Fri Dec 30 09:11:47 2011

At 12 o'clock PM, Day of Deception, 23rd of the Month of the Battle
on the Theran calendar Rogran perished, never to return.

Race:	dwarf
Class:	paladin
Level:	51
Alignment:	Good
Ethos:	Orderly
Cabal:	TRIBUNAL, the Blood Tribunal
Age:	171
Hours:	226

Man I had a good time with Rogran. but it was time for it to be over.

Immortals:
Whiysdan - What can I say, I had to come right back with something else. It was awesome, better than the first time, felt a lot less forced on my end. Thanks for all the great RP

Enlilth - Thanks for punting me, and even giving me the Clap, it was a fun bit of RP there for a while.

Marcatis - Thanks for the try at Vindy. man I wish I could have been a better one.

Spire:
Yantha - Thanks a bunch for all the time and working with me. It was a blast, and you were fun to run with.

Naija - Good work as Justiciar, keep trucking

Etava - Man I think we could have had a lot more fun if I'd been more patient. Keep truckin man.

All the other Spire - Too many to name independantly, but you all were top notch.

Fort:
Eachaiin - Man I love you. You've progressed so far from the days of Morin. Age die dude, the fort is a better place with you there.

Other Forties: lots of good, some bad, tried to play spirtress as much as I could within the limitations of the Spire.

Enemies:
Empire:
Eleagra I hate Bash, hate it, hate it, hate it. Nuf said.

jekota - The banter was fun for a while, but it just got too much so I stoped interacting with you a lot.

Outlander:
Rolas - Dang dude, fighting you was fun for the most part. Good work
Bronkgrm - Fights were fun.
Onya - Meh. that's all I'll say to an active character.

I know I've left people out. Post and I'll try to reply.

You were more than willing to stick with me and help me when there was nothing for me to do.

You do a good dwarf and you're fast to reply.

A good CF experience for me. Thanks.

I really liked Rogran. It was a joy to interact with you and always made it fun. I'm glad you enjoyed it!

"W"

I'm pretty sure I know why you're pissed off. But You really don't understand Onya's roleplay and I won't really get into it, but basically Onya's not going to take herself out of a sure kill situation to go out and have some "honorable" fight with you. As Vindicator, you're basically required to come after me (Flagged Onya) wherever I am. (As I am to understand it.) So I used that to my advantage... You can be mad all you want, but I trust you understood the drawbacks to vindicator before you accepted.

So I was going to leave this alone until your death thread, in fact when you posted the logs before I deleted, I distinctly avoided them. I do wish I had the RP before this to post, but I dont reliably log. I have been playing long enough to know that 1v1 at an inner is not a plan for success. But I do play to have that little chance that I MIGHT get it. You should know that this is just a pattern of what I saw. It wasn't just this spot. Let me lay out the pattern.

Here are my three experiences with you:

1: Onya running around Galadon immolating me and running away, ostensibly playing rope a dope. One on one, then coming into the spire with Bronkgrm against me, Pole spec warrior that negates cutoff, and proceeding to gank me down. Good rope a dope, but you probably didn't need to bring Bronkgrm, its not like I'm kostyan or jalim or anything.

2: Naija I come to retrieve at the Tree. In the process of retrieving you a) kill your own cabal member b) your own cabal outer. Then we have to proceed and raid, looking back at the logs you posted, you ran away with ~800HP iirc. You posted the logs on this and I specifically ignored them.

3: The log you posted on Dios. To Paraphrase what you said: "I won't fight you with those bloody shackles on, I wont. I fight for the Win not for sport." Something to that effect. Yes, I knew exactly what would happen to me going in there, but I went in anyways cause thats the way I play, stupid.

But the fact of the matter is you are one of the more powerful and skillful players in the game right now, yet your RP sucks balls in my opinion. You abosulutly should have been booted from Outlander for #2 even if it was a mistake, which part of me actually wonders if it was or not. And #3 was borderline OOC, trying to taunt me inside while saying you wouldn't fight me unless I came in for you. Again Meh.

Normally I would have left it at Meh, but you wanted to push it.

I can see many, many viable roles and types of roleplay, especially
for chaotic evil, where forcing the fight to their advantage dishonorably
is fine.

I know you only like to play goodies, but you seem to like roleplay,
so dig this : if chaotic evils only perform orderly good actions so the
other player experiences the least imaginable amount of butthurt,
then that's #### roleplaying.

I haven't read the log, but I'm assuming she wasn't abusing a bug
or anything. If shackles weren't actually involved, my point still stands.

Onya's playstyle, valid as it is, is why there will never be ABS on a stick.

Ever.

My problem with Onya really had very little to do with her wanting to fight at the inners. I absolutely would have and have done the same thing, much less successfully I might add. My problem came with what smacked of mild to not so mild OOC talk of "I won't fight you with those shackles on, I won't." It just came across as meh. I see now that Onya's player may be ESL so that probably has something to do with it. It was more a culmination of my experiences with her, running around immolating then running out and Chameleon in the weald, then bringing Bronk in to make sure I couldn't flee with his cutoff when I didn't just lay down and die for her. But the worse comes in her admitting that she pillared her own outer in a retrieval situation, instead of letting the scales go back, she pillard it and forced us to go take the fetish. Not "oopps I stacked six pillars before I knew it was hurting it." it was "well I saw that it happened and said screw it, I'll do it anyways." That is piss poor on any level.

1) "Rope a dope". Yes I employ this tactic just to #### with you magistrates who NEVER leave the city. It ties into the whole bringing chaos into your orderly lives thing. It's not meant to kill you, necissarily, but to throw you off your normal orderly routine. Also, I'm not sure why everyone assumes a great set and some nice hp makes an invoker unstopable. If I had raided you solo, not only would I not kill you. I would be very liable to die myself. I really think you overestimate what a wanted invoker can do against a dwarf paladin inside the spire and through manacles. If Bronkgrm wasn't there the entire situation changes, and you don't die, and I don't take the scales. In fact, that was way more Bronkgrm than me. Also, it was a raid situation, and Etava was also defending the spire, so I find it funny you still refer to it as a gank.

2.)A) Killing Bronkgrm was completely unintentional and he and I have resolved this IC. You obviously don't understand Evil/Chaotic/Outlander RP but it's much more about dealing with situations and consequences on your own and not relying on anyone else. So, in part, he was to blame as well as me. (Love you Bronk.) B) Naija dispelled the shields that I placed on the huntress, therefore, I was already two pillars in before I realized I was hitting the huntress. At that point (being an Evil/Chaotic/Outlander) I chose to just continue pillaring considering I'm trying (and failing) to drive off very strong enemies. Call it what you want, but I'd like you to remember that while you're slowly clicking down through a log and pointing out every single mistake, in real time, #### is going down and not everything is perfect. Lastly, I didn't run away, I fled just east or south of you, camo'd, reshielded, and was ready to re-engage, but you guys had already left. Again, logs can be misleading, champ. It's kind of sad you can't realize that, or choose not to.

3.) If that's how you play then fine. I happen to think it's great RP for a Dwarf/Paladin/Vindicator to run in head first into that situation. I also think it's great RP for an Evil/Chaotic/Outlander to wait for you to do it. Also, Bloody shackles is NASTY and I've fought through them before, and lost each time.

I have no idea what you mean about going OOC. Seriously, I have no idea what you're even refering to. I do get why you think my RP sucks balls though. It's because you don't understand it at all, and seem to make no effort to. I'm not great at RP for sure, but I've been working more and more on it and I've played many outlanders in the past, so I think I know what I'm doing just a little bit. Lastly, at the end of the day you were outwitted by me on several occasions that led to your death. I didn't fight you the way you wanted me to and it seems to make you angry. Whatever. I never looted you, nor did I ever give you a hard time in game. I even gave you one of my flying potions so you wouldn't fall into quicksand when you went to get your stuff back. But it's cool. I've said what I have to say, and probibly won't respond to any more posts. FYI I happen to have liked Rogran. I think you're a swell fella. :) GLWYN

I don't know anything about most of what you wrote here, but I do find it funny that people are so worried over bloody shackles. Sure, it's still painful to deal with for a mage, that's true. But I'd be glad the vindicator in question was a code-bound paladin who really wasn't all that ridiculously scary (no offense meant to Rogran here). You know, instead of some powerful evil asshole willing to bend the rules, and not be so righteous and easy to screw with - with bloody shackles when they were much more brutal.

Ok so here's where I call your RP bull crap.... Right here:

"At that point (being an Evil/Chaotic/Outlander) I chose to just continue pillaring considering I'm trying (and failing) to drive off very strong enemies. Call it what you want, but I'd like you to remember that while you're slowly clicking down through a log and pointing out every single mistake, in real time, #### is going down and not everything is perfect."

You KILLED YOUR OWN OUTER. I don't care if your outlander, empire, scion or any other cabal. YOU INTENTIONALLY KILLED YOUR OWN OUTER to stop a raid. Thats not RP, thats powergamy doucheyness.

Believe me, I know better than most how fast logs go and how many mistakes can be made in them. But you admitted, that you knew what you were doing was going to kill your outer and went through with it anyway. That is what ticks me off about you saying that I dont know your Role, that I don't know chaotic evil Outlander roles. In any other situation in the mud, that would have gotten someone booted from the cabal. I can understand if you said, "hey I had a brain fart and stacked six pillars and didnt realize that the shields had been dispeled." because that somethign I would have done, no doubt. I even tried to give you the benefit of the doubt when you posted the logs on Dios, but now you admit it, you actively killed your outer to stop a retrieval.

I honestly didn't even think I would. That elemental was hitting her hard as hell. I was trying to drive you guys off. Not kill the huntress to stop you from retrieving. I agree that is a terrible tactic which has been used on me. Truth be told, area spells get me in more trouble than any, which is why I seldom use them. But in that situation, I honetly believe if I had just pillar'd the entire time, instead of trying to immolate like an idiot, I probibly would have won.

doesn't make it any less ####ty to kill your own outer.

I accidentally killed my own Outer as Runaktla, "disrupt bone" on a conjurer named "Scierra", abbreviated it to "Sci" which unfortunately when he/she fled, also worked for "Scion". Boom. Dead.

I was Chancellor at the time. I got bashed by the Dark Healer randomly shortly afterwards while chillaxin at the Archmage, but that's all that came from it. No other repercussions.

I give someone one warning for intentionally doing anything bad to the cabal guardians, whether it kills them or not. (An example that springs to mind is an ap that used to plague the inners in empire.)

Important word is "intentionally".

After that, it's the boot if I see you.

But you could probably have killed the elemental in, oh, 2 or 3 spells?

You might want this edge for similar future scenarios.

Shame it was a little soured by what Elf-bard did but I wont get into it until I delete.

I still carry a sack made out of you, your memory lives on!

Cobra was easy sauce for Rogran, Lion... not so much. I have to learn to prep more for those fights.

The different punches and what not?

What was your feeling about a Dwarf monk?

Definitly one of the prime races for Monk. The Punches are not mastered in each different transcend. You just master transcend and get new attack types at certain levels. Along with Intensify.

I didn't take a lot of time to master anything but Intensify, Respond, and Transcend. I got all my weapons to the high 90s, which I didnt do with my Storm monk and probably a main reason why I failed with him. I personally kept a certain boat in the Hamsah docks funded for slowing, and when I did that, at hero I could manage my Mana much more efficiently.

Monks are I think my second favorite dedication after Shield. I haven't tried the other two, but think that if I do another pally it will be one of those two. Specific questions, post and I'll reply.

What are the attacks you used it against?

Did it work against say.. second or third attack or only special attacks?

I dont know. It pretty much is for skill type things like Bash, trip, sleep.

I think it was Super powerful against things like sleep. I almost never got slept with it up. That was probably a combo of saves/Dwarf spell resist/Anticipate.

I know that there was a bug for Bhowaer with it not every improving that was supposedly fixed, but I never saw an improve on it in 100+ hours of playing. That being said, I don't think I had it up for every fight. Probably less than 50% of the fights. I could and did still get bashed down by certain builds, which with a Shield ded pally I almost never did. By this I mean from the first bash to dead not one command goes in. I can think of two fights where I stood up at my pit with 4 co 'word stacked in, and i am 80% sure I had it up in that fight. So I wouldn't use it for that. It did not work for things like rake for shifters and would give an error on those.

As I said in my death thread, I think most anyone could be more deathful than I was with a Dwarf Monk Pally. If you even half heartedly prep, you'd be a force to reckon with.

dfvsvf

Not to my knowledge beyond manacles and bloody shackles. I tried to keep the Helm of Brilliance as much as I could to get blindness on folks. Progging gear, as with most classes was helpful.

Most of my fights were either:

respond @target
if it lands, intensify

co wrath @target;co wrath;!;!;!

respond is probably the nicest skill Monks have IMO. Opens up Intensify which if done right makes for a running opponent. That said, not many people stick around for a whole intensify, let alone more than one, and at hero, you need more than one to win a fight. I could at times, time the ending of intensify to get a wrath in rigth at the end. but more often than not, I'd find myself sitting in Intensify lag while my opponents ran, or being bashed into the ground.

Monks are def Vuln bash, prep for it. Don't rely on Avoid/Anticipate for it.

I just couldn't seem to nail you down. Our fights always seemed to be a blowout on one side or the other. My animals would start to really get you, or you'd have a few crazy melee rounds. I really liked our "so come to the holy grove, or do you not have the beard for it?". Good stuff.

Rogran, you will be missed.

Thanks for all the time and efforts on helping me trying to put the Spire back to it's feet.

On your roleplay, it was great. I liked a lot the concept of the holy drunken braweler. Also your dwarven accent was cool but without pushing it too much, all around a great addition to the game.

Wish you the best, see you in the fields.

Yantha.

You made this character infinitly more enjoyable.