I've been playing for years and never beat one with servants.

I've chopped shields, bashed, stripped, dual wielded, blackjack then backstabbed, various spells, what ever. Just can't do it.

How is it done?

I've played lots of conjurers and get mowed down pretty easily. Without an archon, even thieves will usually kill me before dieing to servitors. Backstab, trip trip trip does it pretty well. As a warrior, bash. But then maybe the people fighting you have DR and high defenses.

What level are you having problems with them at?

Overall, when I'm playing a fighting class, the basic idea is to:

1. Neutralize their parry and/or shield block (disarm/maledict/offhand/cleave/etc.) and
2. Be able to out-tank the conjurer's servitors.

A little more specifically, if:

- ... the conjurer has an archon, engage the archon after you're neutralized the parry/shield-block, so the archon attacks you instead of healing the conjurer. Archon-using conjurers are generally the easiest to PK because they're "straight up," meaning there's little room for the unexpected. If you can't out-tank an archon, you need to think about tactics like ganging, striking the conjurer when he's unprepared, or dealing out so much damage the archon does not have time to commune sanctuary on to the conjurer.

- ... the conjurer has a devil, you can take the conjurer head on after you've neutralized the parry/shield-block, trying to deal as much damage as you can while keeping track of when the devil's maledictions reach a point of critical mass. Or perhaps more ideally, you would be able to set a trap to hit the devil-using conjurer when he is not entirely expecting it. Devil-using conjurers are far more dangerous than archon-using conjurers because they have serious potential for unexpectedly destroying you and your clever plans, but on the bright side they're more fragile and it takes a pretty skilled conjurer to make a devil work without dying.

- ... the conjurer has a demon/angel, as long as you're out-tanking the demon/angel, lag the conjurer out. If you can't out-tank the demon/angel, you're going to need to hit and run, or try to strike the conjurer when he is not entirely expecting it.

And I just bashed a conj and died in two rounds when his angle disarmed me and pillared.

Basically this has happened so many times I don't want to fight them.

Thanks for the response though especially with reguard to the archon.

Generally you can get a rough idea of a servitor based on it's short-desc and the conjurer's level. That's for general PK. If he knows where his opponent will be and has enough time i.e. around 10 RL minutes or more, the servitors will be even higher in level. If the conjurer is in a hurry they will be even lower in level.

Based on the conjurer's level and his playstyle, his servitors should ideally be 3-7 levels above him without spending too much mana.

If the conjurer is 5-9 levels above you that means your fight is going to be anywhere from extremely difficult to impossible without ganging.

If a conjurer of either alignment is being aggressive pre-hero, that usually means he's found some damage reduction and isn't afraid of the opponents that he's immediately aware of. A large percentage of people who claim to have 'taken out entire groups' with servitors have usually only managed to kill one or two people and had the third flee, rarely will all three groupmates be so incompetent or make a mistake during trying to fight back as to die to the same individual conjurer.

While the rules for level and tanking don't apply to PC's they do apply to charmies across the board. However, the skills a given servitor uses on you depends on the situation and it's morale more than it's level, though level can restrict what skills it has access to, and more powerful varieties of devil usually, but not always, get a boost by a level or two over a similar level devil of the previous tier as well as a natural access to a wider range of skills. The same goes for archons/angels. For demons, it's based purely on level.


Bard Repertoire Clarifications:
http://forums.carrionfields.com/dc/dcboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=6&topic_id=23735&mesg_id=23735&page=

nt

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And that's being a wimp.

Perhaps you two somehow read my post like this:

YOU SHOULD GANG EVERYONE THAT POSES EVEN A SLIGHT CHALLENGE TO YOU.

If you're a whiny warrior that comes on to the official's board crying that conjies are invincible, then you must realize there's no shame in ganging a dude that can 2-round you. Otherwise, adapt and get tougher like Daevryn said, or gtfo and don't fight that guy.

If a staff member confirms for me the anon whiner is pro, I'll donate 10 pbfs.

But you shouldn't be accusing him of whining.

He isn't whining at all. He's saying he is unable to accomplish something and asking for advice.

People are far to quick to throw the whining accusation these days.

of being TOO quick to whine.

Being a murder:flurry giant might be enough. Or a pincer:pincer warrior might be enough. It seemed to me less asking for advice than plaintive whining.

Had s/he said: I've tried x and y tactics to defeat conjurers at "A" and "B" levels/aligns/familiars/whatever would have lent much more weight to her/his whine.

God I lurve slashes.

I've chopped shields, bashed, stripped, dual wielded, blackjack then backstabbed, various spells, what ever. Just can't do it

In other words you're just a flamer.

You have to be one of the most cinsistant griefers on the board.

Does it occure to you that the way you present yourself on the forums and in game is counterproductive to your goals? At the very least it's self destructive as the animis you display discredits you and drives away other players with whom you play the game.

Maybe you should try Zork?

I don't suppose it's possible to review Blackbirds contributions to the forums and over all opinions of players toward him? I think as our numbers fall we need to cut out those things that discourage growth.

>If a staff member confirms for me the anon whiner is pro, I'll
>donate 10 pbfs.

I can confirm that an anon poster in this thread is. I'm not going to offer my opinion on whether or not whining is taking place.

On that note, probably everyone should review Zulg's rules up top about being anonymous on this forum.

.

And what's more reading comprehension is essential.

not worth it :)

aerfger

>And I just bashed a conj and died in two rounds when his
>angle disarmed me and pillared.

Well, two things:

1) You may want to rethink your strategy with respect to command denial. I mean, you wouldn't bash another warrior who hit so hard that you died in two rounds, right? I know you're thinking: it's a mage, I can bash them, I'm going to bash them and they're going down, but mostly, that conjurer either doesn't care if you bash him, or actually is thrilled that you are lagging yourself for him.

2) If you're dying in two rounds, you may either need to avoid that fight or get tougher in general. Most people just aren't dying that fast to conjurers, except maybe in the case where you've got a high 20s conjurer rolling the low end of his range, and even then I wouldn't say it's all that common.

Conjies are both very tough and can be very weak too. If you play one to the mid 30's you will see very clearly where they are weak.

Just some general tips though

1.) you are better off being chased by the conjie then chasing them if you can't handle the servitors.

2.) If they have an archon and do not have sanc up and you have pincer, pincer them. You have about 2 rounds before they are beefy (one round for sanc one round to start healing if they don't have a happy archon you may get 3 or 4 which should be enough to kill an unprepped mage)

3.) if you are losing walk away, it takes time to conjure and to a degree you have to conjure different creatures based on who you are fighting, if you make this tougher the conjie will either take bigger risks or ignore you.

4.) like malakhi said. While mages are not renowned for their tanking abilities there is a monumental difference between a mage with parry and a mage getting hit on every single attack, take away a conjurers weapon and shield and you can hut them much faster, hopefully faster then they can hurt you or they can heal. This is also how you destroy muters who go from decent tanks when fully prepped to getting pooed on if you get rid of their staff.


5.) Kill the familiar. Not all familiars are particularily good at taking blows and they can be lagged like a pc. instead of bashing the conjie try to bash his owl.

6.) Vs goodies burst damage is your friend. an archon will kick in healing around the time they drop to 80% hp, so you have to time your burst damage. but most conjies with an archon are not going to be as worried as anyone else when they hit 40% hp and will tend to stick around take advantage of that.

7.) if you have affects that target morale servitors happyness is based on morale, lower the morale of the servitors and you can make them either less effective or even cause them to be a detriment to the conjurer.

8.) Devils hurt and bash and trip but they do not cast when fighting you you may be better off tanking them then eating maledicts.

nt

not with a single char btw.

My experience is that they do not. Perhaps an ultra super happy devil will but I have never seen it.

What you may be confusing is that very happy devils can cast when they enter a room or when you are in another room right after you flee so if you are iun a situation where you are fleeing and re-engaging you could end up getting hit with a couple of spells in before you are engaged in melee.

I have also played evil conjies and my experience was the same.

I've never seen a devil commune on someone they are hitting. And I've played both evil conjies and fought them too.

There was once I thought maybe I'd seen it, but after that I watched out for it, and never saw it again, so I now think it didn't happen.

nt

Depending on the familiar, that could be the worst option of all.

For example, killing an imp is not all that easy in most circumstances, relative to killing its conjurer.

There are times when killing the imp is easier, but they are few and far between.

Lots of damage real fast.

Guy with angel/demon/devil and wands who sees you coming = probably not going to die to you.

Guy with archon might, if you surprise him when he's not sanc'd, or if sanc wears off at an inappropriate time.

Obviously attacking them when they don't have pets is ideal.

...is to attack their main pet (angel/archon/demon/devil) PROVIDED you can survive it.

Now, I will say this, attacking a demon/devil usually means death, so hit it once then focus ALL your efforts on killing the conjurer after that, unless you feel confident you can kill the demon/devil.

Conjurers with archons are a bit easier, especially if you can lag the conjurer. Attacking the archon will cause it to forget to heal the conjurer and you can then beat on them unmercifully.