Tue Apr 12 16:39:03 2005

At 5 o'clock PM, Day of the Moon, 28th of the Month of the Dark Shades
on the Theran calendar Gnarugk perished, never to return.

Race:	orc
Class:	berserker
Level:	51
Alignment:	Evil
Ethos:	Neutral
Cabal:	None, None
Age:	31
Hours:	146

Not a particularly enjoyable character, but then that's been the case with most of mine for a while now.

As I said on Dio's, I've noted a significant decline in my desire to play, and forcing myself to sit down at my computer and play for an hour a week to maintain a set of equipment seems a bit pointless, especially since I went from such a high dose of playing to almost nothing at all.

Basically, I've come to the conclusion that it's time for me to move on and try to find some new hobbies. I'm sure there will be a lot about CF that I'll miss, PKilling all of you time again probably ranking near the top of that list.

However, there are a few things I won't miss, and I think that if I post them, perhaps someone else might benefit from it in the future.

In all of my time here, and that's nearing 7 or 8 years, I can think of maybe five or so times that I had Immortal interaction brought my way without basically having to beg and plead for it. Maybe it was having played an orc for my last character (since their limited roleplay capacity hardly inspires many Imms, if any, to even bother noticing them) but I thought I was doing fairly well in both the RP and PK aspects, and I basically felt incredibly ignored, and that my having received Thrak's tattoo was the booby prize, not the winner's reward, since he appeared once, said nothing about any of my accomplishments, tatt'd me, and was never seen again.

I understand the idea that you have to play the game for yourself, and that in itself should be ample reward, but when you watch the entirety of your daily PK range pick up titles and post logs of massive quests they're involved in, it's disheartening. So my advice would be for Imms who have a few moments to spare to just throw a few pechos or somesuch in the direction of the less known/observed characters, maybe run something small for them that doesn't require any new hardcoding or massive amounts of player or Imm time. Just a little bit of recognition or Imm prompted adventure goes a long way in inspiring a character to hang around/stick it out.

It's hard not to think that Imms play favorites when the more 'cookie-cutter' characters reap rewards while those who make an effort towards the less often played/more difficult to play classes sit and watch events unfold that have no bearing on them or their character. I'm sure the Imms don't play favorites, and that more often than not these players have just chosen to partake in a religion/cabal that is more active for both players and Imms, and that the attention they receive is a natural castoff of the higher activity levels, but still... I spent some time playing a more RP intense mud that adhered to more of a D&D format, and perhaps this is why I look for a bit of that Imm interaction. Without it, I'm left with an inanimate world in which I can partake in automated quests and interact with people who may or may not (usually the latter) inspire much RP from me beyond a few choice words or emotes.

All that said, let me offer a few parting words about orcs. Man, do they suck. Bad. I did alright, I think, but would attribute that to teleport potions and ganging, and finished up the character without much sense of accomplishment, since I more-or-less couldn't hold my own against the majority of the characters I ran into. I had very few allies, and thus wasn't particularly wont to betray them as a true orc should, since an orc won't survive very long without those allies as a result of their inherent weaknesses/vulns and their being so incredibly underpowered. Given the nature of the class, I would have thought that the Imms would feel more inclined to offer the class a more RP intense outlook to compensate for the hours spent hiding from big hunting groups and even avoiding the single player classes that can lay out a whipping against an orc foolish enough to let himself be found. Unfortunately, in my experience this wasn't the case, and this too attributed to my loss of desire to play the orc, or to play in general.

I don't intend for this post to incite anger, or to leave anyone thinking I am bashing CF. I've had an incredible amount of fun here over the years, and maybe I've just become too jaded as a result of what I've seen and done. I vaguely recall a post in which one of the Imms mentioned that it is up to the veteran player to bring to the game that unique "newness" that they experienced when they originally started playing, and despite all my efforts, I have been unable to do this.

Having issued my complaints }( I'll close with a very big thank you to the Imms for providing me with a source of entertainment over the years. With the exception of the occaisional down-time or a brief period when CF was down for a good while, I always knew I could sit at my computer and escape for a while, and it was enjoyable.

Signing out,
Cartherlen

Actually it's simple. Orc's RP consideres that their power is in numbers. And at the same time orc is the least popular race in game.
It is not a matter of power. It is just a matter of little interest in the orcs as in the class/race thing.

"my having received Thrak's tattoo was the booby prize, not the winner's reward, since he appeared once, said nothing about any of my accomplishments, tatt'd me, and was never seen again. "

Sadly, that is fairly accurate. You came around when I was not around, as I am rarely on in the evenings EST. I wanted to tat you so when I saw you, I gave it to you. From what I saw of you, you played an orc the way they should be played, but that was based on very limited viewing.

In terms of the general comments about Immteraction, when I am able to be active, I have certainly tried to make orcs feel like they have a god watching over them and being on their side. Personally I like the pure roles, rather than the exceptions - I would rather watch an orc stab another orc in the back then see one try to get into the Fortress. Unfortunately, my life is rather complex right now, and that is not something I have been able to do over the last 9 months or so and it is likely to be that way after the summer.

Good luck with life and if you do ever come back, try another orc and Imm him - I could use the help with the clan.

The first orc I played, Burzuk, received more interaction from you in probably 80 or so hours than I received with the rest of my characters over all the years, combined. That is why I rolled up Bukrinuk, Grubbekul, and finally Gnarugk. I cannot put into words how exciting it was to smash down some elf and be randomly headbutted (Thrakpraise!) for my efforts. Burzuk was probably the most enjoyable character I ever played, and you were partly responsible for that, so thank you. I really did miss that attention these last couple of times around. I just recalled a mini-quest Lyristeon ran for me when I played Bukrinuk, and how I had been debating my deletion at the time and ended up playing a good 70 or so more hours as a result of it. I really wish something like that had come up again.

For you, Qaledus, and Valg: I'm not really sure how I would go about critiquing the orc class, since there are often a multitude of factors in any given situation and each one plays into whether or not an orc even has a chance to win. I didn't keep track of my PK's, so I'll have to wait until my PBF comes out to determine just how successful I was in that aspect, but there are few things I noticed that would immediately determine whether or not I would even bother trying to fight certain people. I just e-mailed you both a few choice tidbits that came to mind, though it's hardly as organized as it would be if I went through all my logs first.

I never bothered practicing pin, since an orc wielding a spear or polearm against any skilled player is typically as good as dead. I ran around using axes almost the entire duration of all of my orcs, since their defenses already leave so much for wanting, and most classes are generally more vulnerable to axes than other weapons (orcs typically winning their fights through fast and massive damage output). The only time I ever even bothered with a spear or polearm was while I fought porcupines. I would add that to the part concerning additional downsides to certain skills.

Seriously though, although we butt heads on the forums, you've had some solid characters over the years, and it certainly will suck to lose a quality player. I particularly liked the way Gnarugk tried to play Scion and Empire at the same time. A couple times I almost gave the order to have you spladdattered, but then thought it was neat having a scheming orc around.

We'll see you back, I hope. Hell, even I come out of semi-retirement once or twice a year to check out the action.

>All that said, let me offer a few parting words about orcs.
>Man, do they suck. Bad.

I don't know if you were a lowbie when the last batch of tweaks
to orc skills and the orc village went in, but I was wondering
if you found the added skills/tweaks at all helpful.

Did the change to hiding ever come into play for you? Was the
(admittedly less effective) healer a help? As Chief, did you
feel your regeneration was appropriate (in spite of whatever
other underpoweredness you felt)?

If you find the time or motivation, feel free to e-mail me
about where you felt the wheels came off the wagon as you
moved up the levels. Orcs seem to do alright into the 30's,
but if you have any anecdotes of the different challenges
you faced on the way to, and at, Hero, drop me a line.

Help me help the next Chief on your way out. ;)

Qaledus
qaledus@carrionfields.com

Orcs seem to do alright into the 30's, but if you have any anecdotes of the different challenges you faced on the way to, and at, Hero, drop me a line.

Yup. Qaledus has probably seen the recent aggregate PK stats for orcs, but suffice to say that the sub-35 crowd is winning a lot more fights than they're losing. As for 36+, there haven't been enough orcs to draw real conclusions. That may indicate a problem with the class at high levels, a lack of exploration by the playerbase, or a mixture of both.

That said, I'll second his request for hero-range orc feedback if you have time.

valguarnera@carrionfields.com

Orcs take damage from too many of their skills.

Grapple, Offhand grapple, Crushing Assault, Head butt, regurgitate, forced march.

It never used to be that Crushing A. did this, and it's it does now. As a staple orc skill this just sucks. When a failed Crush not only means Lag, but possibly a trip to the Wimpy, it blows. Please return this skill back to what it used to be.

Not to mention. If you forced March your done ranking for umpteen number of game hours do to con loss. An orc near con death wouldn't even be able t use the skill.


The reason orcs don't rate at high levels is because they can't remin in a lot of the fights they get into. The tweeks to Orc Wimy has helped a little but not being able to defend leads to a wimp and a can full of frustration.

"The reason orcs don't rate at high levels is because they can't remin in a lot of the fights they get into. The tweeks to Orc Wimy has helped a little but not being able to defend leads to a wimp and a can full of frustration."


-This was something I took note of as well. It wasn't so much a problem with the wimpy as it was just being generally outhit in melee battles. Granted, with the limited hours I had for Gnarugk, and the lack of perfected weapons and defenses, that is often going to be the outcome, but with other orcs I've played I noticed a very similar pattern, and this was the case even when hasted sometimes. I guess you could argue that an orc against any of the fighting classes should be generally outskilled, but for the sake of game balance it might help to give them a bonus here or there.

On a side note, in regard to your comment concerning orcs taking damage from most of their major skills...

I agree, but physical damage isn't necessarily the worst that they suffer. Consider that war banners, headbutt, pin, and a number of other skills require an orc to sacrifice dual wield, which is a HUGE loss when coupled with their already weak physical disposition. They have some incredibly sick hps, but nowhere near enough to compensate for the sacrifices that these skills require.

So much so that a lot of times I can only get one spine off in the begining of the fight before I wimp out or am PK'ed.

I think the main problem with Orcs past forty is by then most folks
(I think) are caballed. This gives them some sort of purpose, and
allies. As far as whether they are weak or not I haven't played them
much - I only got one past 35.

Personally I think Orcs should be seen as somewhat expendable
characters, so instead of buff them up I'd be all for seeing them
gain levels like crazy, even more so than they already do with a
group of Orcs. I'd seriously say double the xp gain for Orcs. This
is a much better idea than balancing them, if they are, which may
or may not be the case. In fact, maybe even weaken them but make
the xp gains incredible.

Edited to add: Whole point isn't to make them easier to kill with,
but to make it so incredibly easy for them to rise (and be killed).
It would definitely be a different style of Class/Race.

Would make it quantity over quality like it should... That would bring more people to playing an ork and seeking safety in numbers. I hope the Imms would consider something like that. ^^

That the orcs I have played have shown some relative quality over quantity (well, there isn't any of the latter at all, really, past lvl 36) and that this idea has some foundation, yet it takes away from the balanced notion of CF as a whole. The class can be appropriately balanced with a few simple skills. Taking away from what they already have would make them a joke (unfortunately, with this particular concept you've mentioned being one driving newer players to try something "simple" and finding themselves completely screwed in the majority of the more difficult aspects of the game).

My orc was fun as hell, Tuk was thought to deleted because he lost his decent 54dmg vuln set. Tuk always had a 40+axemacevuln set
Bash savage feeding
Overbear sv fding
grapple sv fding
offhand grapple sv fding
spinebreaker

sv feeding cheapshot spike toe boots
protectino gud, stone skin, shield, aura, are easy to get
headbutt savage feeding.
trip lash ect

This is what an orc is.

50%fleechasehuntavoid{alwaysmoving}
49%right lagging/disarming moves
1%gear

gear is so easy to get.

I dont see why you had such a hard time, hero must be alot different from 43

i would slaughter sdradiga, kill a group of assassins, kill brugbeleg the mino shaman, and finally flee from a felar staff spec who was withering in a matter of 3-4 minutes no preps

Heh guys, want to have mastered def in orcs by the time your 30something? around the time you master spinebreaker and savage feeding and all lagging moves?

group with healers,bards,transmuters,rangers(hehe) and tank as much
as possible. Tuk had a good healer transmuter group for 3 arnks.
but usually there was always a bard online. sorry ooc for
betraying you sdradiga, nothing personal.

gnarugk, was having a ####ing hard time staying alive though from 32 to 43. i was always just making it, killing many solos per rank.
doesnt it suck you play an orc how its supposed to play and do alright in roleplay and rock in pk and you are congratulated.
now take a firegiantwarrior and choose a ####ty spec and have a sick set, decent rp, no deaths, and many pks and you are now the reason many go oooc saying they are retiring or not playing much because of you blah blah blah. Then join the empire heh. Ic you are doing really good and ooc you want to delete so you stop taking out a group of 4 or 5 every raid while having just one person with you.
poor newbies, I feel sorta bad.

Cf is everything i need, except the guilt trip for being that good without even using preps. All my deaths in the last two years are running into groups of 2+ solo going in for a blitzgreg suicide kill because of somecoward who avoids you for 200+ hours..
haha f you mr lolipop tasild, jk wellplayed. You pissed tuk off so much always showing up in a one vs one, making it hasted tuk vs sanced dwarf and throwing tasild and pincers. I lost about 9 sick sets with that char. oh well.

really what gets me in this game is going on 30-40 player killing streaks and then dying stuupiid to a squad i could have walked away from. Its a 'please kill me for the regearingchallengeor whatever'


well, anyways, great job gnarugk,

6 years ago i was SseanN on MiRc

now i usually just post a rambling every month or so on this webight. Mebe when I get my new comp i will make logs of this and my next character to show what I mean.

Keep trucking newbies, con isnt everything, neither is gear, knowledge and the search for it in this game is EVERYTHING?


Why did I have to start the day they went out with hellfire.
Saetinshaet would have been the coolest firecaster of master.


Oh yea, and I still die to ####ing tarus and the kobolds chiefs daughter every time..imms and their gatepwordkill jk

I Miss thror, pico and twist and agothocles and cador,really.

I hope some of you are in another form of a imm

WHAT IS PICO DOING?
DOPPLE was one skill i never got. I WOULD DONATE 500dollars and do a naked dance for it.

And just say whatever. You talk the talk, but you definitely haven't taken the real walk, pal. When you have, then post. I don't think I died anywhere near as often as you seemed to think I did, and I've played more than a few orcs. I'd say that, in general, your perception is quite a bit off. Tell you what...when my PBF comes out, see if you can't beat my hrs to lvl to PK ratio, throw in a bit of RP, and if you can come out on top, I will honestly and personally validate every orc critique you have to offer.

Peace,
Carth

Da Chief!
Sad to see him pack da axe and leave...

Have fun with your next Char man :)

ALL HAIL DA CHIEF!

.

Well "interact" would be a bit much... ;)
Glogrog was his name and I think it was you who one noded out of the shadows at the healer to him for saying something like "only da chief is da chief" or something similar stupid to some orks who bolstered about theyr might.
I realy looked forward to some chieftain interaction on the higher levels but I made so many mistakes building my char that absolutely everybody used him for gaining some pks... (humans, dwarfes, elves, my leveling groups etc.)
One day after dying 3 times to a mob and getting pked two times (inkl. the clean looting and loosing my lucky axe) I just gave up with that one ...

I wish you the best for your future...
Take a break, I am sure you will be back one day ;p

Unfortunately, I'm reallly gone from playing. However, I tried to make it fun for the lower level orcs by giving them a whole bunch of shinies whenever they looked/felt in need of them, be it axes, gear, or just a kick in the ass. Honestly, the most satisfaction I took from playing this character was feeding into the younger orcs and hoping that someday someone would challenge me for the spot of chieftain. Granted I would have had a slight advantage having already played a chieftain that had fought for the spot, but still, if any of the multitude of orcs that have appeared had actually stood up and made something of themselves, I would have been behind them 110%. Regardless of whether or not you did/will follow through with that, thank you for playing and orc that interacted with me and making my role a bit more enjoyable.