What do you think of any of the following? (I deleted some of my wilder ideas like spirit shepherd giving back the 1/3rd con... hehe... but am leaving what I consider may be good changes.)


Aegis: Consider adding resist positive to aegis. I think this will decrease the amount of complaining about wrath weapons and will certainly provide a counter to a giant wielding two two-handed black swords and dealing more damage than Humansunders! Alternatively, consider giving good healers resist negative, evil healers resist positive, and neutral healers resist polarity which is a random positive/negative resist similar to neutral healer's protection spell. Paladins rip up evils anyway, so I don't think resist to wrath would really hurt that much. Just a thought.


Ardent Faith: Why such high mana cost? It seems to only very marginally lower the duration of maledictions. To be honest I never understood how to use it well or found a good situation to use it to justify the mana cost. I would lower the mana cost to one third of what it is now so healers can afford to always have it up.


Purity of Flesh/Purity of Blood: Extreme mana cost for very short duration. Perhaps make it an immunity for that duration and have a mechanic similar to invoker shields? Alternatively, and I think a better solution, is lower the mana cost. To be honest anything over 50 mana is too much for these abilities. Purity of Mind, on the other hand, certainly has its uses against bards, so I treat it differently from Purity of Flesh/Purity of Blood.


Bulwark of Faith: I know it's great and I understand its uses but it's too short and too costly. I would consider lowering the mana cost.


Miraculous Foresight: I could never justify 250 mana on this. It's just brutal.

>Miraculous Foresight: I could never justify 250 mana on this.
>It's just brutal.

Sometimes you may want to leave the cabal and have an assassin waiting outside or you want to gate into a situation where you might get subjected to insta-kill attacks(such as vs necromancer). The latter situation allows you to rest up your mana for an hour or two before gating, so you can get into the situation all recharged.

>Aegis: Consider adding resist positive to aegis. I think this
>will decrease the amount of complaining about wrath weapons
>and will certainly provide a counter to a giant wielding two
>two-handed black swords and dealing more damage than
>Humansunders! Alternatively, consider giving good healers
>resist negative, evil healers resist positive, and neutral
>healers resist polarity which is a random positive/negative
>resist similar to neutral healer's protection spell. Paladins
>rip up evils anyway, so I don't think resist to wrath would
>really hurt that much. Just a thought.

Basically the idea is that, thematically, healers shouldn't be passing out resist positive since healing is positive energy.

>Ardent Faith: Why such high mana cost? It seems to only very
>marginally lower the duration of maledictions. To be honest I
>never understood how to use it well or found a good situation
>to use it to justify the mana cost. I would lower the mana
>cost to one third of what it is now so healers can afford to
>always have it up.

It's a Valg project. They nearly always err on the side of weak because he hated to hear people cry about nerfings. :)

That being said, I know it was his explicit attention that you probably wouldn't want to pay the cost to have it up 24/7. One of these days I'll talk to him about CFy stuff again and I'll try to remember to wrangle out the rest of his thought process.

>Purity of Flesh/Purity of Blood: Extreme mana cost for very
>short duration. Perhaps make it an immunity for that duration
>and have a mechanic similar to invoker shields? Alternatively,
>and I think a better solution, is lower the mana cost. To be
>honest anything over 50 mana is too much for these abilities.
>Purity of Mind, on the other hand, certainly has its uses
>against bards, so I treat it differently from Purity of
>Flesh/Purity of Blood.

I'm pretty good with the way these are now, honestly.

Yeah, it's a lot of mana for a short duration. On the flipside of that, if you really really want to get someone's ability to make disease saves (etc.) up for a bit, you've got that option and really no one else does.

There's just so much defensive power in the healer class. I really don't see them needing to hand out immunities.

>Bulwark of Faith: I know it's great and I understand its uses
>but it's too short and too costly. I would consider lowering
>the mana cost.

I'll have a look at it again. Short and costly was kind of the plan, though, honestly. The idea on a lot of this stuff is that you'd consider it for the exact situation it's meant to fix, but that keeping it up all the time isn't really practical.

Maybe reuse timers are a better way to do that. I'm open to ideas.

>Miraculous Foresight: I could never justify 250 mana on this.
>It's just brutal.

I think if I were playing a Tribunal healer I would think this was mostly useless too.

But, honestly, I've frequently seen healers that don't have detect hidden as a possibility walk into situations where they're pretty sure someone will try to assassinate them. Usually these are cabal raid situations where for whatever reason of RP or strategy they're choosing to walk right into the ambush rather than clear out. In these cases I think the 250 mana for it is pretty well justified.

The problem I found with these communes really wasn't the cost, but the balance between casting time and duration. A lot of choices in fights are kind of reactive where you need to respond quickly....and when a fight suddenly goes down, having the option to heal and cure it over giving a higher resist (which still isn't 100%) - it just didn't seem beneficial.

I'm on the boat to increase the durations but another option would be just a quicker casting time. You can't see a fight, sit outside and cast 5-6 things beforehand with high mana costs - it's usually not worth it.

Walking into something you KNOW will disease/poison you that's not during a player fight? Yeah, maybe...but that's a single supplication for a single case where a cure usually is the better option

You -do- play anti-paladins, yes?

And then you ask why someone might want to use a block rather than a cure?

Same logic applies to necros.

If I'm running into a necromancer as a healer, I can either waste a huge amount of my mana to make me resistant (not immune) to those effects (with the chances he's going to try and disease me during combat is real small in comparison to blind, energy drain, etc) for a very small amount of time....or I can just keep in reserve 100-ish mana and be cured of all of it with no chance of failure.

If the mana cost was less, I'd consider it.
If the effect lasted longer than a few hours, I'd consider it.
If it was complete immunity, I'd consider it.

But it's not and honestly just worth curing or healing sleep moreso.


Great necro thread push by the way, that was posted in June.

Thank you for replying and sharing the thoughts behind these abilities.

Aegis: fair enough.

Ardent Faith: cool, cannot wait to see the Valg changes.

Purities: Yes, they are nice and certainly have their uses... but almost never against NPCs (they'll poison/disease eventually). Maybe make it a 2 hour immunity? I still think the mana cost is way too high. Having said that, if the design is to have these as rarely situational tools, they are certainly great.

Bullwark of Faith: Don't get me wrong it's an awesome ability, but think of it this way, for a healer to do a basic spell up, it costs about 250 mana. (Sanctuary, bless, frenzy, fly, protective shield, protection.) So if an average healer has 1100 mana, that leaves 850 for combat. Dumping another 200 on bullwark of faith is just a tough decision. Perhaps make it so that it does a crapload of damage like druid bash protection? And taht damage is escalating? Taht way silly bashing warriors will kill themselves on it?

The bottom line, as a healer, mana is your bread and butter and anything that's 200 mana better be worth it!

Miraculous Foresight: Fair enough, I got spoiled as a trib.

Resist positive is a conjurer buff. Healers shouldn't get it.

*grumbles about resist positive and negative buffs as preps*

>
>>Aegis: Consider adding resist positive to aegis. I think
>this
>>will decrease the amount of complaining about wrath weapons
>>and will certainly provide a counter to a giant wielding two
>>two-handed black swords and dealing more damage than
>>Humansunders! Alternatively, consider giving good healers
>>resist negative, evil healers resist positive, and neutral
>>healers resist polarity which is a random positive/negative
>>resist similar to neutral healer's protection spell.
>Paladins
>>rip up evils anyway, so I don't think resist to wrath would
>>really hurt that much. Just a thought.
>
>Basically the idea is that, thematically, healers shouldn't be
>passing out resist positive since healing is positive energy.
>

So why not make it an edge for evil healers only? I see doing this one of two ways, either allowing the edge to be expensive and giving resist positive as an extra aegis to the healer, or, make it a less expensive edge and instead of adding it, it changes the resist negative to resist positive, so they lose the negative but gain the positive. A choice rather than an addition.

>So why not make it an edge for evil healers only?

Sure, and they'll give up healing in exchange?

Or did you not read what I wrote?

Pretty much, yup. My eyes skipped down a para for part of that, so didn't see that at all.

Hey, look, there's something really amazing over there!!!

Nothing to see here folks, move along.