Hey,

I've recently started playing a poisoner thief (I'm just before rank 40), and I'm struggling a bit in the PK department and was hoping for a few tips. I'm from a mud that's very similar to CF mechanics-wise, they have a lot of the same skills like dirt kick, bash and trip, and the lag system works almost exactly in the same way. So although I'm a newbie to CF, I'm not a total newb to the basic way PK works.

I've been exploring a lot, and I've found a bunch of ingredients that occur naturally and not just in shops. I think I've found an ingredient that can make any type of poison by itself, barring mind-control. I've also done a bit of experimenting and can make more advanced level poisons by mixing a number of other ingredients.

My first question:

I know all poison ingredients have a level. Whether I use a level 5 ingredient or a level 30 ingredient, though, the final poison is always the same level as me. What does the level of the ingredient determine exactly? I've been told that it might control potency and length of the effects, where as my apply skill determines how often the poison actually lands. Anyone know if this is right? I've been failing a lot of applying lately, and because poisons all look pretty much the same, I don't know if I'm failing because of the ingredients I used, because of the mixture I used, because of my apply skill or just because of bad luck.

My second question:

On the mud I used to play, everyone used to try and rank up to the top level, because that's where they are strongest, so that's what I try to do. I've noticed here that often people make characters with the intention of staying at a certain rank for most of their life. I've been told that poisoners are niche PKers, does this mean they're not good at rank 51?

Any feedback would be appreciated.

Thanks,

-Q

I know all poison ingredients have a level. Whether I use a level 5 ingredient or a level 30 ingredient, though, the final poison is always the same level as me. What does the level of the ingredient determine exactly? I've been told that it might control potency and length of the effects, where as my apply skill determines how often the poison actually lands. Anyone know if this is right? I've been failing a lot of applying lately, and because poisons all look pretty much the same, I don't know if I'm failing because of the ingredients I used, because of the mixture I used, because of my apply skill or just because of bad luck.

Level of the ingredient doesn't directly affect the final concoction in any way that I'm aware of. However, higher level poison ingredients often are coded to last longer or have a higher chance of success.

Find some ingredients that you can get a lot of, and experiment with them. That'll help you isolate what they can produce, or why you're failing.

On the mud I used to play, everyone used to try and rank up to the top level, because that's where they are strongest, so that's what I try to do. I've noticed here that often people make characters with the intention of staying at a certain rank for most of their life. I've been told that poisoners are niche PKers, does this mean they're not good at rank 51?

On CF, different race / class combinations can be more effective against others at similiar levels. Thieves in general, because they don't get a lot of new toys at the higher levels, are usually lumped into the category of "Great At Mid-Rank PK".

I'd argue that people playing thieves to be bad-ass PKers aren't playing them correctly. That's like playing a healer to be a bad-ass PKer. Can you do it? Sure. Is it 500X harder than playing a warrior to be a bad-ass PKer? You betcha.

Thieves are...thieves. Sneaky bastards who skulk in the city shadows and use their skills to amass wealth and power. Once I viewed thieves in this light, rather than trying to figure out how to be a thief PK machine, it quadrupled the enjoyment I got out of them. YMMV, but I wish you luck in any case. Hope this helped!

Kastellyn the Devourer of Magic, Lord of Legends

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I too have never played a poisoner, but I do know they are regarded as one of the hardest/pains to play because of the exploration involved, which I actually think would make them fun. It's the concocting I don't get. It intimidates me because not only to you have to crawl all over thera looking for things, then you have to figure out how to combine them, but sounds like you've figured that out to a large extent.

Anyway, poisoners are rare, but the ones that figure it out are deadly. One of CF's deadliest characters ever was a poisoner, Yanicek, and succeeded largely by using mind control poisons and getting chars to quaff bad things. YOu can't make chars quaff anything anymore, but you can make them eat stuff. I don't know if you can make them remove items.

In short, few folks understand the class too well, and you're likely to get lots of misinfo.

As far as ranking - I think its more that players frequently get down a road with a character that doesn't pan out how they wanted, role wise or con-loss wise, and poof there they go and try another cool class. Not many players stick long at hero, either, compared to other muds, because its so fun trying other builds.

Anyway, with mind control, poisoners are potentially a lot more viable at high ranks than binders or thugs, but there is a big tradeoff in effort.

My thief experience extends only to city thieves and thugs, but thought I might chime in for Question #2.

Disclaimer: Granted, I have been around on this mud for quite a long time, I certainly am no spokesperson, and have made more than my share of mistakes, so take my "opinion" as you will.


Heroes, yes, are pretty much at their strongest, per se. You have your entire skill/sup/spell set, all the HP you are going to get, and for the most part, a 'Matured Character', so to speak. Some people level sit, yes, because they feel that is the strongest matchup they are ever going to have. Like this, let's say I roll up a duergar, spam all of my defenses and weapons to 100% but not rank past level 15... If I can do this, chances are I am going to have nice gear, and a fairly easy time PK'ing my range, for a while. I've done this some time ago, and it's really not what it's worth for the time you have to put in. Not to mention Distention. Imagine being level 15, getting PK after PK after PK, then (It doesnt happen like a finger snap but) all of a sudden characters 20-30 are in your PK range, and your level sitting PKspamming ass is about to get Owned.

Maybe an assassin who hits 35 stops ranking, because he just wants to spam assassinate. The older he gets, the older his PK range gets.
Get the idea?

At his strongest? Hell no, but possible for that type of mindset, this is the easiest things might be for him.

Albeit the game, the character, the RP, start at lvl 1, when you get to Hero it is a very different game. You don't necessarily see people die in a couple rounds (some exceptions) you have more access to tougher areas, gear, preps (Many preps like wands, you have to be a certain level just to use) and basically just have a lot more room to play, and play with more seasoned players.

I generally do pretty well in the PK game, 11-35, but once I get into the Hero ranges with the big dogs, I really have put effort into my strategies more so than before, because there is just a lot more room for things to happen.

>I've noticed here that often people make characters with the >intention of staying at a certain rank for most of their life. I've >been told that poisoners are niche PKers, does this mean they're >not good at rank 51?

Piece of advice, learn things for yourself. OOC friends will #### you over and over, or give you misinfo unknowingly that you might trust, or gossip your characters, so forth and so on. EVERYONE has great strengths, and great weaknesses, it's just a matter of what you personally think stand out and how you exploit or overcome them.

Welcome to the MUD also, I have been playing myself in the window of 10 years, and still think I am a total newbie and have only played possible half of the possibilities out there and still, manage to smoke this MUD crack for the most part, the majority of my free time.

Good luck!