I look at this as evidence that Demons are not hitting
nearly enough. I'm not sure if this is an issue with
Thac0 or str + dex, or what.. I must be crazy.. but this
should of been a complete blowout.



<24 Human Pal> (PK) Beltantis the Knight of Renown
<27 Human Con> (PK) Barraka the Adept of Geomancy

I have 3 levels on him, and my demon has even more.

A few lucky blows would kill it.
A monstrous mors-gravis demon is larger than you.
It grins evilly with you.


I am using a lot of +hp gear.

You are using:
<worn on finger> an etched jade ring
<worn on finger> an etched jade ring
<worn around neck> a sandy-brown desert cloak
<worn around neck> (Glowing) an iridescent stone amulet
<worn on body> darkened platemail
<worn on head> a captain's hat
<worn on face> a crimson-eyed silver mask
<worn on legs> plate leggings decorated with red enamel
<worn on feet> a pair of gray leather boots
<worn on arms> a pair of armguards from the snow worm
<worn as shield> an orcish shield
<worn about body> a long coat of velvet midnight
<worn about waist> a wide bronze belt
<worn around wrist> a bracer of gray leather
<worn around wrist> a bracer of gray leather
<wielded> (Glowing) the Dagger of Death


(PK) Barraka Entangled undergrowth
(PK) Beltantis Entangled undergrowth

You lash at Beltantis's feet with a sharkskin whip!
You fade into existence.
Your lash misses Beltantis.
Beltantis yells 'Help! Barraka is lashing me!'
Beltantis <4/7>


<100%hp 34%m 90%mv 11998tnl>
Your whip injures Beltantis.
Beltantis parries your whip.
You parry Beltantis's searing cut.
Beltantis's searing cut DISMEMBERS you!
Beltantis <4/7> <-- watch this

<84%hp 34%m 90%mv 11998tnl>
Beltantis leaves west.
Beltantis has fled!

<84%hp 34%m 90%mv 11998tnl> w

An air elemental has arrived.
Beltantis yells 'Help! I'm being attacked by a monstrous mors-gravis demon!'
A monstrous mors-gravis demon has arrived.

***SNIP***

An air elemental has arrived.
Beltantis yells 'Help! I'm being attacked by a monstrous mors-gravis demon!'
A monstrous mors-gravis demon has arrived.

***SNIP***

I charge in assuming that I'm doing a clean up job.. My demon
has just rocked the hell out of him, right?

<77%hp 44%m 35%mv 11998tnl>
An air elemental has arrived.
A monstrous mors-gravis demon has arrived.

<77%hp 44%m 35%mv 11998tnl> s
They aren't here.

<77%hp 44%m 35%mv 11998tnl> cast 'magic missile' beltantis
A sullen grave


A tombstone with 'Baron' etched into the granite.
Beltantis is resting here.

<77%hp 44%m 33%mv 11998tnl> Beltantis yells 'Die, Barraka, you sorcerous dog!'
You wave your arm in a wide arc, sending projectiles of pure mana for Beltantis.
Your magic missile grazes Beltantis.
Your magic missile injures Beltantis.
Your magic missile injures Beltantis.
Beltantis parries your whip.
Beltantis parries your whip.
Your shield blocks Beltantis's searing cut.
Beltantis's searing cut MASSACRES you!
Beltantis <3/7> <-- Note health (wrong)

<60%hp 41%m 33%mv 11998tnl> lash beltantis

An air elemental has arrived.
Beltantis yells 'Help! I'm being attacked by an air elemental!'
A monstrous mors-gravis demon has arrived.
Beltantis yells 'Help! I'm being attacked by a monstrous mors-gravis demon!'
A monstrous mors-gravis demon's beating MUTILATES Beltantis!
A monstrous mors-gravis demon's beating EVISCERATES Beltantis! <- two hits
Beltantis <2/7>


<60%hp 41%m 33%mv 11998tnl>
Beltantis brings his a Crusader's Sword up and across at you!
Beltantis's strike of faith EVISCERATES you!
Completing his upper slash, Beltantis steps forward and brings his a Crusader's Sword down in an opposite arc towards you!
Beltantis's strike of purity MASSACRES you!
Beltantis <2/7>


<28%hp 41%m 33%mv 11998tnl>
A monstrous mors-gravis demon's beating MUTILATES Beltantis! <- 1 hit
Beltantis parries your whip.
Beltantis's searing cut MASSACRES you!
You sure are BLEEDING!
Your shield blocks Beltantis's searing cut.
Beltantis's searing cut DISMEMBERS you!
You have been KILLED!!

You have died, but the Carrion Fields are not finished with you yet!
Your soul is returned to the realms in the form of a ghost.
You will return to your corporeal state in a short while.
Be careful, for even a ghost should fear some dangers!



If the only point of evil conjurers in this day and age is
to nightgaunt, stop reading here.

If evil conjureres are meant to compete in PK fights soon
after they get demons.. then something is wrong.

I honestly can't believe anyone is pkilling with these midrank.
I don't understand why evil servitors are such pieces of crap
that people (STILL) laugh at. I have ####ing SEEN angels hit
harder! People are scared of angels. How many players have to
naysay evil conjies before something substantial is done to
bring this class on par with the good side?

Forget about what strategy and opinions. Here is the issue:

I looked back at the logs that this paladin generously posted,
and realized that the paladin did not shield block or parry the
demon. The demon made 1 attack in that last round. This is the
issue.

Here is a cut & paste of the last round from the paladin's perspective.
*PS* I would like to point out that this paladin is great IC and OOC. Much respect *PS*

You parry an air elemental's blast. <-- 1 attack
A monstrous mors-gravis demon's beating MUTILATES you! <-- 1 attack
You sure are BLEEDING!
You parry Conjurer's whip.
Your searing cut MASSACRES Conjurer!
Conjurer deflects your searing cut with his shield.
Your searing cut DISMEMBERS Conjurer!
Conjurer is DEAD!!
Conjurer splatters blood on your armor.
An air elemental vanishes, its binding broken.
A monstrous mors-gravis demon vanishes, its binding broken.

Forget the elemental. 1 attack per round from a 30+ demon is
a problem. What is causing this? Is this the gangbanging
code.. Or are demons capable of randomly doing only 1 hit per
round?

Either way, I think I have identified a problem that needs a more
substantial answer.

Going back to the gang-banging question, I would like to make ask the
question more explicitely. When 1 conjurer + 2 servitors attacks a guy,
is that considered a gangbang in the context of the gang-bang code?

If it does:
Valg said that a warrior suffers more from the gangbang code then
conjurers... I am not sure how this is possible if the gang
bang code ends up always applying to a solo conjurer with servitors.
Solo warriors are not affected by gang bang code.

I have a sneaking suspicion that this might of been overlooked,
based on the responses and the announcements.

The paladin was a lucky ducky. Servitors tend to do 1-3 attacks
normally. (did some research with logs).




I would still like to know if gang-banging rules apply against a conjurer 1 vs (1 & servitors).

Important highlights:

The currently effected skills are: Bash, Trip, Cranial, and Pincer. The effected spell is Pebble to Boulder. We may refine this list in the future.

Also, Throw and Ambush work less well if the target is fighting someone other than you.

This has nothing to do with a shifter or demon not hitting something. If your demon misses a Bash, then you can blame that code update. I don't know why people are attributing other junk to that code update, but the wild speculation needs to go.

valguarnera@carrionfields.com

I wasn't asking about # of attacks. I wanted to know if a conjurer + 2 servitors was considered a gangbang.

PS: the attacks thing came from that shifter dude down below.

I know you think the whole of conjurer strategy is in getting the "best" servitor and letting it do all the work, but you're wrong. It was within you capability to win this fight even with this exact setup, and you didn't.

Actually, you're wrong about a lot of things, but let's not get into that. Short reason, just because you can't win with an evil conjurer doesn't mean an evil conjurer can't win.

You'll find that in general the staff of CF is resistant to naysaying, especially when a lot of that naysaying comes from one person pretending to be many.

I honestly can't believe anyone is pkilling with these midrank.


You're wrong. More skilled players are. I can think of several recent examples who were well above the 50% mark at the mid-ranks.

I'd be more inclined to give a more detailed answer if I didn't think it would just start one of your trademark endless, uninformed rants. And I thought we agreed those were going to go away.

valguarnera@carrionfields.com

Landing both strikes can be quite unreliable in pk. That's how close it was.

Also, you may have been wearing a lot of +hp gear, but you weren't using any other protections as far as I can tell.

At your level, as an evil conjie, there are a number of protections readily available to you, including haste and protection. Had you used a weapon that parries better than a whip you would have forced the paladin to retreat at the least.

That wasn't a class mismatch. That was the paladin getting "lucky". However, he only lived long enough to "get lucky" because he did pretty much everything right.

PS: Two handed dedicants can tank well too.

I was the paladin in question.

Those yells weren't me sitting there and duking it out with the demon...the demon was moving towards you so it didn't engage me for more then a hit here or there (I was also spamming flee).

I have (near) perfected parry and protection vs evil and wield a 2h weapon so I parry relatively well (not flawless, but decent), this and I never engaged the demon for more then a round...I also can heal myself.

You were wielding a whip, which parries poorly and likewise, I got lucky.

That being said, it was extremely close. Even with your +hp gear, you didn't have a ton of hp. Considering how fast you dropped from 77% to 0 I'd say you had roughly 400-500 hp. If you'd have used any preps at all, you would've killed me easily. If I hadn't have hit the strike of purity, you would've killed me. If I'd have wrathed instead of doing the strike...well you get the idea.

There's no such thing as an 'easy win'.

But I was at 23 when that fight happened, 500ish xp tnl. I hit 24 and logged out, as I had planned to do regardless of that fight or not.

Just wanna tell ya that you hit the nail on the head. This was extreme luck on your side =)

After I overanalyzed this, checked logs.. I realized that everything
went right for you =)

If I had to do it again, I'd probably go with the same strategy, minus me attacking you last.

see you on the fields.

Why not take luck out. Instead of that last magic missile, have your air elemental shockwave, THEN magic missile (or lash if you must). That way the elemental is eating those first few strikes instead of you.

Because most people spam either an attack, or move when you enter the room with them.

The elemental requires about 2-10 real life seconds to enter the room. In that time, he was likely to do something.

He was on the run, I was trying to finish up the job. I had no idea he was so healthy.

This may be one of the most well-thought posts I've seen on how a pk situation goes down. For anyone out there who can't figure out what they're doing wrong (or right) in a pk situation, read the above post (I know there are others lurking around on the forum as well)...and try to think like this. No, I don't mean number crunch (whip+demon+hp gear/2handed+parry+prot= I win!...that's bad thinking, bad, bad!)...but rather take everything into account, and figure strategy from there.

I point this out only because many years ago Senor Nepenthe, and Papa Cador tried to move me into seeing pk situations in this mindset. Since in a pk situation, it's not what did I do better than the other guy....it's generally, what did he do worse than me.

I know, some of you have to be thinking "*gasp*!! Shokai, giving pk tips?!?!"....it's early, and I'm procrastinating going into work, I had to do something.