Having just played another until 30th.

Bloodsteep: Never worked except to mangle me shortly before a PK so I had to sleep in order to keep from wimpying in the first round.

Spinebreaker: Never worked, lagged so long only move possible.

Crushing Assault: Worked. Never did any good. That is. Didn't hit any more often, got hit more, even if for less. Get one free hit against you if it works.

Can't hide except the one place any thief with an invisibility potion can find you. Yeah yeah, can hide in caves at 37th. Whoopdedoo Bazzle!

Headbutt: like shield bash, but injures you.

Forcedmarch: life saver, but injures and slays con for 2 days

Grapple weapon: Never worked, injured me.

War shout: It worked! But I saw no affect still had my ass handed to me.

No shield block.

Pin: Replaces Cheashot. WTF? Yeah, I'll trade two axes for that.

Wimp set, can't finish fights.

>Having just played another until 30th.
>
>Bloodsteep: Never worked except to mangle me shortly before a
>PK so I had to sleep in order to keep from wimpying in the
>first round.
>

So use your **** elf blood you doofus.

>Spinebreaker: Never worked, lagged so long only move
>possible.
>

Spinebreaker is good for group v group fights. If you are using it instead of flee, it should be because fleeing is impossible or because you are using it offensively, not defensively.

>Crushing Assault: Worked. Never did any good. That is. Didn't
>hit any more often, got hit more, even if for less. Get one
>free hit against you if it works.
>

You are talking crazy talk. Crushing assault is amazing. It has a huge effect on their parrying, and whilst they can still parry a little it pretty much turns it into a hp and damage brawl, which can be nice for orcs (e.g. vs assassins) especially as you screw their dex too. Oh, and did I mention you can savage feed off of it too?

This has got to be one of the all time great orc skills. Really useful for ranking too.

>Can't hide except the one place any thief with an invisibility
>potion can find you. Yeah yeah, can hide in caves at 37th.
>Whoopdedoo Bazzle!
>

And swamps at nice, from 25 iirc. That's damn useful too especially when coupled with other orc skills like bloodletting. There is a big synergy between the orc skills. e.g. Bloodletting, bloodsteeping, hiding in swamps at night, forced march and bloody skins are all synergistic in the whole is greater than the some of the parts. Plagued and can't get to the swamp? Forcemarch. Blinded and robbed? Regurgitate a cure. Hurt from forced march? Bloody skins. Still got some plague time to wait out? Hide in swamp until can bloodlet again. etc etc etc.

>Headbutt: like shield bash, but injures you.
>

Not like shield bash. This is the skill that lets you handle communers, subject to size restrictions.. Shield bash is not that skills.

>Forcedmarch: life saver, but injures and slays con for 2 days
>

So what? Bloody skins fix injury and stat-coverage negates con loss. Also, if you don't forced march too often, the effect will not stack in terms of duration. Finally, orc toughness means you barely ever need it after a while, plus orc mountain movement.

>Grapple weapon: Never worked, injured me.
>

Yes, it injures you, but it is still a useful skill. You don't like it? Don't use it. Great for regearing, good because it can savage feed, great because you can have the weapon go into your inventory. Offhand grapple is fantastic too.

>War shout: It worked! But I saw no affect still had my ass
>handed to me.
>

Your warcry gives you +dam as well as save vs spell and bonus to hit. The amount varies with whether it was an elf. Also, I believe it either lags or strips morale effects (or both) sometimes.

>No shield block.
>

So. You have dodge (sort of), parry, and you have collosal hp and the best regen in the game. My last orc actually tanked for his group instead of an arial sword spec because he didn't ever need to stop for rest, unlike the sword spec who would after a while.

>Pin: Replaces Cheashot. WTF? Yeah, I'll trade two axes for
>that.
>

In my experience it does more than replace cheapshot.

>Wimp set, can't finish fights.
>
>

Umm, just lag yourself out and you won't flee. It's quite rare that wimpy makes you flee if you are trying to lag yourself out.

>
>

Orcs today are so much better than they used to be. I can't believe you have overlooked the usefulness of so many of their skills. I mean, bloodsteep is just amazing (unless you eat steaks from someone your blood went on before you killed them, in which case bloodletting is handy instead, and swamp hide, etc etc etc).

Who took the effort to explain.

Thanks for laying it down how it is while I lazily passed over it. What you said covers it all and had I played an orc recently would happily have rubbed it in.

You can only carry so many skins and can end up going through a ton of them in any given fight.

Crushing assault is a good skill, let's say was a good skill. With this Orcs, and I;ve had a lot, it did nothing. With others, and I;ve had a lot, it's done litte.

You can't forcemarch out of Plague if you are wounded or have already forced marched to the point of heart failure.

There is no Synergy as you put it in the skill sets you listed. If you meant that's what orcs do, then yeah, you're right, but they either kill you in the proccess or are so limited that accessing them is inmpossible. (Read Swamps at night)


Regurgitate = Lag and minor damage. If blind.. Does you no good.

Your elf skin bit is funny if only because there are better sources than Elf blood. But all are time consuming.

And as far as your group fighting bit on spine breaker, maybe, but the only time to use it is at the Very beginnig f they are weak, or at the very end if you can't escape.

Seriously, you are talking out of your ass. Orcs need something, but it is more a place in the endgame than anything you've imagined in your insane little head.

I whooped ass with my orcs.

It was just a pain in the fugging ass.

They are the hardest class I've ever had to play.

Better?

Of course I;m wrong as is evident y the huge numbers of orcs.

Oh wait... there are as many or more Minotaurs playing at any given time.

Your personal attacks against me don't make me wrong or you right.

P.S. Even if there is a 20 elf skin area, that isn't death to get too, that's news to me.

Obtainable at 20, 25 tops by a solo orc. Orcs lack players because they have little to no focus, or at least that's my opinion, and since I've played a lot of orcs, but am not playing one now because of that reason, it's certainly not insane. Are they the easiest class to play? No, probably not, but then neither are evil conjies, but I consider them extremely potent, and wouldn't argue that their servitors are useless to try a prove a point about how hard they are to play either.

Still doesn't change what an Orc is.

Evil conjies have changed and they have wands.

Then why say you didn't know of it?

It totally changes what an orc is. It makes him have as much healing as he ever needs. That's why an orc can tank for his groups, especially considering that tanking improved his defenses which in turn improved his tanking etc etc.

>You can only carry so many skins and can end up going through
>a ton of them in any given fight.
>

So, get yourself some skins that have about 20 uses per skin. I do.


>Crushing assault is a good skill, let's say was a good skill.
>With this Orcs, and I;ve had a lot, it did nothing. With
>others, and I;ve had a lot, it's done litte.
>

Umm, perhaps you just don't notice the difference it makes to enemies parrying. I consider it to be -extremely- obvious.


>You can't forcemarch out of Plague if you are wounded or have
>already forced marched to the point of heart failure.
>

You can drink blood so that the wound doesn't matter, and there is no reason with the modern orc that you should have forced marched yourself to such a state already. I seriously rarely need to even use it twice in a row these days, now that getting around in mountains is easier. I mean, it gives you about 150 moves back at hero per use.


>There is no Synergy as you put it in the skill sets you
>listed. If you meant that's what orcs do, then yeah, you're
>right, but they either kill you in the proccess or are so
>limited that accessing them is inmpossible. (Read Swamps at
>night)
>

wtf are you talking about? There are swamps all over the game, and as bloodletting only reduces the plague duration, for particularly bad ones you are probably going to want to be able to have a few hours in safety, and the hours of darkness will probably be some of them.

Sure, if you are stupid enough to forced march 4 times in a row so that you can't do it when you need it, then you deserve to die. Otherwise, the skills link in such a way that when used in combination, the orc has a great deal of utility for keeping himself alive.

>
>Regurgitate = Lag and minor damage. If blind.. Does you no
>good.
>

####. My orc, for example, has about 7 potions of cure blind swallowed.

>Your elf skin bit is funny if only because there are better
>sources than Elf blood. But all are time consuming.
>

Really? Then you have even less of a reason to complain. However, I believe you are, in fact, mistaken on this. The sources are not an elf corpse, but they are still elf blood.

>And as far as your group fighting bit on spine breaker, maybe,
>but the only time to use it is at the Very beginnig f they are
>weak, or at the very end if you can't escape.

I disagree. I would say that even a group that outmatches you somewhat is going to die if you land a spinebreak.

You've made one point that I agree with. That's the Cure blind.

Other than that, I've had no orc, nor have I met the orc that can't have his ass handed to them.

Case in point, I slew a 23rd rank orc with a 23rank healer in the village once. The porr bastard just couldn't escape or stay in the fight long enough to do me and my pet in.

They are descent, they have potential, but are excedingly unfun to play, over all, IMHO.

You failed an orc. You didn't play one.

Enjoy.

Yhorian.

Has there been a decent orc since Naguagga the Entropy orc?

If you set the standard as Naz being decent, then no. But then again, according to that standard each and every one of your chars sucked ass.