This is one of those, "While I was waking up in the shower" thoughts. It occurred to me that conjurers seem much scarier now post-edge than they did when I first started playing CF. The average servitor seems higher now, and where in the past you could bank on the notion that if you hurt the evil conjurer enough, his servitors will turn, now they rarely do.

As I have only played two conjurers, both in the last two years, I don't have the depth of perspective to answer the following two questions, so I put it out there for discussion:

Are conjurers noticeably stronger than they were prior to edges?

Are (particularly evil) conjurers easier to play since edges went in?

Well, yeah. But other classes are buffed as well. The question is whether edged-out conjurer gains more than edged-out {other class}. Consider thief, for example, which can get 20 extra thief points via edges. 120pt thief vs. 100pt thief is a pretty big boost in deathfulness.

The main thing that scares me about evil conjies is the higher ceiling on how buff their gaunts can be. Cheapshot, etc. Before, a lot of classes could more or less ignore gaunts so long as they stayed healthy at night. If one came they could be reasonably sure they'd be able to defeat it and not get taken. There are still builds for which that's true, but I'd argue there are significantly fewer of them. Plus, while the "really terrible" gaunt locations no longer work, there are plenty left that are "mostly terrible". It makes me want to roll an evil conjurer just to abuse them. "Wands" is the main thing that stops me doing so.

It might be that I'm used to playing goody conjurers, but when I played a few evils, even though I got a lot of kills (50+) and all the CALM THE #### DOWN DEVIL edges, I constantly got raped by my devils. It seemed like every time I got a pk I traded it with a devil death. Even AFTER reading all the evil conjie FAQ's written by IMMs/Players and keeping devils 'happy'.

Conjurers do have the best set of edges in my opinion from a usefulness point of view.

FYI, Nightgaunts haven't changed significantly in a long time -- like probably about a decade. Including the cheap shot thing even, I think.

I don't think their edge is that relevant in the kinds of cases you're worrying about.

I thought there was some edge that juiced night gaunt strength? You're probably right about cheap shot though; I usually have near-permanent flight.

>I thought there was some edge that juiced night gaunt
>strength?

Yes, but it mostly helps in situations in which using a nightgaunt is maybe not the best idea.

When I was heading to the "mostly terrible" spots I used for gaunting, I'd look at my pk list and see a few things:

1: Lots of warriors. You're never getting a warrior with a gaunt. Maybe one on the bottom of your range that is an elf or something.

2: Rager of any kind. Not happening if you didn't weaken them first and caught them outside eastern road (yeah right). Maybe a thief.

3: Anyone with friends. This means most fortress hugging their 5 friends.

I am probably missing some things since its been awhile, but basically I would look for bards, shapeshifters not in form (by checking via sight of the damned and draining my mana), thieves if I could see them, low range assassins, and invokers if I don't think they're wanded up.

However, the super scary spot can easily be worded from, or if you're like most of the people I gaunted successfully, you flee down on the first try and give me an aneurysm. The other spot is of course the sands of sorrow, which is just as much a bitch for me to navigate as you.

1: I'd agree if the warrior is a decent tank.

2: Rager resist do make them almost perm-prepped so for the most part I can see what you're getting at.

3: Anyone who has one of the above who can tank and rescues said target, again yes.

4: On the flip side:
I know that "someone I know" and I have both been killed by how hard and how often nightgaunts hit, even before they
had a chance to bring us back. I thought it was a little bs to begin with as I've never had that happen before
but I had it happen to me recently even when using some protections.

I think I ate five demo-devs with aura and maybe shield up, fled and last hit killed me.

Disclaimer: Not saying that any edges made this happen, just that gaunts shouldn't be seen as week.

The best way to gaunt someone is when you've be clair'ing them for a while (or spying on them with a familiar...something your nightwalker fam could have totally done) and they are already hurt/alone/weak.

And you need to search for more spots :) There's some gaunting spots that are literally a death sentence.

Yeah. Every time I find one it makes me want to play a gaunt-monkey evil conjurer. But then I read posts like Lydia's where he died to his devil all the time and I remember how little luck I have finding wands.

that look good do not work (gaunt insta leaves), can be worded from, or else are only good against ragers, which, as stated, are immune_nightgaunt anyway.

edit: also the nightwalker familiar cannot open doors and isnt pass door, so you'd be surprised how difficult it was to actually scout with.