Could we see them get some kind of exp penalty just to balance them out as they move toward hero?

The reason I bring this up is because until I played a druid, I don't think I realised how insanely powerful they are. While I'm not suggesting they're 'overpowered' they definetly feel much stronger than a lot of the classes in CF purely because they can do a bit of everything - and often do it exceedingly well.

They have healing that is more efficient than a healer, and stronger than a shaman.

Offensive prayers that rival an invoker.

Pets that rival a conjurers elementals. With advantages like short recall timers, no turning on their master and rescue.

And the clencher - unlike a ranger they retain most of their power even in a civilised area. Your defenses are the same and the 5 or so offensive prayers that can still be used, have full effect.

I understand an empowerment class has a bit more 'vetting' than assassins or rangers that take a fair exp penalty whack for having self-healing. That's cool. But unlike paladins, a vanilla druid is insanely sweet all through the ranks with only the empowerment bump.

Thanks for reading.

I think druids are powerful even at low ranks. I killed a lot of people with telluric surge, or just entangle if they didn't have metal weapons.

Personally I would give druids an exp pen of 400.

I've played several now, if you wonder.

And still totally dominated everyone I went up against. I would say 400 is being kind.

...one of the most overpowered skills ever made and they'd be fine with a decent exp penalty.

Whoever thought of telluric surge must be cracked out - add in that it gets edges to make it worse, it's beyond abusable. The worst part is that it stuns via freezing (so it eats commands away).

It's bad enough having a metal weapon against their protection at low ranks - add in this and it's complete overkill.

Or just leaving on minor metal things?

The things that are getting you, are metal body armor, legs, arms, boots. In all seriousness, remove those and you can laugh at their wasted mana. Having metal weapons alone does not make telluric surge do damange or movement drain - making it a far less effective prayer.

With Jichii, I for some reason had an outlander druid constantly gunning for me in the low ranks. I didn't have much chance to kill them, but I found removing all my metal not only didn't impact my ability just to defend from them - but made the druid use fireseeds which I could save against far more easily and let me escape. As long as I stuck to civilized places to escape the druid, entangle wasn't a fear either.

It's like Magus said, if you know their weaknesses it's far easier.

If telurric surge doesn't work, you immediately can switch gears - if it does, you've got a 1 round lagging ability that can disarm, freeze, damage, and more.

It's like having fumble, mental jolt, entangle and more in one single commune.

It's too good.

What it can do and what it's likely to do or can do in one cast are two very, very different things. I mean, if we're taking that angle hack and chromatic fire are the two most broken abilities in the game, because look at the list of terrible things they could do!

I've played druids that had TS and used it in PKs; I've played a ton of characters who fought druids who used telluric surge. In all that time, the only fight I've witnessed where TS seemed really good is one in which, the 20s druid using it had a hero healer with them but, for some unfathomable reason, the guy they killed still thought they could win and stuck around about twenty rounds too long.

TS is less likely to disarm you -- assuming you're even wielding a metal weapon -- than power word kill is to kill you.

And, okay, low level ability vs. level 40 ability, but come on.

asdvav

Per cast, perhaps.

But then pwk means you have to get the opening attack. TS does not.

PWK takes lots of mana. TS does not.

Therefore you can get many more opportunities to disarm with TS relative to opportunities to kill with pwk.

My experience is that the frequency with which you can apply TS means disarms happen far more for a druid than pwk's work for a necro. Moreover, you very frequently get the feint affect.

And yes, there is plenty of other ways to get disarmed at 36, even for a single round, but when you get fumbled and locked for the duration where they can sac it and you're still frozen....that kinda freebie does not belong on a class that already had *plenty* of utility. I've been on the receiving end where a druid just spams it and it's really a pain in the ass to deal with. Any kind of server lag and you'll be hard pressed to put in the right amount of commands that won't get eaten by the freeze or get yourself spammed or cost you your weapon.

I did a *lot* of anti-paladin versus druid fights - I even stripped down my metal and wore a non-metal weapon (now people realize why I like the shillegah) but gimping myself that much to even have a shot is ridiculous - especially considering they have their pets and whole other set of abilities that'll still beat your face in. Doesn't it feint also?

In just itself, telluric surge isn't that bad - it's an extremely strong commune but I can handle that...if they had nothing else. Given what the class already had, and adding in edges to even make it worse (thought edges were supposed to help the crappy/unused skills?), who thought "yeah, druids are lacking...let's give them this!" Seriously, what kind of discussion merited giving them that strong of a commune - especially at low level.

Had they never played the druid class? Any solid player who stands behind one usually destroys with them. The same can't be said of paladins, especially the new ones.

I'll be honest: I've never actually seen someone wearing enough metal armor to be held a full round on a failed telluric surge save.

I can theorize how much metal crap and what conditions that would take, but in practice, I've never seen it. I think you're way overblowing the toughness of the spell.

It's a spell that's very strong by its self and given what druids already have its crazy.

Is it an "I win button"? Maybe not but way more than PWK.

I'm curious: Why do you blow out of proportion every single spell or skill brought to bear upon your characters, when if that skill or spell was in your hands you would fumble and be mostly ineffective with it?


Let's face it, when you are a ####ty player, you will be raped by elbow and knee, much less telluric surge. Also, why are you comparing telluric surge to PWK? Next, you'll compare the Renewal of Spring legacy to the wombat form. "Wombat form is so overpowered!" STFU. I wish instead of being telluric surged to death you ate 4 **DEMO** fireseeds that burned away all your tears in the process.

Is Tngni supposed to be Tangni, the shifter that's still a character? Because if you are, I think you should stop positing under the name tngni under topics not on the battlefield.

I don't think it's helping your image at all, especially when you use curse words since you arent going to go out and say the same words like STFU and ####ty IC. Now that they incorporated the anon system, why don't you just use another handle name?

And if you arent Tangni...um. Get a new handle?

Tongni was Tongni before Tangni was Tangni.

>

I was just commenting on that comparrison.

You need a new handle. I can't help but wonder if you are using it to try to give Tangni a bad image.

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And I ripped them apart because they were wearing sub-optimum armor, because all their good armor (designed to fight every other character in the mud) includes a lot of metal.

So generally they won't have a good set of non-metal armor. When they wear inferior (or no) substitutes, you just rip them up with entangle instead.

>Whoever thought of telluric surge must be cracked out - add in
>that it gets edges to make it worse, it's beyond abusable. The
>worst part is that it stuns via freezing (so it eats commands
>away).

Isn't it generally better to have your commands eaten away? That way you can't possibly get caught spamming. Unless I didn't get what you mean.

For me, it's maybe about as good as mental jolt -- except you have a pretty good idea from typing 'who pk' which people in your range mental jolt will wreak havoc on and which won't care enough, whereas it's much less trivial to figure out which people in your PK range are wearing 800 pounds of metal armor for some reason.

Not every time, but most of the time the druid has a much better PK choice than telluric surge in my opinion. (And what it is will vary.)

Not at lower ranks they don't.

When I played my druid, I always felt like certain people knew how to fight them, and certain people didn't.

The people who knew how to fight a druid, and took advantage of a few weaknesses that they have, then it would be a losing fight.

Then there are people who are just oblivious to the weanesses of a druid (likely because they never played one), and would usually get tooled in a big way.

They can be strong in the right situation. They can be not-so-strong in other situations.

And yet druids remain one of the rarest classes. You see a lot more paladins than druids. You see a lot of rangers too, so it's not like the wilderness thing is putting people off.

Druids definitely are strong, but meh, they're not *that* strong. What in your mind is the point of an exp penalty? Is it to skew the pk range? Because I don't feel like I really see druids sitting around abusing lowbies or anything.