Fri Mar 27 11:54:22 2009

At 10 o'clock AM, Day of the Bull, 8th of the Month of the Ancient Darkness
on the Theran calendar Katula perished, never to return.

Race:	human
Class:	conjurer
Level:	48
Alignment:	Evil
Ethos:	Chaotic
Cabal:	None, None
Age:	41
Hours:	156

Sure wished you had died to that backstab. It wasn't that I was worried about you being a Scion, you just appeared to be an easy target. The threats were perfectly incharacter and enjoyable. I look forward to future characters.

This usually happens when I play, somewhere around the 150-250 hour mark I get bored.

I also had a 14 con left when I deleted with maybe two trains coming *if* I could make hero, which wasn't happening because anytime I logged in and didn't play till 5 in the morning it was Ragers or goodies and zero capable tanks to get me to 51. And the pendulum is only going to keep swinging more towards them.

Goodbyes:

Ghriz, my husband. I was hoping you'd play more like Alzinghul since it's a necessity for an orc to survive and dominate at hero range, but it wasn't to be. Didn't get any imm XP for joining your harem either but the idea and RP was fun. You should get a transmuter in your harem, even if I rivalled a mamlauk in damage and way exceeded what a muter could put out.

Igleshta, serial killer. Seems like you had the same problem as me and got stuck in the 35-45 range. I really wish you could have hit 48 faster and gotten the two legacies you were planning but goshdarnit your playtimes suck ass more than mine. If you want to accomplish things in CF like ranking or exploring more popular areas like Veran you really need to play off-hours.

Flimbert, I really really was tempted to join Scion. But, I didn't like the advisor, and since the current Chancellor is a deadbeat dad I was only going to change my mind if they stripped Khratetch and gave you Chancellor. Also to be clear: You really didn't want me to join. Even if you helped me find my sleeks (I was missing sienna and black at the time I deleted and had checked at least four or five barrier locations I knew of and avoided the ridiculously tough ones) I had a 15 con when you asked me to join the cool kids club. You would have been irritated at many of the dumb mistakes I was making because the conjurer class is new to me. You already taught me the important difference between challegha demons and devils that I wasn't catching on to, but much of my wand knowledge was patchwork knowledge from limited sources the better of which were fast being depeleted by other goodie mages, particularly conjurers, levelling up and then becoming gear whores.

Daakonos, you know way more than me about mages and clued me in to 34+ locations ICly. I didn't check them all but I want you to know I wholly appreciate it and it encourages me to try mages a little more even if I'm with the DC poll on Dios that says A/B/S as a system does, and always has, blown ass. I really wish I didn't figure out that Challegha demons randomly own shapeshifters of all aligns not part of my group with you right after a reboot.

Anglarctana: Dude. No one sane is going to leave a dwarf with Derns. I meant to give the #### to Igleshta, and eventually did after Grawshen nabbed the gauntlets. But that gear is arguably some of the best pieces in the game bar none and your requirement is a nasty wrath or drowning vuln to use it. I'm not leaving you with things that will give you a 50+ damroll after you wear your gear. That being said, I didn't full loot you and was kind enough to clue you in to the prime solo ranking area for mages from levels 15-30. Information you can make use of for future rager applicants (though most mages will spank you in that area) or for mages. A big part of why Grawshen was as successful as he was despite the player, was because people were leaving him Derns.

Kasir: I was wondering what the 'sweet lightforged scrolls' that the imms put in the game was, now I know. It's a bit retarded that you can apply a silver vuln to anyone you want and then have progging silver gear on top of 3rd attack to milk extra damage. I would ask what the hell the imms were thinking, but this is par for the course for them to balance goodies this way and then call it balanced. You were deadly enough without getting free silver malison. Also, I was pretty close to figuring out how you were surviving the gaunts and then just going to that location and owning you, but other more important targets started popping up at the same time as you. (Rorg, Mrrowler, Moopsie, various Outlanders etc.) Also, I didn't take familiar edges because I was saving for the Planar Abduction edge but I didn't notice anyone getting brought to me any faster. I was hoping they'd disarm and then 2 round some people as warrior gaunts since they could already cheap shot but it wasn't happening or you would have been brought to me long ago, I already know thieves can't tank.

Valdora: Cherrypick less. You're a Nightreaver. Act like it and go balls deep like I did on occasion.

Ignacio: Sorry about the devil rotting you. I didn't know it could do that, and I didn't know Malthalia would be a royal bitch and not collect CON gear for you even when I told her to. At an 18 max con you weren't surviving that. Here's a hint: 2x Trail ranger bracers in frozen wastelands, Aldevari balls and sash, 2x amulets from elf in goblin encampment, a leather jerkin from the crypt under arkham, and 2x pitch-black rings from Udgaard, regardless of quality. With hero MV's those are all reasonable to obtain except maybe the bracers, and they will go a long way toward saving you from rot when a shaman heroes.

Mrrowler: Maybe you'll know how it feels, bitch. I'd have killed you more but gave up gaunting you when I realized you started getting attached to your buddy Moopsie at the hip, or Adelin whenever I was around, or just plain logged off so I wouldn't totally rape you. Frankly the legacies you picked wouldn't have let you survive a straight up fight with me, ever, and I had reasons to do what I did to you besides that log and me finding out who your player was. Protip: don't pick a ####ty name just to annoy the people you gank because you know the imms won't do anything about it. Someone who is in fact in a position to do something about it probably will, even solo. Say an evil chaotic conjurer throwaway. Next time you don't see an archon, try 'where devil' instead and you might not die running like a noob on foot to the Fort. Or stick to your air/off shifters and conservative Outtie bards. If you were still Ceyraia I'd still have killed you, that's how awesome evil conjie is, I just need to learn to play it better.

Bard Repertoire Clarifications:
http://forums.carrionfields.com/dc/dcboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=6&topic_id=23735&mesg_id=23735&page=

Evil conjurers are more versatile than good conjurers but do not get to take advantage of the defilement or wrath attacks unless they go through trying to bind and please a finicky angel as shown in Kanaev's log. Demons have physical attacks but it's not clear to me why, at least some of the demons should have defilement attacks, or devils forced into melee. Maybe an edge idea (since having defilement attacks would only make you less dangerous to liches).

Conjurers take alot of time to play. You basically cannot play a conjurer if you are logging in three hours a week. Necromancers think they get to have something to bitch about their piddly 24 hour failure timer on raise dead, they've never gotten a servitor killed right after conjuration or had to kill/dismiss the thing.

Conjurers still cannot regear until they unghost. Outfit gear for them gives no +chr and it probably should, though they can probably obtain a few pieces as a ghost they can't obtain any real +HP gear other than desert cloaks.

Familiar edges are a must if you plan to tank for a ranking group as an evil conjurer. You need both the ward against damage and the extra HP since familiars do not dodge or parry.

Yes EXB, quasit is the equivalent to shadowcat but shadowcat has pass door while quasit has the getting items thing. Also there's not nearly as many a/b/s items available for your quasit to run up and get as you implied, usually there's a locked door in the way with a key the familiar can't obtain on it's own. Quasit has climb and covert though, which is neat since it can open doors. Familiars who detect hidden ignore sneak when using where, which is handy for finding sneaking mobs.

A/B/S is still gay as hell. I'd have played this character to con death if I could find my sleek black. However, an orderly evil or orderly good conjurer does not need sleeks to compete at hero range. They just need a tiny bit of extra miscellaneous damage reduction, perhaps a shield talisman or wand. Sure their damage output will be anywhere from 50% to 75% of a conjurer using demons but if they consistently conjure barbed devils or lesser ice devils or transplendant archons the extras will sometimes more than make up for it.

Since servitors are mobs with crappy HP all their stuff is calculated as such. If you're a big beefy rager or paladin averaging MANGLES in melee, attacking the devil or demon directly is worthwhile. It's not like a druid where their treant dies and they go 'lol, k' and get a new one for free. Servitors, like any other mobs:

Ignore spellbane
Calculate their melee by comparing their level to their opponent (which makes mowing down lower level folks easier and more preferable to using an invoker with improved invis, a perk for nightgaunts to get stacked people with shiny gear who can't tank, including high damage builds)

Demons are immune to defilement but devils are not. WTF?

If you screw up binding a servitor twice, you may as well get rid of it using commands to spam elem, or force a devil/demon to tank. Especially if it's angry, it will inevitably end up attacking you. If it's an angry devil, just kill things, especially lightwalkers, and don't flee. This is easier said than done in some cases without full dam redux, and you tank worse than an AP.

Poorly geared characters will generally get spanked if a conjurer even sneezes at them. Demons are designed to end fights in 4 rounds or less and nightgaunts help to that end. If your fight does not end in 4 rounds or less, you did something horribly wrong and screwed up majorly.

To the imm who gave Oztak imm XP for killing me:

This is part of what's killing CF, giving people imm XP for frustrating other people. I spent alot of time and lost alot of con at 27 trying to PK where there basically is no dam redux available. The demon didn't do #### in that fight, if it had even assisted for 2 rounds he would have been dead, and I'd fed it a ton of corpses prior so there was no reason at all for it to be irritated enough not to autoassist. Thanks for giving him 2k XP for getting a relatively minor rant, jerkass. I found out about it over AIM, and I agree with him what I said and decided to do was lame, but if you were new to the class the first thing you'd be assuming wasn't that you did something wrong there. My flee also failed because of the guildguard or I'd have gotten out at the last second. The only reason I was in front of the guild was I was trying to get rid of them because they were about to disappear and the demon refused to turn happy no matter how much it ate.

Also if I didn't say it enough before A/B/S still blows, and I didn't bother heroing not only because PK ranges made it an inordinately high amount of work, but I was also reading threads about how detect artifact blows when the veil fluctuates or gets thick, meaning you'd have to re-explore areas several times. My HP never averaged more than 700 despite all my efforts to get and keep better gear.

Bard Repertoire Clarifications:
http://forums.carrionfields.com/dc/dcboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=6&topic_id=23735&mesg_id=23735&page=

Shadowcat vs quasit.. I'll take quasit over shadowcat 7 days a week and date your brother. Now, I've had the quasit before and I loved it... the only contrary opinion is going to be based on playing style. Since I always like to keep the familiar with me for tactical pk and pve reasons I would rarely use the shadowcat to go out scouting. I would treat the quasit the same, plus have the extra mana regen for it.

Now if I had the shadowcat running a muck without being anywhere near... sure... pass door is nice since you can't stand there and open it for the familiar, but hell... even some familiar's will auto-open a door if you try to walk into it.

I still reserve my opinion that neutral conjurers should get the nifty familiars if anything since they get raped when it comes to dealing with angels/demons and archons/devils. (Wish neuts could call special elementals that could cast invoker path related spells....)

I feel I should probably respond here, just to clear up some stuff.

a. Those scrolls aren't lightforged. There are indeed some nice forged scrolls, but as far as I can tell all of them do damage and would wake a slept target. Plus what you get is random, and the forge plus lore costs about 90 mana a pop. Given I have about 500 total, and mediocre regen, it's hard to keep the right scroll on hand for any situation.

b. The scrolls I used on you tend to fail pretty often on heros with any save vs. spell. And they're not cheap. At the time of that log you posted, you were lower 40s and didn't seem to be wearing any saves gear.

c. I'm a binder so no third attack.

d. I only used the spooky anti-gaunt method one time. Given what you said to me right after that, and what you wrote in this thread, I kind of suspect you're heading down the wrong trail. I'll say this though- if I'd been forced to use that method more often, sooner or later it would have gotten me killed. If you'd hit 51 and taken gaunt edges then I would have to have used it every time unless I was with a group.

e. Doing your conjuring about four rooms away from a good-aligned god's shrine? Probably not the best idea. I wasn't even looking for you that time.

e. Doing your conjuring about four rooms away from a good-aligned god's shrine? Probably not the best idea. I wasn't even looking for you that time.

But given how conservative I can be, doing stupid little things like this is how I accumulate the bulk of my deaths.

But I don't really have any resentment for you. Trying to scheme ways to get you was fun but I probably would have actually managed it if I bothered to spam up clairvoyance, which is very VERY dangerous for an evil conjurer even with a devil, resi mental and resi negative. And there weren't enough bards in range for me to bother with resi mental.

You were fun to fight, but like all thieves, very frustrating. Conversely if I were a better player I could easily have had a higher killcount at almost any level past 27.

Plus, you need to hit 47 to take gaunt edges, not 51. (Student of vice, Planar Abduction) It's just that when I did have those edges you tended to survive anyway, which I generally chalked up to having Adelin gate to you or something, though you don't find many goodie healers that competent or quick on the ball.

I'll be buying the PBF for this char but not because I thought I did any good.

Bard Repertoire Clarifications:
http://forums.carrionfields.com/dc/dcboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=6&topic_id=23735&mesg_id=23735&page=

Good vs. evil servitors do not outpace one another in damage. It all depends on how happy they are.

A happy challegha demon can spam multiple vitriolic streams in one round, with no spell lag, AND acid blast. Since it has mob HP (even if just crappy mob HP) it does quite a bit of damage with acid blast and acid is a difficult damage type to resist.

That's just a singular example. Morosa demons lag more reliably than angels and they can earthbind. They also blind and do some other minor maladicts.

Challegha demons spam acid blast and disarm. From what I saw, they don't bash anymore.

Mors-gravis demons bash and mental knife and do entropy muddle. They also like beating on goodie mobs. So mors-gravis demons are prime and rival devils to beat up on giant chars (devils just have a wider variety of more useful maladicts and protect you)

The usefulness of a servitor depends wholly on how happy they are, this depends every tick on your current CHR and what you've done to satisfy it. Goodie servitors are just easier to satisfy (for either an angel or an archon you just nuke evil mobs and don't kill neutrals or goods)

Just because an angel can pillar for annihilates at level 27 means nothing. I can make a challegha demon that can do 2 oblits and a demo in a single round at 27. The only real difference is the wrath damage type and rescue.

Plus I do not generally have to worry about demons attacking groupmates on accident except in a very few specific situations (harmentia fireball, devils always use controlled fireball and all devil supps hit groups. Yes, they use supps.) Angels will own all goodies in range regardless of being in the group or not with pillar outdoors.

Angels and archons are just flat more reliable. Conversely evil servitors are more versatile because of their variety. Harmentia demons swing like they are hasted and can generally do more damage in melee than any other demon type barring a pissed off devil who got attacked directly.

Also it's possible to haste servitors. This turns already frightening hooded servitors into practically gods, especially demons/angels.



Bard Repertoire Clarifications:
http://forums.carrionfields.com/dc/dcboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=6&topic_id=23735&mesg_id=23735&page=

Either that or you're trolling. Either way, the 'You're wrong' statement is false. I stated an opinion that angels were better than demons. What you wrote was a mini essay on how demons can outdamage angels.

As you can see, the arguments don't align. You pretty much wasted a post.

In the end, evil conjies have more punch but lose too much defense to be viable at hero without scion powers or a great deal of patience. A goodie conjie has a helluva lot of power in an archangel, and gains a lot of longevity from the fact it cannot be targetted and killed (aura+mad regen) and will do 'rescue all' on you - which even prevents ganking. The loss of damage potential doesn't hurt that much when you can still two-round a battlerager when it's hasted. Your acid blast annihilates are overkill when you're that prepped. Except you won't be that prepped, because you don't have an archon with which to gather them :)

Argue all you like, but unless I was going scion, I'd choose a Maran/Acolyte/Tribunal goodie conjie anyday. And will certainly kick your non-scion evil conjies ass with it, sorry.

Yhorian

>
>In the end, evil conjies have more punch but lose too much
>defense to be viable at hero without scion powers or a great
>deal of patience.

You don't need despoil, you just need to have found your rods. It's more a focus on how the game changes for the aligns and how big a glaring mess A/B/S is, overpowered in some situations but a complete mess to even find and use to begin with in others based on RNG now, detect artifact or no.

A goodie conjie has a helluva lot of power
>in an archangel, and gains a lot of longevity from the fact it
>cannot be targetted and killed (aura+mad regen) and will do
>'rescue all' on you - which even prevents ganking.

If you're a high damage build, you can target and kill the angel.

A RBW can do it with the right spec using DB.

An imperial warrior with a damage spec can pull it off.

A ranger with wild-fam and a good gear set can pull this off.

Imperial bards are in a decent position to handle the conjurer and his servitors all at once.

Invokers can pull this off.

Many classes can ignore that the angel even exists, thieves, assassins and rangers and invokers come to mind.

It's not something you can do willy-nilly. It's something you have to consciously plan to do and then use a nasty opener on it. Servitor mobs have less HP than other mobs of the same level. Aura and regen doesn't change that. Plus devils have barrier, they aren't unprotected like demons, so they are just as hard to kill as archons and nastier in melee.

The loss of
>damage potential doesn't hurt that much when you can still
>two-round a battlerager when it's hasted.

Depends entirely on the battlerager you're fighting. If the poor bastard went cloud giant or duergar, certainly. An arial assassin, probably. Human or elf/drow anything, not so much. Svirfs are variable on whether you have earth or air elemental at the moment.

Your acid blast
>annihilates are overkill when you're that prepped. Except you
>won't be that prepped, because you don't have an archon with
>which to gather them :)

You forget that the evil conjurer can use nightgaunts (which warrants skipping barrier entirely) and can probably find the target within the duration of all those preps.

Nightgaunts are a huge reason evil conjurers are more versatile than good ones. All the evil guy has to do is scry until you're in the middle of conjuring and then send the gaunt. Chances are you don't have the mana to dismiss it in time (or I've anchored/hasted it if I'm especially pissed off instead of idly seeing if I can kill you), and that's how my non-scion conjurer can ace you without ever having to go toe to toe.

Nightgaunts are weaker for good-aligned conjurers. They are unbelieveably powerful for evil ones but have the same crap HP that all other servitors have.

>
>Argue all you like, but unless I was going scion, I'd choose a
>Maran/Acolyte/Tribunal goodie conjie anyday. And will
>certainly kick your non-scion evil conjies ass with it,
>sorry.

Evil conjurers have to conjure depending on the foe they're fighting. Mors-gravis demons eat communers, and by extension probably your angel/archon, alive in melee in ways that other classes cannot. If you choose to use a devil you've essentially chosen to become a shaman that's actually bar-none more powerful than a real PC shaman if you did your conjuration right and killed enough mobs before moving.

None of the above scenarios even take into account what familiar and familiar edges each conjurer has. If a warded/warrior quasit is tanking your angel, I promise it gives me enough time to kill it even using a devil because that's what you'll have bet your anchor on. Whereas I'll have either bet the farm on the elemental or demon/devil just to throw you off because you only get one good shot to dismiss, you have to know what you're going to dismiss before you even try vs. another conjurer. I can in all likelihood dismiss your elemental 70% of the time because you need that angel, period. I can probably afford to lose the devil or demon if I'm confident enough to go into this hypothetical toe to toe fight (and devils are as nasty as angels in melee, they just don't have spells. Don't fail to dismiss one.)

Not everything in the game has to be fought toe to toe, or even against one another to compare. I can set up situations that you can't even think about where not only my self-preservation doesn't matter, but yours doesn't either.

>
>Yhorian


Bard Repertoire Clarifications:
http://forums.carrionfields.com/dc/dcboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=6&topic_id=23735&mesg_id=23735&page=

Bard Repertoire Clarifications:
http://forums.carrionfields.com/dc/dcboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=6&topic_id=23735&mesg_id=23735&page=

Actually I approached you at first because I thought, I always have 10 enemies and someone with gaunt could help me thin the herd on re-raids. So I started to nudge you in the direction of scion. Then I realized you really didn't know what you were doing. After that I just started to wait for you to have something worthwhile for me to kill you for, isn't evil fun?

That being said, conjurer is one of those classes you can, just like a berserker with deathblow, accidentally get lucky and kill someone.

You wouldn't have been happy if I had an excuse to toss a gaunt during a raid on the Chasm for instance.

All that being said I wouldn't have minded getting to know your character better. You seemed cool but ICly mentally we were going in two entirely different directions due to ethos. I pointedly asked you why I should waste my CON on joining Scion and you didn't really have a good answer.

I already knew about portal and despoil, but I value my mobility more highly than some folks value their cabal powers.

Bard Repertoire Clarifications:
http://forums.carrionfields.com/dc/dcboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=6&topic_id=23735&mesg_id=23735&page=

I was hoping you'd play more like Alzinghul since it's a necessity for an orc to survive and dominate at hero range, but it wasn't to be.

Translation: Gank more shamelessly unless you're 100% sure you can win. Even doing that Alz lost his fair share of con. Bok didn't need to gank but was usually asked nicely to do so on people who were her enemies to begin with.

This tended to contribute to some of the dangerous situations Ghriz got into.

Ghriz started to see things my way once we got Malnch, but I didn't know he was a Rager for one, and frequently the people I tried to grab later on both solo and with Ghriz or a lagging shifter standing there were either underwater or on another continent entirely.

On an unrelated note I really should have perfected scrying, it would have made my gaunting so much more effective in a roundabout way and scored me many more kills. I was just too lazy to gather an arm load of resi mental and the silver tome and sit someplace near goodie mobs to farm for devils to spam it.

Orcs tend to be meat solo because of their wrath vuln or they'd score more kills at hero against more high-damage builds. Likewise, shifters tear orcs apart because orcs can't tank and shifters have access to dam redux. When the spinebreaker fails, the shifter wins.

Finally like other threads have stated, being an orc is relatively pointless if you're not chieftan. I had no reason to pay attention to Ghriz until he started really badgering me near hero, and then he started to grow on me. Prior to that my plan was to watch what kind of havoc Igleshta would wreak solo at hero, or with me. With the right legacies no one I gaunted was going to survive both me and Igleshta, particularly tougher characters. Ghriz was much less useful for that, and I wasn't convienient to haul around due to my downtime. It got so bad that Vermillion and Kasir had an airform scouting for us one day, or maybe it was a conjurer scrying. We could have fought back against both but I didn't have time to finish conjuring. That only happened once but it was setting up to happen repeatedly anytime all the evil Ragers, Imperials and Scions logged off.

Bard Repertoire Clarifications:
http://forums.carrionfields.com/dc/dcboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=6&topic_id=23735&mesg_id=23735&page=

nt

nt

If your only suggestion to me is to play more like you then im quite content with how things are. Second, we only came into contact once when i was engaged with that elf bard. Third of all, you have no idea how I play. Sometimes I do go all out against rediculous odds, but the difference with me is there is always a chance of me killing someone when I do. If I have no chance of killing someone then under no cercumstances will I fight. Suicide is not fun for me or Valdora. However, I appreciate you waking me with your familiar when I was slept by the bard. I certainly didn't see that comming. GLWYN.