Does this legacy do anything besides add 8 dam roll?

It seems like such a waste of legacy as it is. I mean, 8 dam roll can be gained through gear MUCH more easily than say 200hp which Soul will grant you.

Is there any reason it was toned down from 10 dam roll? I can hardly see the legacy being so over powered that it required the nerf, or that losing 2 dam would make a huge difference in its (lack of) strength.

Can anyone enlighten me please?

a) You might be creating a pure damage focussed build, not aiming for overall efficiency. For example, your plan might be to one-round as many people as possible with flurry, in which case you might want trapping + chilling with 1 heavy weapon and one light.
b) You can always use the damage, and can't always use the hp (e.g. damage still helps when not tanking).

For b) probably too.

I think there's a number of builds for which there's nothing obviously superior. It's still a boring-ass legacy, but two permanent wide coppers (pre-nerf) is a decent thing. I agree that at 8 it seems just enough worse that I'd never really take it, but whatever.

I would agree though that point-wise, 200hp is much harder to find than 8 dam roll. But HP is also less useful for a heroish warrior.

I don't know how the math works, specifically if enhanced damaged incorporates damroll, but +8 dam takes 200hp in 25 hits without any multiplier at all, which you can get at hero. Also consider that for someone like a rager, a deathblow is doing 8*5 damage, so you're eating into that 200hp a bit faster.

So while the 200hp is harder to gear for, I don't think it's clearly better than 8 dam on a warrior. On a mage, rogue or priest, yeah, the 200hp would be a clear winner.

It was the most popular legacy for a long, long time before the change, FWIW. It's still moderately popular.

The thing you have to figure is that, for any other legacy you can pick, it's trivial to come up with a situation in which Chilling is better because +dam is so universally useful to a warrior.

That being said, I prefer more interesting legacies and would probably never pick it, and I also think Soul is a sucker bet.

I mean... 200 hp sure sounds like a lot to me, especially if I'm an arial or elf. You'd rather take a defensive legacy to preserve/simulate that 200 hp?

I mean, if you had to pick your legacies for some reason without knowing what race/class/cabal/alignment your warrior would be, sure, 200 HP is always useful.

But for a given character I can always find something else I'd rather have, and my warriors very rarely have fights where 200 HP would be decisive. Generally I've either won the fight with a larger margin than that or I'm dying in a situation where my number of HP are mostly immaterial.

YMMV.

I personally was super happy with both my legacies for Vhaile, mostly because it made me an ideal Bondmate (even though I hardly ever bonded hah).

Soul for the health (Human warrior with mostly stat gear and svs gear has 1350 hp) and Fluid for the feinting which helped tank for shifter/invoker/whatever bondmate.

Other than those types of builds/situations, yeah, Soul does seem like a sucker bet.

Yeah, you definitely can make cases for it.

I just don't think it's universally good enough to be the most popular legacy by a good margin, which right now it is.

>I just don't think it's universally good enough to be the most
>popular legacy by a good margin, which right now it is.

Sure it is. It's useful independent of race, specs, and tactics (mostly). In every close fight you have, Soul is always good no matter what class you're facing. The players have a clear idea what it does without having to interpret cryptic descriptions. These are all reasons I'm not at all surprised it's the most popular by a wide margin.

I've never taken it and not sure I ever will--not because I don't think it's good, but it doesn't seem like much fun. But it is pretty easy for me to understand why it is so popular. Here's a conversation my last character had with someone about legacies (I was an elf warrior rager applicant): http://www.qhcf.net/phorum/read.php?3,819221,819221#msg-819221

Hutto, the Sleepy Nitpicker


'Sorry, I'm not 72323slhlst. Or however you say Elite'
-Vynmylak

For the record, I think most of what that guy had to say is wrong. :)

Yeah, I know he's wrong on the Harmonious, so I wasn't putting much stock in what he was saying for Ward and Whirlwind either. One of these years I'll get a high-dex character into Battle! *fistshake*

Hutto, the Sleepy Nitpicker


'Sorry, I'm not 72323slhlst. Or however you say Elite'
-Vynmylak

That's... a really good point.

I mean, what % of all pk deaths are like that Nnaeshuk vs. Ckath log on dio's right now, super-close and down to the wire 1v1? Taking something that would definitely swing the fight in your favor, like Crashing plush timely lag or blinding affects is far more interesting strategically.

Hrm. This really makes me think about how I've always viewed warriors...

Take, as an example, a dagger spec vs sword spec.

Dagger spec starts maladicting sword spec, who meanwhile spams some kind of damage skill on the dagger spec.

a) There may come a point in the fight where the sword spec figures he should flurry to finish it. So he does, and the dagger spec goes down.

b) However, if the dagger spec has 200 extra hp, the sword spec needs to delay his flurry by a round (say), with a jab and some melee first. Meanwhile that extra maladict landed by the dagger spec in that round could totally swing that fight.

Under both a) and b), the victor could easily finish with way more than 200 hp, even though the 200hp was the decisive factor.

I know this doesn't always apply. Just making the point that even to those involved it isn't necessarily obvious how 200 extra hp affects a fight.

Well, sure. But in that case you're comparing 200hp with not having 200 hp, rather than, let's say, Soul vs. Dance (which maybe means the sword warrior hits less and gets concealed more.)

I like the idea of soul for those "oh #### oh ####" moments when an unexpected flurry, deathblow or nuke catches you.

I like the idea of soul for those "oh #### oh ####" moments when an unexpected flurry, deathblow or nuke catches you.

Conversely, Chilling Embrace favors the offensive-minded player who wants to put you in this very situation.

More players on CF play "not to lose" than "play to win", though.

valguarnera@carrionfields.com

That and "winning" means something else than I had hoped when I started playing here.

Winning to me is just playing a realistic, immersive, well-done role and doing it justice and not feeling like I butchered it or didn't live up to it.

Haven't done that in a few years with any success.

Unlike many Legacies, +8 damroll is useful all the time, regardless of strategic decisions. When it was +10 dam, it was very popular even though you really didn't have to adapt your style at all to get the most out of it.

It's still being taken. Given that there's 36 choices, I think it still fills a role.

valguarnera@carrionfields.com