agree. I don't see why this is so difficult to understand.

>That may not have been what you MEANT, but you still
>basically said all changes are good for the game even if you
>don't like them all.

Agree to disagree, I guess. I thought I articulated what I was thinking clearly enough but if not I've clarified so there's no confusion.

>You didn't specifically say edges in your reply, but you were
>talking about "changes made by the coders" and that general
>subject includes changes made to edges.

I suppose in that it includes any change ever made to the codebase ever you are technically correct.

>Practically everyone has said the game is more fun with edges,
>please give back SOME edges. Even other imms agree. I don't
>see why this is so difficult to understand.

Edges didn't go away. Many characters (rolled after the change) have edges. Many have more than "2-3" from what I'm told, some substantially more than that.

The staff is more than welcome to reverse, tweak, or maintain any change I (or any other inactive coder) have made, and they know that. In fact, I both hope and expect things will change in the future, though whether I'll necessarily be a fan of those changes remains to be seen. And I can live with that.

I really should have worded that better, I was speaking too much in general terms.

Yes edges did not go away, but a LARGE portion of edge points were removed. I meant to say please give back some of what was taken. And again, I was speaking in general so I didn't mean YOU UMI give us back our edge points. I meant that's how most players feel.

Sorry if this seems like I'm talking just to you(Umi), what I've been saying is meant to be directed at the immstaff.

Because he isn't on staff anymore, or at least that's what he wants us to think.

You know this for a fact? Remember the devil's greatest tricks. ;)

Yes Murphy, I know he's not on the staff anymore. What I was saying wasn't meant to be directed at Umi and only Umi. It was meant for the immstaff. Sorry I did not specify that, I figured it was obvious. But don't worry, I'll hold your hand for you. Hugs? HUGZ!

Except for the hugz.

I guess in some way "better" is a relative thing but the game *did* used to be popular before he took a big dump on it.

I look back on when you could get a buddy to farm up barrier rods for the cabal from the Balrog as the "good old days". I never felt a more immersive but also vastly more time consuming and boring approach was beneficial to anyone.

Money changes - so much fun adding another thing to farm and lose when you die.

Edge nerfs - yay now I'm even less close to resembling the edge list from -Insert Imm here's- latest PK character.

Ugh. Come back to reality.

I'm not saying there haven't been any good changes but there's been a ton, ton, ton of unnecessary changes to make the game less fun to play and "hardly working" class additions (thieves, rangers, orcs, so on).

Yeah, it sucks if you forgot to put some money in the bank, but the upside, which is that money has actual use now, is a big positive.

In the past, characters would never be interested in exchanging great gear for gold. Now they might. And gold has value as a potential turning factor in a fight.

>Yeah, it sucks if you forgot to put some money in the bank,
>but the upside, which is that money has actual use now, is a
>big positive.

This is only a positive if you have money/can get money. To some extent, you and I benefit from this change, where as someone without as much area knowledge at best breaks even vs. before and certainly loses out vs. someone with more area knowledge. I'm not *trying* to pull the newbie card, but I'd be hard pressed to find a way that this isn't a 100% benefit to vets in comparison to a newer player and an overall detriment to "fun" as you are now farming an additional resource that you used to get for "free".


>In the past, characters would never be interested in
>exchanging great gear for gold. Now they might. And gold has
>value as a potential turning factor in a fight.

In the past they might have given away that dragon gear, or left it laying for someone, now they are selling it to shopkeepers for gold and buying from shopkeepers is a fools choice.

Gold always had a potential to turn fights, but moreso now in the lack of gold department. Necro's, AP's, and Rager's benefit from people not having as much gold, but they don't really need help killing folks anyway... At the point where you've made it to a healer (or gotten away from a rager enough to heal) do we really need to punish you with additional downtime while you wait out effects instead of healing them away?

A game with 10 treadmills doesn't need the 11th treadmill. Previously money just didn't matter after you were level 30 or so and that was fine. You had/have other things to worry about anyway - like PVP, prepping, etc. Having to spend more time doing things that aren't fun wasn't necessary.

You could buy healing back then too and buy better preps than you can buy now so it's not like it has actually made you more powerful. Gold was useful and it was easy and it's not like that was a problem.

As far as I'm aware you still can't buy a set of gear from a vendor that wouldn't have you at a 70% health/damage deficit in every fight you're in at hero.

.....DID HE???

I was implying that Umiron was Valguarnera. It was pretty obvious one, wasn't it?

Gosh, now I'll have to sue Murphy.

NT

NT