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ValguarneraWed 22-Aug-07 07:23 AM
Member since 04th Mar 2003
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#1368, "RE: Mathematics"


          

That's actually one of the primary reasons I've pursued mathematics as my field of interest. I love science, but that tiny nagging "maybe" is always there. Mathematics attempts to be more "absolute" in the fact that we define our assumptions, and from there develop our facts, principles, and proofs.

Not sure if you've read any Popper, Kuhn, etc., but there's no reason to place mathematics 'outside' of the sciences, other than their degree of certainty is probabilistically higher. There have been a number of times in history when mathematical proofs have been incorrect because the prover could not account for all possible situations, due to an incomplete understanding of scope, etc.

It's less fallible than, say, even quantum mechanics (*), but certainly not infallible, and not a distinct group. Nonetheless, I would support you in laughing at anyone who asks if you "believe in Gödel's incompleteness theorem". (As an aside, if you're interested in both math and evolution, check out I Am a Strange Loop by Douglas Hofstadter.)

valguarnera@carrionfields.com

(*): I pick this because it's amazing how well quantum mechanics has done, given its relatively non-intuitive laws. They've made predictions based on theory where it took decades to build the equipment needed to make the measurement (thinking of the electron magnetic moment), and the predictions worked to better than 1 in 1012, with the error more likely to be in the equipment.

  

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HOT TopicAbout evolution [View all] , Nightgaunt_, Mon 20-Aug-07 09:43 AM
Reply Final thoughts., Eskelian, 22-Aug-07 08:25 AM, #72
Reply RE: Final thoughts., Nightgaunt_, 22-Aug-07 12:30 PM, #76
Reply RE: Final thoughts., Eskelian, 22-Aug-07 01:00 PM, #78
     Reply I've got to tell you:, Daevryn, 22-Aug-07 01:16 PM, #79
     Reply RE: I've got to tell you:, Eskelian, 22-Aug-07 01:22 PM, #80
          Reply RE: I've got to tell you:, Tac, 22-Aug-07 01:37 PM, #83
          Reply RE: I've got to tell you:, Valguarnera, 22-Aug-07 03:06 PM, #86
          Reply RE: I've got to tell you:, Eskelian, 22-Aug-07 09:51 PM, #90
               Reply Actually, Nightgaunt_, 23-Aug-07 01:49 AM, #93
               Reply RE: Actually, Eskelian, 23-Aug-07 08:17 AM, #99
                    Reply RE: Actually, Nightgaunt_, 23-Aug-07 09:42 AM, #104
               Reply RE: I've got to tell you:, Valguarnera, 23-Aug-07 07:25 AM, #95
          Reply RE: I've got to tell you:, Eskelian, 22-Aug-07 09:44 PM, #89
               Reply RE: I've got to tell you:, Nightgaunt_, 23-Aug-07 09:50 AM, #105
          Reply RE: I've got to tell you:, Daevryn, 22-Aug-07 03:16 PM, #87
          Reply RE: I've got to tell you:, Eskelian, 22-Aug-07 09:40 PM, #88
               Reply RE: I've got to tell you:, Daevryn, 22-Aug-07 11:04 PM, #92
                    Reply RE: I've got to tell you:, Eskelian, 23-Aug-07 08:01 AM, #97
                         Reply RE: I've got to tell you:, Daevryn, 23-Aug-07 08:11 AM, #98
                         Reply RE: I've got to tell you:, Eskelian, 23-Aug-07 08:25 AM, #100
                              Reply RE: I've got to tell you:, Daevryn, 23-Aug-07 08:52 AM, #101
                              Reply If you read something you believe to be true, Leprechaun, 23-Aug-07 09:11 AM, #102
                         Reply RE: Book Larnin, Valguarnera, 23-Aug-07 09:12 AM, #103
                              Reply RE: Book Larnin, Eskelian, 23-Aug-07 01:18 PM, #106
                                   Reply RE: Book Larnin, Valguarnera, 23-Aug-07 02:03 PM, #107
                                        Reply RE: Book Larnin, Eskelian, 03-Sep-07 03:09 PM, #112
          Reply Water is wet ..., Leprechaun, 23-Aug-07 03:18 AM, #94
     Reply RE: Final thoughts., Nightgaunt_, 22-Aug-07 01:23 PM, #81
          Reply RE: Final thoughts., Eskelian, 22-Aug-07 01:32 PM, #82
               Reply RE: Final thoughts., Nightgaunt_, 22-Aug-07 01:48 PM, #84
Reply The problematic of the issue, DurNominator, 26-Aug-07 10:18 PM, #108
Reply I feel that this is on topic, DurNominator, 12-Sep-07 04:10 PM, #117
Reply RE: About evolution, Tac, 20-Aug-07 04:52 PM, #9
Reply RE: About evolution, Daevryn, 20-Aug-07 10:02 PM, #13
     Reply RE: About evolution, Eskelian, 21-Aug-07 08:47 AM, #18
          Reply RE: About evolution, Nightgaunt_, 21-Aug-07 09:02 AM, #21
          Reply RE: About evolution, Eskelian, 21-Aug-07 09:06 AM, #23
               Reply And the bottom line..., Eskelian, 21-Aug-07 09:16 AM, #25
               Reply RE: And the bottom line..., Valguarnera, 21-Aug-07 12:31 PM, #44
                    Reply RE: And the bottom line..., Eskelian, 21-Aug-07 12:37 PM, #47
                         Reply Silly?, GinGa, 22-Aug-07 08:47 AM, #73
               Reply Sorta side-track, but ..., Leprechaun, 21-Aug-07 10:10 AM, #29
          Reply RE: About evolution, Daevryn, 21-Aug-07 09:38 AM, #28
Reply RE: About evolution, Isildur, 20-Aug-07 11:25 AM, #4
Reply RE: About evolution, Nightgaunt_, 20-Aug-07 01:29 PM, #6
     Reply RE: About evolution, Isildur, 20-Aug-07 05:11 PM, #10
          Reply RE: About evolution, Nightgaunt_, 21-Aug-07 08:54 AM, #20
               Reply RE: About evolution, Isildur, 21-Aug-07 11:03 AM, #38
                    Reply Do you consider it possible to prove God exits?, Tac, 21-Aug-07 11:53 AM, #40
                         Reply RE: Do you consider it possible to prove God exits?, Eskelian, 21-Aug-07 12:31 PM, #43
                         Reply RE: Do you consider it possible to prove God exits?, Tac, 21-Aug-07 12:33 PM, #45
                              Reply RE: Do you consider it possible to prove God exits?, Eskelian, 21-Aug-07 12:38 PM, #48
                                   Reply Seriously?, Tac, 21-Aug-07 12:50 PM, #53
                                        Reply RE: Seriously?, Eskelian, 21-Aug-07 01:12 PM, #56
                                             Reply RE: Seriously?, Tac, 21-Aug-07 02:09 PM, #58
                                                  Reply RE: Seriously?, Eskelian, 22-Aug-07 08:49 AM, #74
                         Reply RE: Do you consider it possible to prove God exits?, Isildur, 21-Aug-07 03:26 PM, #61
Reply Yes, very much so, Leprechaun, 20-Aug-07 10:11 AM, #2
Reply RE: Mutation rates, Valguarnera, 20-Aug-07 10:43 AM, #3
     Reply Hey cool, thanks for the info nt, Leprechaun, 20-Aug-07 12:10 PM, #5
     Reply On the subject of mutation: Cancer, Leprechaun, 21-Aug-07 06:54 AM, #15
          Reply RE: On the subject of mutation: Cancer, Valguarnera, 21-Aug-07 12:40 PM, #49
               Reply A small addition, GinGa, 22-Aug-07 10:12 AM, #75
Reply RE: About evolution, Valguarnera, 20-Aug-07 10:02 AM, #1
     Reply RE: About evolution, Eskelian, 20-Aug-07 03:49 PM, #7
          Reply RE: About evolution, Nightgaunt_, 20-Aug-07 04:10 PM, #8
          Reply RE: About evolution, Eskelian, 21-Aug-07 08:43 AM, #17
          Reply RE: Irreducible complexity, Valguarnera, 20-Aug-07 08:50 PM, #11
          Reply RE: Irreducible complexity, Eskelian, 21-Aug-07 08:37 AM, #16
               Reply About random, Nightgaunt_, 21-Aug-07 08:52 AM, #19
                    Reply RE: About random, Eskelian, 21-Aug-07 09:20 AM, #24
                         Reply RE: About random, Nightgaunt_, 21-Aug-07 09:22 AM, #26
                              Reply RE: About random, Eskelian, 21-Aug-07 09:29 AM, #27
                                   Reply RE: About random, Nightgaunt_, 21-Aug-07 09:45 AM, #30
          Reply RE: About evolution, Daevryn, 20-Aug-07 09:49 PM, #12
               Reply Basically any theory is valid unless proven to be incor..., Leprechaun, 21-Aug-07 05:19 AM, #14
               Reply RE: Basically any theory is valid unless proven to be i..., Eskelian, 21-Aug-07 09:03 AM, #22
                    Reply RE: Basically any theory is valid unless proven to be i..., Valguarnera, 21-Aug-07 09:50 AM, #31
                         Reply RE: Basically any theory is valid unless proven to be i..., Eskelian, 21-Aug-07 10:26 AM, #32
                         Reply RE: Basically any theory is valid unless proven to be i..., Nightgaunt_, 21-Aug-07 10:18 AM, #33
                         Reply RE: Basically any theory is valid unless proven to be i..., Eskelian, 21-Aug-07 10:29 AM, #34
                              Reply RE: Basically any theory is valid unless proven to be i..., Nightgaunt_, 21-Aug-07 10:39 AM, #36
                                   Reply RE: Basically any theory is valid unless proven to be i..., Eskelian, 21-Aug-07 10:47 AM, #37
                         Reply RE: Basically any theory is valid unless proven to be i..., Valguarnera, 21-Aug-07 12:22 PM, #42
                              Reply RE: Basically any theory is valid unless proven to be i..., Eskelian, 21-Aug-07 12:35 PM, #46
                                   Reply RE: Basically any theory is valid unless proven to be i..., Valguarnera, 21-Aug-07 12:41 PM, #50
                                   Reply RE: Basically any theory is valid unless proven to be i..., Eskelian, 21-Aug-07 12:44 PM, #51
                                        Reply RE: Basically any theory is valid unless proven to be i..., Valguarnera, 21-Aug-07 12:47 PM, #52
                                             Reply RE: Basically any theory is valid unless proven to be i..., Eskelian, 21-Aug-07 12:51 PM, #54
                                                  Reply RE: Solipsism:, Valguarnera, 21-Aug-07 02:13 PM, #59
                                                       Reply RE: Solipsism:, Eskelian, 21-Aug-07 05:02 PM, #63
                                                            Reply RE: Solipsism:, Valguarnera, 22-Aug-07 07:43 AM, #68
                                   Reply RE: Basically any theory is valid unless proven to be i..., Daevryn, 21-Aug-07 01:10 PM, #55
                                        Reply RE: Basically any theory is valid unless proven to be i..., Eskelian, 21-Aug-07 01:34 PM, #57
                                             Reply RE: Basically any theory is valid unless proven to be i..., Nightgaunt_, 21-Aug-07 02:14 PM, #60
                                                  Reply RE: Basically any theory is valid unless proven to be i..., Eskelian, 21-Aug-07 04:57 PM, #62
                                                       Reply RE: Basically any theory is valid unless proven to be i..., Nightgaunt_, 22-Aug-07 04:22 AM, #65
                                                            Reply RE: Observables, Valguarnera, 22-Aug-07 07:35 AM, #67
                                                            Reply RE: Observables, Eskelian, 22-Aug-07 08:06 AM, #70
                                                                 Reply RE: Observables, Valguarnera, 22-Aug-07 08:14 AM, #71
                                                                      Reply RE: Observables, Eskelian, 22-Aug-07 12:49 PM, #77
                                                                           Reply RE: Observables, Valguarnera, 22-Aug-07 02:57 PM, #85
                                                                           Reply RE: Observables, Eskelian, 22-Aug-07 10:27 PM, #91
                                                                           Reply RE: Observables, Valguarnera, 23-Aug-07 07:24 AM, #96
                                                                           Reply RE: Observables, DurNominator, 27-Aug-07 12:33 AM, #110
                                                                           Reply RE: Observables, Eskelian, 27-Aug-07 10:32 AM, #111
                                                                           Reply Then don't, DurNominator, 03-Sep-07 03:42 PM, #113
                                                                           Reply RE: Then don't, Eskelian, 03-Sep-07 10:10 PM, #114
                                                                           Reply Re: Trolling, Daevryn, 03-Sep-07 10:41 PM, #115
                                                                           Reply RE: Re: Trolling, Tac, 04-Sep-07 08:34 AM, #116
                                                                           Reply RE: Re: Trolling, Eskelian, 18-Sep-07 10:14 PM, #118
                                                                           Reply RE: Observables, DurNominator, 26-Aug-07 11:46 PM, #109
                                                            Reply RE: Basically any theory is valid unless proven to be i..., Eskelian, 22-Aug-07 08:00 AM, #69
                         Reply Sure but txt, Larcat, 21-Aug-07 10:39 AM, #35
                              Reply RE: Sure but txt, Tac, 21-Aug-07 11:50 AM, #39
                              Reply RE: Sure but txt, Valguarnera, 21-Aug-07 12:03 PM, #41
               Reply RE: About evolution, Straklaw, 22-Aug-07 03:33 AM, #64
                    Reply RE: Mathematics, Valguarnera, 22-Aug-07 07:23 AM #66
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