Thu Jun 21 17:52:07 2007

At 4 o'clock PM, Day of Deception, 2nd of the Month of the Grand Struggle
on the Theran calendar Ghrovash perished, never to return.

Race:	fire
Class:	anti-paladin
Level:	47
Alignment:	Evil
Ethos:	Chaotic
Cabal:	SCION, the Scions of Eternal Night
Age:	237
Hours:	186

Best unholy weapon +31 Hit, +31 Dam, +267340 HP, +267340 mana

Awww yeah ;)

(I know it's broken, think my best weapon was 72 charges....just thought it was funny - probably has to do with me leeching a 0 charge weapon)

Or did you not know it was 0 charges until you'd leached it?

+skill chance, I knew it was 0

I do not know why I left all your gear. I waited a few days for my opportunity at vengeance after you sniped my crap when I died to STSF guy #15, and then I had it, and for some reason I felt bad for you. I think also I was impressed that you actually went and ranked into hero range. I absolutely did not see heroing in the cards for this AP. Good job.

Otherwise, I guess I vehemently disagree with most of what you wrote. You wielded the wrong weapon against an assassin, and the wrong damage type. You didn't do anything of the right moves. And when you lost, you go ahead and blame game balance. If we're talking about game balance re: assassinate, I'm on board - assassinate is OP. If we're talking 1v1 assassin v AP, I'm not on board. I think you could do alot better than you did. On one hand it's water under the bridge, on the other hand, I know you'll have another character in a few days so hopefully you can realize the above and learn from it. I would post the log and spell it out for you but you seem to want to argue with everyone that has a different opinion so I'll just leave it at that.

And, as a final note, this character was MUCH improved over Moshacan.

Do I ever complain about things being overpowerd? No.

I took a periapt dude, chill out. If you knew what life was like without periapts, you'd know why I took it. And I'm completely in agreement about STSF but that's another converstion.

I don't disagree with everyone, just people who really have no business discussing tactics. I respected Ktaar, although taking a 0 soul wooden earthquake axe does kind of suck....the chances I got another one of those was pretty much zero, but I expected it I guess somehow. In our fights, I had a polearm or an axe or a mace. Polearm was horrible (check out Feiania log), axe was horrible (check Raszik log) and I could never seem to land crippling strike on you with my mace of despair. I still think that 1on1 with a/b/s/lust, I should hit more against an assassin with weapons they don't know but guess that's the way the cookie crumbles. I know I should have maledicted you somehow, but -strength seemed to do nothing against you and landing CP was hard as I said as a giant - it's not even that much -dex. Bashing never seemed to work againast an assassin even with max weight, so what do you think I should have done?

And I didn't really have that much a gripe against you specifically...least I had a chance against you. It's the area-dodging villagers that drove me nuts.

I am deleting too, wish there was someone left to clean up the druids.

Well, masochistic me decides to try one final Anti-Paladin before I give up on the class - so I pick a Macho flawed Fire AP that's going to go Champion of Man. Sounds fun right?

Well a few things have erked me to the point that I don't know if I'm going to come back:

1)The sleek system. I finally figured out my sleek black on my 4th AP and low and behold it's one of the hardest freaking mobs ever so the only way I can get it is to blow through speckled pills like a madman and he does all necromancer spells, and I can't use healers. So without periapts (which require mana and not using a 2-handed unholy, and they're usually on the near-unkillable heroes), massive pills (which cost lots of coin in a game that never reboots so commerce/dragon killing is a PITA), crazy souls (when I had 72, I still lost 900+ hp each time), or help (Scion, yeah right) I'm pretty much screwed. And I'm fighting other casters who get to *walk* to their barrier and pick it up or invokers who blast the crap out of it with unspeaks. Make it even - I could care less if my amber/sienna is on "tough" mobs but if my barrier is pretty much impossible solo something isn't right. I pity the shifter who gets that sleek.

2) The hero range - it's pretty much required to massively prep and have barrier to compete these days and I decided to rank into it without an ice control because I was getting bored of killing non-skilled people. You've got the druids who usually just run (whoever coded primordial vengeance to randomly make you empty your bags needs to be shot), tribunal (BOOORING - so many cops with a small population is horrible), Fortress (don't get me started on how mind-boggling boring it is to fight them with cloaks of displacement and tattoo powers that save them), Imperial gang squad (who dropped to a new low with killing me mindless and the lose of my 72 charge weapon), and Villagers (which require barrier to not get beat by deathblows). Most of the time I logged in, I sat back and realized I'd either be killing the same newbies over and over (like non-caballed people) or I'd need barrier to have a chance from a mob that can be going so great then plague+poison+e-drain in 3 rounds and I'm going to die...not to mention wasting a good portion of time gathering. The AP class requires a lot of targets to get controls, and with the playerbase dwindling away it's no real fun - I logged in more than once with 0-2 people in my range at 47.

Side note: The Imperial leader gank squad saw me in Sirine Island....how about, I don't know, *trying* to kill me alone and not 3on1. Just seems you guys all arrive around the same time and go around as a group killing people. Cool players, Hunsobo and Ktaar definitely, but bad choices.

Side side note: The guys who had my weapon, seriously, grow some balls. Teleporting everytime I'm in the same area, refusing to defend your cabal, and logging out when you see me is about as low as it gets. Suck it up and stick around to fight some, you might actually learn some confidence with a 70-80 charge weapon if you actually fought someone.

3) Immteraction - the whole thing with Twist was cool, but come on man....200 hours of practically no healers (I slipped and put it in my role at one point), three separate interactions, and I get 500 immortal experience and that's it? I got more from my role alone in my teens than I ever did along the road - I couldn't even afford Champion of Man after making that sacrifice. What happened to Scion being the RP-heavy cabal? Moments like the time with my guildmaster talking (whoever you are, thanks) make it so I want to login, but 45minutes out of 200 hours isn't exactly fun. I prayed a bunch of times with not even an Immortal on to answer and I think I just need to realize that I'm looking for a little more than that and need to step away before it gets more depressing.....still mad about Sekhuroth too. I think if the staff realized that edges+coding are cool, but having a random mob talk to you for 5 minutes seriously makes the game fun. Interact with the players more and maybe the game won't slowly fade away because with such a low population, it's definitely not the pk that keeps people around.

4) Giant wasn't really my style - spending *hours* practicing weapons/defenses, thrust/pierce/slice so I could get SotA, and spells just wasn't fun (must be nice to have +1int, Cabdru - still think what you did is impossible). Even with divine saves in spells/paralysis, neuro disruption could pretty much destroy me (and there's no anti-neruo edge) and the amount of assassins and dexterity characters out there makes it a rough life because it's hard as hell to hit them. I'll probably post some logs, but great examples is fighting Ktaar with a flame controlled axe/mace with a/b/s/bloodlust and having to flee - I mean come on, he doesn't even know the weapons and I have a weakness exploited with prog damage. Probably an even worse fight was that arial assassin scout who spellbaned/spelldodged everything I had and I couldn't hit him *with a flail*. I'd say over 75% of my range was dexterity-races and for obvious reasons - it works.

Anyways, I think I'm done - I'll probably have some Immortal say how wrong I was or am on what I'm talking about, but what I really enjoy in this game (interaction and exploring) just doesn't happen anymore.

zulg+kast, you're cool, keep it up. I think they game might actually make it because of you two.

Torak

Imms delete this post, that's just bollox posting all that and not expecting people to guess it.

Screw you, Torak.

Eh, I edited it some. I wasn't as bad as others though.

that is if they get the right roll on the location as well. Not to mention the fact you probably know the location he speaks of becaue you know that location already. BUT, that doesnt mean everyone else who actually dont know this certain location are going to click it together off nothing.

gg

Then again, I think I've become disillusioned with item location knowledge as a skill. Area knowledge is key when fighting but I no longer see the point of making people screw around for hours trying to figure out where some stupid thing is.

But before he didn't have to mention the name of the mob. He gave away enough unique specs that anyone who'd fought it or even seen it fought would know. I wouldn't have reacted so badly to just giving away 'It does necromancer spells'

Yhorian

That nice goose chase you gave me was fun, but hey, I got my first glimpse of some things, which was cool. However, I'll never get over the people who just get into a cabal or whatever and try pushing those who hvae been in for a bit around.

We could have done some nasty things together, but alone we can as well, which is always nice. Have fun with whatever.

Aomiern

No message

It's for the best?

>It's for the best?

What was this about?

His mom probably taught him that lesson that if he has nothing nice to say not to say anything at all. :) (She just recently taught him that.)

Cheers,
Jhyrb

n/t

With the "low player base" it might even be easier to pwnzr a couple of those locations.

*wink wink*

-Some are pretty much unspawnable unless the game reboots.
-Most have higher level requirements and aren't usable/attainable until hero ranks.
-Most have low charges and low durations.

So yeah, I can *maybe* get a non-sleek wand that has half the charges/duration, or I could have randomnly got a location where I could walk to my sleek and pick it up untouched like some lucky people.

Let's see...now I know why people make shifters to 30 and delete once they find a sleek they don't like.

use sleeks at all, Nabburak and Greddarh, so stop crying about your locations that's just childish.

=Greddarh=

Tue Mar 7 17:09:17 2006 by 'Drokalanatym' at level 51 (257 hrs):
I can't remember the last time I saw someone run away from a fight with A/B/S+ up and over 1600 hp.

Mon Mar 27 16:38:21 2006 by 'Muuloc' at level 51 (299 hrs):
Really should use some of his unused practices to learn excision so he doesn't end up fighting without a shield so much.

=Nabburak=

Average Group Size Per Kill 2.18


And both of these characters were pre-dexterity changes and over 1-2 years ago. Get a clue.

Yea and excision was 3 round lag and you could carry much less things in your inventory as fire giant.

As for Nep comment on my ap there was really good reason not to fight that time.

I don't see how one bad comment makes character bad.
I don't see why gang o meter does the same.

You were not even close to any of these ap. :P

Don't tell me it is impossible to play ap without sleeks that just ####.

nt

To quote the others “You could have found a none sleek barrier wand”.
As for getting killed even with a 70 charge weapon that is just good game balance for me.

I didn't get to interact with your char this time around but really if you want more chars to help your char perhaps scion isn't the way to go. It is full of solo people all having different side goals and working together isn't what you see them do the most. Try empire next time.
As for low player base, its summer I'm guessing (and hoping) that people go outside.

Anyway, I think you are a competent player, should you just get some more tolerance and try to have fun with your char without it depending on others (read imms) I think you can be one of the grate players of this mud. But at the moment you are just a bit to winy for me.

Anyway, I suggest a break for a wile and go out and play some in the sun then come back and kill some more!

Good luck.

Well played from what I saw. You were a fun enemy the few times we butted heads... Ghrovash was one character who I somehow thought I'd get to fight lots more down the road. I wanted revenge for that nice bashdown sesh and now I'm bummed you deleted. See ya back in another form I'm sure man.

I overprepped a ton just to have a shot against villager assassins, trust me when I honestly say I wasn't looking forward to another fight. You were a fun character but there's something masochistic about fighting someone you can't hit at all.

I'll post the log if I find it.

3) Immteraction - the whole thing with Twist was cool, but come on man....200 hours of practically no healers (I slipped and put it in my role at one point), three separate interactions, and I get 500 immortal experience and that's it? I got more from my role alone in my teens than I ever did along the road - I couldn't even afford Champion of Man after making that sacrifice.

Basically, you talked the talk and never walked the walk. It's exactly what you did in the past as Aether-- you're one guy if a conversation comes up, and quite another when it's time to act.

You had this anti-priest role (plus the Macho flaw, etc.) about how you were so badass that you didn't need or want divine assistance. I go to watch you, and what are you doing? Enlisting a PC healer's help to gang someone down, directly asking for aid via tells. Someone else watches you? You're trying to multi-kill some naked warrior. Later? You and your chaotic ethos are trying to file criminal reports with a Tribunal paladin. Someone wonders if you ever try to fight priests, checks, and the answer is 'maybe once or twice'.

Aside from contests, rewards are generally given more for roleplaying than rolewriting. The role is only meaningful insofar as it guides the character's actions.

I think if the staff realized that edges+coding are cool, but having a random mob talk to you for 5 minutes seriously makes the game fun. Interact with the players more and maybe the game won't slowly fade away because with such a low population, it's definitely not the pk that keeps people around.

Coding occupies the time of 4 staff members at present, and going by your PBF contents, roughly half of the comments were from people who write code. Any lack of immteraction you're seeing has little to do with the handful of people who spend part of their time coding.

valguarnera@carrionfields.com

With Daevryn gone, how'd I'd know you'd step in to take his spot.

1) Keep it up with the Aether stuff, really, it's entertaining.

2) The healer incident was a mistake and I placed it in my role - I was justifying killing a priest with a priest and from that incident I never used a healer again. Multi-kill a naked warrior? I killed I think one warrior more than once, and he wasn't worth a soul once in those times. And if you read my role, I used the law to my own ends because I realized how retarded it is to be wanted nowadays and avoided it like the plague - it's called LYING. And I fought a ton of priests, don't even - all those druids and paladins, it's not like there are a ton of them in the game considering it's empowerment class people - I guess I should just suicide on shamans/paladins who have 9 levels on me or are like Niheriva/Thoric/Linaeren. Yeah, I guess me killing a priest of every cabal was a figment of my imagination....I may have had trouble landing kills but who doesn't against shamans/druids/paladins without ganging them. I logged everything of this character, guess I should just post every priest log to show how wrong you are.

This is why people leave this game because of comments like this. 200 hours of a character and you point out one incident, which I regretfully apologize to Twist for and write about in my role, some fascination that I tried to multi-kill a naked warrior (if you're around and worth a soul, you're going to get attacked because the population is so damn low I have to to get controls), and a TOTAL BS comment about not attacking priests when that's *all I did* at hero range. What, I should sink 600 hours like Sekhuroth to *try* and please you guys, only to be bitchslapped back with the crap he had to deal with? What the hell is wrong with your perspectives to want hundreds of hours invested until you even have a chance at something and then when someone meets your good graces (or is an Imm), they get grossly overpowered tattoo powers or equivalents......all the while, don't mess up once in your hundreds of hours, or we'll hold it against you for the whole life of the character - or obviously like you, across characters. 200 freaking hours of not using pc healers with a flawed anti-paladin, I mess up once, and it's held against me until the end. Figures.

3) Let me guess, of those four coding staff members, I bet the vindictive duo made comments on my PBF. Guess we'll see. You and Daevryn should take notes from Kastellyn/Zulghinlour and *maybe* this game won't go to complete trash.

Enjoy, round 1 of searching for priest fights : http://www.qhcf.net/cforum/logs/vpost.pl?88397

Sorry, but, not seeing the ends of any of the fights you posted, I have to say, bleh. I didn't see the end of any of those fights, just you fighting someone. Nothing about you being the hunted or being the hunter. Nothing about success of those fights or failure.

The funny thing about most of this, is that I made several notes in regards to watching you for champion of man. I know the coders are usually very busy in regards to doing what they do, so, if someone is really stepping it up, I put in a good word for them. Here are some of my notes that I made about Ghrovash while talking to the Implementors in regards to your earning the edge you wanted and being known for what you were doing.

Fri Jun 15 19:18:17 2007 by 'Lyristeon' at level 44 (148 hrs):
Last login : Fri Jun 15 19:05:21 2007 Last logout: Fri Jun 15 19:12:44 2007. Fort had the scepter and someone to fight to get it back. Champion of Man edge?

Fri Jun 15 19:19:42 2007 by 'Lyristeon' at level 44 (148 hrs):
We did take the time to pray for not being healed by his cabal healer. Sounds like he is fishing for C of M, but, I am seeing a trend of quitting out when things are slightly tough.

The trend that I noticed was seeing you log out when there were some foes who were capable of giving you a hard time. Specifically shamans and paladins.

>The trend that I noticed was seeing you log out when there
>were some foes who were capable of giving you a hard time.
>Specifically shamans and paladins.

I'd like to see someone not have a problem fighting Niheriva ;) I didn't really log out to avoid any fights but I generally found it pretty useless to fight both because solo the chances of killing people with cloaks of displacement and that martyr stand (damn I hate that) and I didn't feel like wasting the time (you have to prep for real life hours to compete against characters who need zero prep besides a fly/enlarge potion). I did fight them both solo but nothing came of it but me fleeing or them fleeing/matyr/teleporting. After that I didn't go actively looking for them unless I had more aid (like a transmuter to stun them or a ranger hidden to dirt kick - an instance where I did raid against Niheriva).

The only time (maybe twice) I logged in and logged out like that, I really had to go - think in that instance my boss called, price of working at home. There were plenty of times I did tough it out and did retrieve against the two of them (or people like Ktaar which I feared a lot more). Did I ever kill them? No, but I got them both pretty hurt....read the Thoric+Chaimosho log I posted on Dios, I had him mortally wounded not to recover and his tattoo saved him (still think it's a bug, as a martyr you save your groupmates not yourself).

Landing kills on empowerment classes like shamans/paladins/druids who can't be lagged isn't easy - but that's why it's the reverse for them to actually get the kill. Doesn't mean I didn't try though, obviously from that log list....and I think I died maybe once or twice to empowerment characters (stupid camo gang squad on eastern, damn you Raagba! :P)

>I'd like to see someone not have a problem fighting Niheriva

At least you have barrier.

>of killing people with cloaks of displacement and that martyr
>stand (damn I hate that) and I didn't feel like wasting the

Afaik that character doesn't have champion's stand. If that's what you're talking about. Still going to kick your ass, but not because of champ's stand.

The martyr edge.

I sincerely hope thats a ####ing tattoo effect he was complaining about and not an edge. If thats an edge doing what he's complaining about(I know what he's complaining about) thats one hell of an edge.

Then it hardly makes a difference whether it is an edge or a tattoo effect, since it will be effectively handed out by an imm either way. The only difference is whether it is via tattoo or via imm exp. In fact, you could argue that imm exp is a fairer alternative because then it might require the input of several imms, and not just one.

Having the input of several imms is likely to make it fairer. In conclusion, I would prefer it if it were an edge, because that tatt seems a bit out of whack with other tatts. Maybe not in ultimate potential, but certainly in the usage I see it get, because all characters with it seem to get the full range of powers, unless there are even more of them.

By the way, wanted to say thanks for the comments though..guess I'll see soon with the PBF though, had a friend buy it.

How convenient.

I hope you're the one that leaves.

We don't hand every character extra rewards. Normally, I'm happy to let that go (most people improve with experience) but if you're going to wave the drama flag and ignore all of your roleplay shortcomings while demanding more rewards be heaped upon you, I'm happy to respond as to why I thought this character was bottom-tier.

The character wasn't really punished (beyond a small XP deduction for calling on the help of a priest to help you win a fight despite, well, everything in the role), joined a cabal, had a bunch of immteractions, and lived out his days. I'm having trouble seeing the big conspiracy here.

My advice: Get out of your rut and stop playing identical APs (with different written roles, but identical in practice), and either learn to take what you dish out, or don't dish it out.

valguarnera@carrionfields.com

>and either learn to take what you dish out, or don't dish it out.

I'd say the same for you. Great avoidance of the "not attacking priests" comment though, true politician.

I'd say the same for you. Great avoidance of the "not attacking priests" comment though, true politician.

PBF's got that covered, though not from me. Suffice to say that when someone looked (probably halfway through the character's life), the evidence wasn't impressive. Ghrovash was much more about stalking pits for ghosts than worrying about priests. And complaining. I might have reversed the order.

valguarnera@carrionfields.com

...which really erk me. I had killed Roxas and he teleported to somewhere no one could get his body, so we waited at his pit because I wanted some pieces of his gear. He sat there and unghosted right in the same room, what do you expect? And even after we took some of his loot, I gave him back everything I didn't use and what I replaced. Naitan might have taken more, but I didn't (hell I even handed him back his weapons).

Totally out of context and yet "I stalk pits for ghosts". Please, seriously, do your research before you try and slam someone. And even early on I attacked every priest I could, but there's not exactly an abundance of empowered characters in the 20s.

Having interacted with a couple of your AP's now, they are blatantly the same character. I'm echoing Valg's general comment--learn how to roleplay. Your ####ing attitude sucks.

For example, I've played a chaotic character who filed reports where some were true, some were fictional, and I broke the law a lot too.

Don't see why a chaotic character would never choose to report a crime. That's like saying that a guy that hates cops would never choose to report a crime, but there are all kinds of reasons that you might choose to.

I can see why it might be bad in the case of this character, but just feels to me that chaotic should not mean never reports a crime or allies with a trib, or that orderly should mean obeys the law.

I agree that scenarios exist where a deceptive or manipulative character might do that, in a certain style. I just don't think this was one of those situations.

The scenario I saw came off much more as a player complaint than a character complaint. He was whiny, allegedly within a context of a role (and Macho flaw!) which radiates strength and disdain for weakness, to a character that should be the absolute antithesis of this character (Tribunal paladin).

We see this sort of thing a lot. You'll watch a character interview for a cabal, and the speech is all about how he'll bend to no man and everyone will fear his name.... then an hour later watch the guy just embarrass himself groveling for gear. If you want the reputation/title/perks of having the badass role, you frequently need to keep your dignity and roll with some punches.

valguarnera@carrionfields.com

I kind of see the Macho flaw as being a disdain for personal weakness, aka the One Law fire giant helpfile. I had a specific entry for learning to lie because earlier on his life he didn't, and I was figuring out that to get Tribunals out of town and to use it my advantage (aka reporting someone else) was a lot better.

It'll be in the PBF for people to read. Being Macho doesn't mean you're a complete idiot, means you just do things for your own reasons no matter if they're right or wrong - and Ghrovash got tired of waiting on Tribunals to walk outside and tired of being attacked in town safely (since you don't yell with the flaw) so he reported others.

You should read the logs of the conversations with Teleon and Mjothvitnir, both I challenged to duels to the death outside town and both fled. Ghrovash exerted strength plenty, but it wasn't working to land the kill - so he got dirty.

And toughing it out when prudence calls for a retreat.

Even I was surprised at how badly I tooled you - I mean, I didn't get the kill, but there was no way you were going to beat me. My saves are pretty high, and against a lower ranked AP, it would be real hard for that AP to land anything. But I was more surprised about how in just pure melee you were unable to land a thing. Kot/Kans/calt/etc work wonders.

I couldn't remember how to spell your name :)

And Kots/kans/caltraps/etc works nice, but it still didn't make a difference for the first 4-6 rounds where my +str/+dex offset it (I had quite a lot)....even lusted with perfected weapons/defenses, I had no shot against you at all. No fun on my end :(

I die a whole lot more than I should, really. But you surprised me in how easy it was to beat you :)

The Bespeckled Bitch on the other hand wiped the floor with my arial ass.

Scouts are a royal BITCH for APs to fight, across the board. Warrior, assassin, bard, whatever. You get so used to using iceball or fireball that having that taken away from your arsenal, even a little bit, sucks. I think I beat Feiaina because of the RNG as well. I hit like three area spells in a row through spell evasion, which made a huge difference. With her being higher level than you, that would be much, much harder for you to pull off.

I'd say, don't generalize too much based on one fight. Could go different next time. I'd also add that flails can #### up assassins just fine. Hi Vens! :P

Kastellyn the Devourer of Magic, Lord of Legends

What is it?

They do or don't?

Experience and tactics will outdo levels way more than vice versa.

Perhaps. Vallas was wiping out people 8 and 10 ranks over him.

When all things are equal then ranks matter.

for spells. And for saves vs. spell and things affected by saves vs. spell which *gasp* includes things like spell evasion and spellbane. Honestly... it's like you don't even play this game.

They may not parry them much, but flails are not the hardest to dodge.

I know who you are based on the way you played, and it freaks me out that you can delete a character that has so many hours when I only met them about 2 days about.

To get through so many aps so fast you must play a ****-load of hours!

186 hours / 41 days = 4-5 hours a day

I work at home at a job with frequent breaks, so it's pretty easy. I usually would play for a few hours while I do some grunt work for my job, then work heavily, then maybe play at night when I'm finishing work.

*shrug*