Mon Nov 10 17:58:17 2008

At 7 o'clock PM, Day of Freedom, 25th of the Month of the Ancient Darkness
on the Theran calendar Grig perished, never to return.

Race:	gnome
Class:	invoker
Level:	45
Alignment:	Neutral
Ethos:	Chaotic
Cabal:	OUTLANDER, the Outlanders of Thar-Eris
Age:	240
Hours:	181

Never got to interact, but it is funny to not that instead of a generic who, I could just type whois Gr for a while to know which outlanders were on. Grylinnis, Greh, Gravan, Grig. Thought you would get a chuckle out of that.

I liked Grig in some sort of masochist I like punishment way ;)


Only thing that got on my nerves was the constant notes and constant babble over CB... but I would just ignore it... it seemed to fit your role good enough...

now only if I would have ignored you being stuck by the skeletons ;)

never expected a vampire bat to come at me so damn hurt...

oh yeah.. plus too many people thought we were the same given the name and the class... anways good luck with your next...

Grig (pro),

I'm going to respond here and say my piece about you as I won't post on dio's because you can't be anonymous there anymore. I liked Grig from the first moment we started speaking. I thought you had a funny, quirky RP going and I thought it was alright. Now...that said, it was also very annoying and rubbed many the wrong way. I admit that I should have kicked Demari sooner, but I also feel for him with the mixed messages. (yes, I know they weren't mixed in a sense, but still, a visible Imm, even one RPing carries weight and many people will just take their word as gospel.) Heck, I feel for myself in this one, but I didn't actually "do" the actions. Anyway, I hope you make something and come back. I'm not sure why you gave up on Grig, but I thought you had something neat going.

Good luck,
Harli

Gravan really tried to like you, for a long time. But your constant notes and chatter rubbed him the wrong way (he's a little more on the serious side), along with your unwillingness to forgive and your tendency to bungle our best-laid traps. The warning at the end wasn't an attempt to get Grig to follow orders. It was really just a warning. But you "rebelled" anyway... and if you annoy a growling dog, you shouldn't be surprised when it bites.

As a player I respected what you were going for and mostly was happy when I saw you online. I'd have sworn you were a major newbie, though.

Don't kill creatures of nature for sport. I think you were the only one who had read that. The only people who seemed to side with you from the get go were the guys from the Sunwarden side. But, it made for interesting politics in the cabal, so I let it go to see how it would play out. When common sense didn't take over quickly, I decided, as Lyristeon, to make it worse. Every one was jumping on Grig as a pain in the ass and instead of going to the bark to clear it up, which nobody did, I decided to fan the flames. You were the only person who was right. In that, you deserve an attaboy. Aside from that, you were a pain in the ass. Heh. I am all for characters doing things that shake things up. In that I liked Grig. He just took the brunt of everything and just kept going on his merry way. Eventually, a "weeping ancient" had a chat with the Harbinger to set things straight. But, you caused a bunch of chaos in a cabal that is meant to be chaotic and for quite a few of them, you had them question rule number 1. Yes, I do allow for interpretation of that first rule to a point. Obviously an evil shaman is going to be given more leeway than a wood-elf druid or an elven ranger.

This is probably still playing out in some way, so I won't speak more of it now.

GLWYN.

Harlidbiggle definitely got confused by Lyristeon in this whoel thing as well. Grig was right on this, and I applauded his belief, but he was also very annoying. As a character I wouldn't have harmed things in Emerald to learn, and also refrained from elves in the past because some of them are attuned with nature. Lyr definitely got me thinking that maybe I was wrong about that and It wasn't until later and more thinking that I realized he was creating what he, as an RPing immortal, creates. I had hopes for Grig though, but apparently it just wasn't working out for you. I hope the character posts here as I'm wondering what the deal behind him was.

if you check dioxides character posts, he has left some very interesting messages that explains and #####s more in his angry little way, his feelings and reasons.

I tried to let the first time you attack me go... Then the second I warned you what would happen so I had 0 feelings of remorse for killing you. I understand you were passionate about the fae, thats cool. But I tried to put it behind me, continue with the character. You rp'd hating me, but it seemed to spill over to ooc. This character is chaotic, and tries to get a rise out of almost everyone they come across. It just so happens that some people is easier then others, and I hope you did not take any of it to heart. And as far as the confusion that came from the fae was that lysterone said that he did not care if you hunted in the fae, and the harbinger said that you should follow your own path. That is what I did, as I have seen others of the harbingers path hunt there. Its not that hard to imagine the confusion. I was just trying to get on with this char's life and you were making that difficult. Which did not bother me really to much.
Anyways, good luck with your next char, and I am sure that if you learn the location of wands you will do much better next time around

>lysterone said that he did not
>care if you hunted in the fae,

Don't forget that Lyristeon is RPing, too.

What he says is okay isn't necessarily okay by Outlander dogma or the Ancients. It's just okay according to a chaotic evil and very capricious god.

Along similar lines, Daevryn has encouraged some of his Nexus followers to do things that aren't totally Nexus kosher, but are appropriate to his own RP.

Had I been a Harbinger, I would have uninducted you. As Nightreaver, I nearly did, but it would be against outlander politics, or at least I didn't want to waste me one get out of jail card.

I felt like you were trying to impose your own beliefs onto the
cabal, and that doesnt work anymore than invokers do in Battle.
We outlanders are all free to our own ways, and you had other apps constantly asking me whats wrong with hunting in the emerald woods, etc. As an outlander, you should be showing/teaching more of the cabal as per the creed, not confusing applicants about it.

If your character was that protective of that Area, then you should have moved in that direction, not outlander. Had I not had the issues I was having, I would have continued to pursue encouraging my reavers to hunt you, as well I had every intention to after my note went out to the cabal.

Funny how you always rub my characters the wrong way like that.

Good luck on your next at least

There's some drama here that I think it still playing out IC.

That being said, I don't really agree with the way Grig went about it, but beliefwise I don't think he was exactly wrong as far as Outlander dogma goes. Specifically, I think he was closer to right than you.

It's not a black and white thing -- Outlander is a chaotic-leaning cabal, after all -- but mass murdering something that you're more or less supposed to protect for what amounts to sport becomes hard to justify.

As an Evil outlander per se, I feel as far as Outlander dogma goes, it is your right as a free creature to hunt the weak, and your "part" to cull the weak from the lands, so only the strong creatures survive and create a stronger Thar-Eris.

To evil outlander, protecting those too weak to protect themselves, begging other hunters not to fullfil their desires, and sheltering the animals from become weapons, food, clothes, is not outlander dogma.


When Armies of empire and groups of tribunal lawmen go around imposing their will, that's a lot different than one or two outtie types simply fighting with the locals. This is the difference here, and wher my outties have no problem fighting wild mobs. Granted, there is a request feature, even for evils, but comon, how rp-based is it for one evil creature that culls the weak and proves his strength to ask another creature nicely and then observe the good hes seen in the world. Pssh.

Gimmie that axe punk! Bwaap! My axe! That's outlander. If Grig just straight up attacked and killed people for fighting his covetted creatures, rather than construing outlander ideology, I would not have taken IC steps to encourage him being hunted by the cabal.

In outlander, you make your own way, not cry wolf about someone elses.

I've been Nightreaver a couple times, too. :)

I'm just saying, if I was a harbinger at the time, I would likely have uninducted him, and was borderline as Nightreaver. The only reason I didn't, is because there was a Harbinger, just not as active in my play times.

This was specifically directed towards his countless notes to the
cabal identifying (vaguely) that these people are enemies. To me, this was an imposing view that was not exactly in line with outlander ideology, concerning the way he went about doing it.

You're not protecting natural creatures, Outlander isn't neo-sylvan. Your protecting natural creatures rights, you're fixing a problem, your exterminating a plague, it is a living reaction (Outlander) to the in-game atrocities that have gone too far, and a collective force, each unique, but working to a common goal, objectively.

I think we both agree, but I feel like your trying to say something else without actually saying it. I will say that I personally never interacted with him face to face that I can at least remember, for whatever that might be worth.

> You're not protecting natural creatures, Outlander isn't
>neo-sylvan.

While that's true, reading this post I feel like you haven't read the commandments posted at the Spirit.

Okay I have to ask. Were you a complete newbie or just really well rped? There was a lot of times when I thought I was the only person that ever leveled you.